What direction would you go for my stationary camper solar setup?

[gtluke]

I've been pondering this for about a month now and I can't quote decide what direction to go.
I need to upgrade the solar setup at my camp. My camp consists of a shipping container and a 5th wheel camper. I don't drive the camper, it just stays there year round. I use my camp probably every other weekend spring through fall.

Currently I have a 12v 100ah lifepo4 battery in my old 5th wheel, and 200w of solar panels and a pwm charger. I have one 1500w inverter feeding one of the 120v outlet strings (disconnected from the breaker panel, connected to the inverter)
This has gotten me by for the last year or two, it works okay, I do have to use the generator occasionally. Everything I normally use in the camper is 12v/propane anyway. I run the generator for the rare times I use a/c or microwave.

I have the exact same setup in the shipping container which is used as a workshop/garage. I just use 12v lights and RV equipment for water/heater.

HOWEVER
I just upgraded my camper big time (getting the toddler out of our bed)
This newer/bigger camper will use a lot more power as there's like 4x as many lights and the 12v/propane heater/blower is huge and it's got a large TV and finding/modifying large TVs for 12v power isn't really possible anymore as nobody sells TVs with a wall-wart power supply I can rig up to 12v with step ups. I would also LOVE to just power the fridge off solar/120v power all season long (2.5amp 120vac)

I recently purchased four of:
Aptos Solar 440W Solar Panel 120 Cell Bifacial DNA-120-BF10-440W solar panels
As well as four of: cheap dumfume 12v 100ah lifepo4 batteries.

I was going to rig up a similar system for the new camper but just using the much bigger solar panels, an MPPT charger, and the four batteries in parallel. This would require me to tear apart the camper and rig in at least 2 possibly 3 12v inverters to the appropriate breaker circuits. Plus I should add one to the container garage.
This is all annoying and kinda half-assed and rigged up. Not ideal.

SOOOOO why not just switch to a 48v all in one in the container, and just plug my camper cord into it? I'd leave the 12v camper and garage batteries in place and switch to b-b chargers or cheap mppt to charge the 12v system from the 48v. Seems more efficient and cheaper than 120v-12v chargers. The camper has a charger but it's for lead-acid so I'd have to disconnect that.

So now my question, is this a good idea? If so:
what all in one would you use? The 6000xp would be great, I could use the split phase to run my welder if I needed, bonus.
One hangup is my generator is only 120v. It is a 3% inverter generator so the power is clean enough. Though the 6000xp with a single pole generator gets a little weird/limited. I haven't found anyone talking about actually doing this but the firmware update this year says you can do it, but it drops out the 2nd pole when doing this I believe.
Or I was looking at this one: https://watts247.com/product/h6548s...nverter-2-x-4kw-250v-mppt-inputs-great-price/
Cheaper but single pole only, will I be able to find a matching unit in a few years if I decide to upgrade to split phase? hmmm.

My concerns about the AIO option is my 4 solar panels being only ~160v open circuit and in upstate ny mountains cloud cover almost always there. Will I be okay with this? And then the generator input, I'd still probably need the generator to run the a/c

Now the batteries, I have those 4 dumfume 12v 100ah batteries. I could series them and use a balancer for the 48v system. They cost me like $400. Or I could sell them off and buy a 48v server rack battery. But man they're double the price at least of the 4 of 12v batteries. Though it does seem much cleaner and easier to deal with and come with breakers and communications and such. Thoughts?

And lastly, it would be a sweet bonus if I could use bright days and the hours before I depart camp to use this system to charge my tesla. I come up about 10-60 miles short depending on the season of doing the round trip to home so I have to charge for 5 min on the way home at a supercharger. Annoying but not the end of the world. But it would be damn cool to be able to add some juice from pure solar at camp.

Thanks everyone who actually read this whole mess and has some suggestions.

 

[gtluke]

Here's a photo of my setup just for fun. The camper door faces due south, so the solar setup will go on top of the left side container as it has the best spot for the most sun and where the smaller solar panels are now. The right side container is the workshop.
mind the mess, first day of the season and purging and cleaning..

 

[CommandoJoe]

I've been pondering this for about a month now and I can't quote decide what direction to go.
I need to upgrade the solar setup at my camp. My camp consists of a shipping container and a 5th wheel camper. I don't drive the camper, it just stays there year round. I use my camp probably every other weekend spring through fall.

Currently I have a 12v 100ah lifepo4 battery in my old 5th wheel, and 200w of solar panels and a pwm charger. I have one 1500w inverter feeding one of the 120v outlet strings (disconnected from the breaker panel, connected to the inverter)
This has gotten me by for the last year or two, it works okay, I do have to use the generator occasionally. Everything I normally use in the camper is 12v/propane anyway. I run the generator for the rare times I use a/c or microwave.

