Using 2000w 110 inverter on vehicle to charge midenite diy (srne)

[kchortu]

I'm looking at adding an inverter to use with a 200a alternator on my Silverado. I was thinking why not run a twist lock 110 extension cord to the mains input side of my midnight solar diy2430 (which is a srne clone). My question is would a modified sine wave work or just spend a bit more for a pure sine wave inverter? Long long term I want to make a BYD blade lifepo4 battery for the truck but I will start with the 200a alternator and inverter. Any advice or things I'm not thinking of any similar builds you can point me to?

 

[WorldwideDave]

so you want to go from silverado's battery, which is being charged from its 200A alternator, to a fuse and an inverter connected up to it, which has an A/C output on it. From the inverter on the truck side you want to run an extension cord over to the grid input side on a SRNE inverter. Without getting into bonding, earthing/grounding, and whatever a 'bud blade battery' is, I'd say what you're doing is possible, but not sure that the SRNE inverter is going to like the sh*tty modified sine wave. I think higher end inverters try to match the frequency or waveform and if it's garbage the device may ahve trouble matching it. Did you mean to say "Deye" inverter, or ?
Do you have batteries connected to the inverter as well? Would using a DC to DC charger (like Victron Orion XS 12/12 50A) be a better way to somehow go (not sure if possible)?
Help us understand - begin with end in mind - why adding A/C input to your inverter, just to charge?

 

[HarryN]

There are zero cases where a modified sine wave inverter makes sense.

The only reason to buy one, is if you don't know any better, and plan to replace it within a few months after it damages some of your other equipment.

 

[brainbone]

You want to use a DC to DC charge controller, not an inverter (especially not a modified sine wave inverter) for this kind of thing. Assuming your alternator is 12v and the battery bank used for your inverter is 24v (diy2430 is 24v, right?) then you'd want a 12v to 24v DC to DC boost charge controller.

 

[50ShadesOfDirt]

Most AIO's are picky about the AC power in ... they usually specify less than 5% THD on the power source (examples of which are an Inverter-Gen, or a wgen11500tfc open-frame gen, both of which put out 5% or less of THD). Didn't understand your DIY inverter, but if it is based on a clone of something, then perhaps read the manual on the "something", and see how picky it was about incoming power quality.

Absolutely no problem using an inverter on your truck when camping or whatnot, perhaps to power a coffeepot or such. In these cases, it still makes sense to use a pure sine wave inverter, vs a "truck stop" like PWM inverter. Either one produces "power", but the quality of power goes way up with the pure sine wave version ...

Hope this helps ...

 

[kchortu]

so you want to go from silverado's battery, which is being charged from its 200A alternator, to a fuse and an inverter connected up to it, which has an A/C output on it. From the inverter on the truck side you want to run an extension cord over to the grid input side on a SRNE inverter. Without getting into bonding, earthing/grounding, and whatever a 'bud blade battery' is, I'd say what you're doing is possible, but not sure that the SRNE inverter is going to like the sh*tty modified sine wave. I think higher end inverters try to match the frequency or waveform and if it's garbage the device may ahve trouble matching it. Did you mean to say "Deye" inverter, or ?
Do you have batteries connected to the inverter as well? Would using a DC to DC charger (like Victron Orion XS 12/12 50A) be a better way to somehow go (not sure if possible)?
Help us understand - begin with end in mind - why adding A/C input to your inverter, just to

yeah the trailer has 24v system and honestly I do understand dc to dc is more efficient but do the math I can charge 40a off 110 (960w) a victorn 12 to 24 15 a is 250 and the redarc dc to dc are in the high $500s and you will need some Big cables to run the length of the truck and trailer. Not to mention the a dc to dc charger only works with well charging the inverter can act as a stand alone power supply in emergencies or to run power with out dragging the trailer along. I am un concerned about the earthing as the truck and trailer are bonded in so many ways.