I have the exact same setup in the shipping container which is used as a workshop/garage. I just use 12v lights and RV equipment for water/heater.

HOWEVER
I just upgraded my camper big time (getting the toddler out of our bed)
This newer/bigger camper will use a lot more power as there's like 4x as many lights and the 12v/propane heater/blower is huge and it's got a large TV and finding/modifying large TVs for 12v power isn't really possible anymore as nobody sells TVs with a wall-wart power supply I can rig up to 12v with step ups. I would also LOVE to just power the fridge off solar/120v power all season long (2.5amp 120vac)

I recently purchased four of:
Aptos Solar 440W Solar Panel 120 Cell Bifacial DNA-120-BF10-440W solar panels
As well as four of: cheap dumfume 12v 100ah lifepo4 batteries.

I was going to rig up a similar system for the new camper but just using the much bigger solar panels, an MPPT charger, and the four batteries in parallel. This would require me to tear apart the camper and rig in at least 2 possibly 3 12v inverters to the appropriate breaker circuits. Plus I should add one to the container garage.
This is all annoying and kinda half-assed and rigged up. Not ideal.

SOOOOO why not just switch to a 48v all in one in the container, and just plug my camper cord into it? I'd leave the 12v camper and garage batteries in place and switch to b-b chargers or cheap mppt to charge the 12v system from the 48v. Seems more efficient and cheaper than 120v-12v chargers. The camper has a charger but it's for lead-acid so I'd have to disconnect that.

So now my question, is this a good idea? If so:
what all in one would you use? The 6000xp would be great, I could use the split phase to run my welder if I needed, bonus.
One hangup is my generator is only 120v. It is a 3% inverter generator so the power is clean enough. Though the 6000xp with a single pole generator gets a little weird/limited. I haven't found anyone talking about actually doing this but the firmware update this year says you can do it, but it drops out the 2nd pole when doing this I believe.
Or I was looking at this one: https://watts247.com/product/h6548s...nverter-2-x-4kw-250v-mppt-inputs-great-price/
Cheaper but single pole only, will I be able to find a matching unit in a few years if I decide to upgrade to split phase? hmmm.

My concerns about the AIO option is my 4 solar panels being only ~160v open circuit and in upstate ny mountains cloud cover almost always there. Will I be okay with this? And then the generator input, I'd still probably need the generator to run the a/c

Now the batteries, I have those 4 dumfume 12v 100ah batteries. I could series them and use a balancer for the 48v system. They cost me like $400. Or I could sell them off and buy a 48v server rack battery. But man they're double the price at least of the 4 of 12v batteries. Though it does seem much cleaner and easier to deal with and come with breakers and communications and such. Thoughts?

And lastly, it would be a sweet bonus if I could use bright days and the hours before I depart camp to use this system to charge my tesla. I come up about 10-60 miles short depending on the season of doing the round trip to home so I have to charge for 5 min on the way home at a supercharger. Annoying but not the end of the world. But it would be damn cool to be able to add some juice from pure solar at camp.

Thanks everyone who actually read this whole mess and has some suggestions.

I have my travel trailer shore power plugged into an AIO and just use everything as normal - built in AC to DC converter keeps a 12v AGM charged for the few DC loads I have (mainly just lights, propane on demand water heater, and water pump).

I have a second system on the wife's she-shed that has 4x 500w panels with 50voc on a PowMr 3kw 24v AIO. I had the same concern about voltage because my Min startup PV is 150v, but it's been working fine so far, even on cloudy says. But I would suggest getting more panels though - you can never have enough . Otherwise you might consider an AIO with a lower voltage range. Most of the lower volt ones top out at 150v, so you would have to connect your panels 2s2p.

I switched to a diesel heater and compared to the propane furnace, it uses much less power (50w vs 400-500w to run the furnace blower). Before I upgraded my battery bank (24v 100ah LifePo4), it would be dead or nearly dead by 6-7am if running the furnace over night.

Your lights shouldn't be using much power, and most modern TV's shouldn't either. Your fridge could be a power hog - my propane/120v RV fridge when running on AC power would pull 400w about run about 60-70% of the time. I could see it cycling on my power use graph throughout the day. I replaced it with a small (apartment size) residential fridge from Walmart for $200 and it uses less than half the power of the old one. I can't even see it on my graph now.

As for the Tesla charging, I don't see why you couldn't charge on the last day before leaving camp, just set your charger current appropriately and make sure your low voltage cutoff on the AIO is set high enough to not allow the low voltage protection of the batteries to trip off - otherwise they won't charge back up while you're gone.

 

[scrubjaysnest]

I stayed the 12 volt route for two reasons. What I could actually pick up, panels, batteries, and inverter. And didn't want an AIO.

 

[gtluke]

I have my travel trailer shore power plugged into an AIO and just use everything as normal - built in AC to DC converter keeps a 12v AGM charged for the few DC loads I have (mainly just lights, propane on demand water heater, and water pump).

I have a second system on the wife's she-shed that has 4x 500w panels with 50voc on a PowMr 3kw 24v AIO. I had the same concern about voltage because my Min startup PV is 150v, but it's been working fine so far, even on cloudy says. But I would suggest getting more panels though - you can never have enough . Otherwise you might consider an AIO with a lower voltage range. Most of the lower volt ones top out at 150v, so you would have to connect your panels 2s2p.

I switched to a diesel heater and compared to the propane furnace, it uses much less power (50w vs 400-500w to run the furnace blower). Before I upgraded my battery bank (24v 100ah LifePo4), it would be dead or nearly dead by 6-7am if running the furnace over night.

Your lights shouldn't be using much power, and most modern TV's shouldn't either. Your fridge could be a power hog - my propane/120v RV fridge when running on AC power would pull 400w about run about 60-70% of the time. I could see it cycling on my power use graph throughout the day. I replaced it with a small (apartment size) residential fridge from Walmart for $200 and it uses less than half the power of the old one. I can't even see it on my graph now.

As for the Tesla charging, I don't see why you couldn't charge on the last day before leaving camp, just set your charger current appropriately and make sure your low voltage cutoff on the AIO is set high enough to not allow the low voltage protection of the batteries to trip off - otherwise they won't charge back up while you're gone.

Thanks!
What's your diesel heater setup look like? I have one and would love to use it in the fall at the camper. I was thinking of mounting it in the storage space under the camper and piping the heat just into the bedroom. I'd love to heat the whole place with diesel as it's so much more convenient filling up a diesel can than finding a propane place that's open and waiting around forever getting tanks filled.

I've been contemplating using a small residential fridge as well, but the propane backup of the RV fridge is a nice security. hmmmmm

 

[CommandoJoe]

Thanks!
What's your diesel heater setup look like? I have one and would love to use it in the fall at the camper. I was thinking of mounting it in the storage space under the camper and piping the heat just into the bedroom. I'd love to heat the whole place with diesel as it's so much more convenient filling up a diesel can than finding a propane place that's open and waiting around forever getting tanks filled.

I've been contemplating using a small residential fridge as well, but the propane backup of the RV fridge is a nice security. hmmmmm

My trailer has the master bedroom at the front and a bunkhouse at the back - effectively a 2 bedroom. The bunkhouse has a slide out and the living room has a slideout. I removed the extra bunks and the table. I cut holes in the slides for ductwork and I have the heater outside between the slides taking a suction from the bunkhouse and blowing into the living room. Biggest challenge is getting the warm air to circulate throughout the trailer. Ideally I would find a way to tie into the trailers existing ductwork but I haven't done that yet and I don't know if the built in fan has enough flow for that to work. For now I use fan to help circulate warm air.

As of a couple months ago I added a big battery bank and have plenty of capacity and plenty of panels to recharge, so now my primary heat is an electric oil filler radiator heater and the diesel supplements on really cold nights.



Maybe move the propane fridge to the garage just in case you need it. If you're short on battery capacity, you'll enjoy the more efficient fridge. I wish I would have replaced mine when I first went off grid.

 

[gtluke]

Alright I ordered a 48v eco-worthy battery, so I'm committed

I think I'll order a 8000xp, unless someone talks me out of it. I could certainly get away with a much smaller unit but this one just seems to be the way to go.

Now @CommandoJoe has me going down a diesel heater and residential fridge rabbit hole too
Those would be a nice upgrade as well.

 

[eppich8479]

I have the zendure SBV AIO 3s3p 400w panels and its great. Its meant for something exactly like you want. Has 140w 12v anderson plug for those propane heater blowers, and an RV plug.

The biggest down side is that they cheaped out on the inverter and it wastes 100w per hour just to have the inverter on. And im in the midwest where the weather is just soup half the time. 3 days of rain is tough because of the wasted power. Personally i just need an extra battery. And the extra batteries have their own mppt so you can add even more solar. Another down side is that the SBV seem to have a lot of issues in reliability and quality.

So i would say if you can find something similar without the problems go for it. It really is intended for your use case

 

[CommandoJoe]

Alright I ordered a 48v eco-worthy battery, so I'm committed

I think I'll order a 8000xp, unless someone talks me out of it. I could certainly get away with a much smaller unit but this one just seems to be the way to go.

Now @CommandoJoe has me going down a diesel heater and residential fridge rabbit hole too
Those would be a nice upgrade as well.

Those are a couple of the best upgrades I've made, and I wish I would have done it when I first went off grid, rather than over a year later.