 

[kchortu]

You want to use a DC to DC charge controller, not an inverter (especially not a modified sine wave inverter) for this kind of thing. Assuming your alternator is 12v and the battery bank used for your inverter is 24v (diy2430 is 24v, right?) then you'd want a 12v to 24v DC to DC boost charge controller.

I am aware of dc to dc charging and no it is not the optimum solution, most are limited to about 360w where I can charge at a 960w with a 110 source. Not to mention an inverter can power things itself and a dc to dc well only charges batteries most of the 24v ones are $250 on the low end and $600 for a high end redarc. You can get a really nice transformer based inverter for $600. Not to mention the cost of cabling a dc system vs the 110 ac system. I admit its a bit janky and not elegant but I think once you get into 10kw batter banks the 15-20 amps that dc to dc can provide is cute. I am running 16kw so thats the difference between 44 hours of engine time to recharge vs 16h to max out the charge rate from the mains side of the AIO

 

[kchortu]

There are zero cases where a modified sine wave inverter makes sense.

The only reason to buy one, is if you don't know any better, and plan to replace it within a few months after it damages some of your other equipment.

you are right

 

[brainbone]

I admit its a bit janky and not elegant but I think once you get into 10kw batter banks the 15-20 amps that dc to dc can provide is cute.

You can probably still pick up 20A 12v to 29.2v dc to dc chargers for around $120 to $150, and can parallel them to get more, providing around 580w charging each... but, yeah, DC cabling will add up.

I think the charge controller in your diy2430 is 40a, right? So around 1100w? (assuming 29.2v charge @ 40a) And I don't believe the diy2430 has power assist, so if you're feeding it with a 1500w inverter, that's all you get for all appliances and your 40a charger controller, should you want to charge and be able to use an appliance for a quick bit while doing so. (With inefficiencies in inversion and charge controller, you'll probably be pulling something like 110a+ from your alternator just while charging, so hopefully it can provide that at idle. A 2000w inverter seems a bit too high, since alternators rarely put out the claimed amps at idle.)

 

[WorldwideDave]

lots of posts about frying alternators with high amp draw inverters, too.
There is another youtuber out there - explororist life - he has some recent videos about installing a DC to DC charger from a 5th wheel or pickup to a trailer. Suggest you watch that 30 min video.

 

[HarryN]

yeah the trailer has 24v system and honestly I do understand dc to dc is more efficient but do the math I can charge 40a off 110 (960w) a victorn 12 to 24 15 a is 250 and the redarc dc to dc are in the high $500s and you will need some Big cables to run the length of the truck and trailer. Not to mention the a dc to dc charger only works with well charging the inverter can act as a stand alone power supply in emergencies or to run power with out dragging the trailer along. I am un concerned about the earthing as the truck and trailer are bonded in so many ways.

It is a great way to do that charging, just keep in mind that you only have perhaps

( 50 or 60 amps) x ( 12 volt ) ~ 600 - 700 watts

available under all driving conditions unless you add a second starter battery to buffer when the engine rpm is low.

So this limits the charger size in the trailer.

A 200 amp alternator is going to feed a fair amount to just running the truck itself, fans, blowers, lights, electronics.

Plus they only produce the full power when the rpm is at least 1000 engine rpm.

 

[kchortu]

It is a great way to do that charging, just keep in mind that you only have perhaps

( 50 or 60 amps) x ( 12 volt ) ~ 600 - 700 watts

available under all driving conditions unless you add a second starter battery to buffer when the engine rpm is low.

So this limits the charger size in the trailer.

A 200 amp alternator is going to feed a fair amount to just running the truck itself, fans, blowers, lights, electronics.

Plus they only produce the full power when the rpm is at least 1000 engine rpm.

diesels have 2 batteries and are designed to have a limited rpm range anyway so the alternators are designed to have that out put near 2000rpm and when under highway speed you are usually hovering around 1750 the base alternator is 150 but a 200 was an option. So yeah I get what you are saying and it is still 2x what a dc to dc can do

 

[kchortu]

You can probably still pick up 20A 12v to 29.2v dc to dc chargers for around $120 to $150, and can parallel them to get more, providing around 580w charging each... but, yeah, DC cabling will add up.

I think the charge controller in your diy2430 is 40a, right? So around 1100w? (assuming 29.2v charge @ 40a) And I don't believe the diy2430 has power assist, so if you're feeding it with a 1500w inverter, that's all you get for all appliances and your 40a charger controller, should you want to charge and be able to use an appliance for a quick bit while doing so. (With inefficiencies in inversion and charge controller, you'll probably be pulling something like 110a+ from your alternator just while charging, so hopefully it can provide that at idle. A 2000w inverter seems a bit too high, since alternators rarely put out the claimed amps at idle.)

Yeah its a 40a, and I can set the max charging from ac to lower the idea of the 2k was to cover power overhead when doing stuff without the trailer. But yeah 1500 would be the ideal size just for trailer charging they are just less common

 

[kchortu]

lots of posts about frying alternators with high amp draw inverters, too.
There is another youtuber out there - explororist life - he has some recent videos about installing a DC to DC charger from a 5th wheel or pickup to a trailer. Suggest you watch that 30 min video.

I have watched a bunch of his stuff, he is just a Victron salesman.

 

[WorldwideDave]

I have watched a bunch of his stuff, he is just a Victron salesman.

the concepts are the same regardless of what brand you go with. And he is not 'just a victron salesman' wow that's harsh.
Yes he does recommend and sell Victron gear. I assure you that it is not just because he makes a paltry margin of the gear. Super low Idle consumption, quality support, and a company that has been around in the RV/Marine/Off Grid/Industrial/Mobility space for 50 years is not a bad company to sell gear from. I like my Outback gear, but the idle consumption has proved to be too much and I am switching to victron exclusively. But you do you. I like Nate and Steph and find their videos educational, even if I don't buy/need anything from him at this time. He has done a lot for the RV community and has earned my respect.
Same with Will here on this forum. Some have said he is a shill for various companies over the years, but he cares so much about the viewer that he is unwilling to be loyal to any one brand. But look at his reviews of Victron...he calls it the very best there is that money can buy, says its expensive, but you can't go wrong with it. I wouldn't call will a Victron salesman, however...or a SolArk or EG4 or MPP or EPEVER or any other brand he has recommended over the past 7 years. He's just super informative and has earned my respect. And almost a million other followers, too.

 

[0truck0]

Agree, never buy a modified inverter again. Those are of the past, as past as 110v (is 120 now).
Some things are fine on a modified inv, but some things will be ruined in 1 second. Just buy a pure sin wave one.

I would not run 120v AC over the vehicle while driving, is so much more dangerous than 12v, and so much can go wrong while driving or crashing. It is dangerous enough while parked.

The grounding and bonding of a/c is complicated and there still is a lot of debate/arguments/opinions on how to safely do it.

IDK anything about the brand names you mentioned, sorry.

As stated, you will ruin your alternator. Unless you have a 100% duty cycle 200 amp alternator you will ruin it. You would have paid big big bucks for 100% dutycycle one ad would know by now.

Alternators are meant to run at high load for a very short duration while the starting battery is bulk charged for a few mins from the depletion of the cranking, not to operate an RV. The the alt puts out a fraction of its rated power to keep the battery topped off (run the vehicle). You can run alternator at high output until it no longer puts out and then you find out the hard way....

 

[Backyard]

Does your truck have a second alternator location available? Maybe look into adding a 24v alternator. I know this doesn't solve the large cable problem. But might be a better route in the end

Convenience of an onboard 120v inverter is hard to beat. It will have more uses then charging your house battery

 

[WorldwideDave]

Over $700 for a high quality alternator.

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I'm sure you can find a cheaper knock-off.