Would a 4,000w inverter require changing other electronics?

[Jamie.sanders]

New guy here, I’m looking at the diy blueprints, and the 3,000 watt system is almost exactly what I need but would like just a bit more power. I will be running eight 280ah batteries, and 2,000 watts of solar panels.
My question is if I follow this blueprint but changed the inverter to a 4,000 watt, instead of the 3,000 watt, would I have to make any other changes?
Thanks in advance, I’m still reading and learning.

 

[time2roll]

Since you will have a larger inverter you may need larger wire in the inverter-battery loop.

 

[Hedges]

4000W vs. 3000W will draw 33% more current. Something like 185A, maybe 200A.
I would want larger than 2 awg (we always like larger anyway between battery and inverter.) Nothing wrong with 2/0 for that.
Fuse amperage. Don't think I even see one, good to put a fuse right at battery.

Is that a 100 Ah Battle Born?

https://1t1pye1e13di20waq11old70-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/BB10012-Spec-Sheet.pdf

100A continuous, 200A 30 seconds.
So you're OK with 4000W inverter if you only draw 4000W for 30 seconds, no more than 2000W continuous.
[edit: Attachment said 4 batteries, 2s2p, so 200A is OK]

Oh, "eight, 280 Ah batteries". You probably mean cells.
What are the specs of the cells, how much current draw? What charge current?
What BMS are you using? Generally derate, don't count on it carrying specified current.

It is difficult to switch 200A with BMS. If inverter has remote enable, possibly control that and have high current bypass BMS FETs.

Possibly shunt should be larger too.

 

[MisterSandals]

My question is if I follow this blueprint but changed the inverter to a 4,000 watt, instead of the 3,000 watt,

Just out of curiosity, what do you intend to run on 4000W that will not run on 3000W?

 

[Jamie.sanders]

4000W vs. 3000W will draw 33% more current. Something like 185A, maybe 200A.
I would want larger than 2 awg (we always like larger anyway between battery and inverter.) Nothing wrong with 2/0 for that.
Fuse amperage. Don't think I even see one, good to put a fuse right at battery.

Is that a 100 Ah Battle Born?

https://1t1pye1e13di20waq11old70-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/BB10012-Spec-Sheet.pdf

100A continuous, 200A 30 seconds.
So you're OK with 4000W inverter if you only draw 4000W for 30 seconds, no more than 2000W continuous.
[edit: Attachment said 4 batteries, 2s2p, so 200A is OK]

Oh, "eight, 280 Ah batteries". You probably mean cells.
What are the specs of the cells, how much current draw? What charge current?
What BMS are you using? Generally derate, don't count on it carrying specified current.

It is difficult to switch 200A with BMS. If inverter has remote enable, possibly control that and have high current bypass BMS FETs.

Possibly shunt should be larger too.

No I mean 8 batteries (32 cells) that way I have several days of reserve for cloudy days.
I plan to use this full time running a few things, Tv, light, refrigerator and water well.
But the main reason for building it will be bad weather ice power outages, where it will be my only source of power. Being in the backwoods of Arkansas ice takes the power out often and can last 8-12 days before they get it fixed. 2nd reason
Is just in case the country goes to poop.

 

[Jamie.sanders]

Just out of curiosity, what do you intend to run on 4000W that will not run on 3000W?

Being able to run more household appliances, air fryer, maybe a 1,500 watt heater, water well, deep freeze refrigerator etc.

 

[Hedges]

No I mean 8 batteries (32 cells) that way I have several days of reserve for cloudy days.
I plan to use this full time running a few things, Tv, light, refrigerator and water well.
But the main reason for building it will be bad weather ice power outages, where it will be my only source of power. Being in the backwoods of Arkansas ice takes the power out often and can last 8-12 days before they get it fixed. 2nd reason
Is just in case the country goes to poop.

eight 12V batteries, wired 2s4p
OK, plenty of current for the inverter, at 4000W only about 50A from each battery.

"Water well"
Motors are a difficult load to start, for inverters. Probably 5x whatever their nameplate rating says, or see if there is "LRA" (locked rotor amps) rating.
Your batteries should be sufficient, with 100A continuous and 200A for 30 seconds, they could supply 8kW to 16 kW.

Have a link to the inverter you're considering? Picture showed Giandel; I found a 4000W 12V but not 24V. It said 8000W surge but not how long that lasts. Some may quote milliseconds but that isn't long enough to start a motor; need 3 seconds or longer.

A high-frequency inverter without much surge rated 4000W might start an 800W motor. An inverter (low frequency or some quality high frequency) with 8000W surge for a few seconds might start a 1600W motor; that still isn't a large motor.

Depending on your well pump, you may need a higher end inverter. Or get a soft-start and measure how much starting current before selecting an inverter. High quality low frequency inverters would be the best way to go (and consider soft-start too.)

Consider 48V system. Since you will have enough batteries to wire 4s2p, it just means selecting 48V components. Things like charge controller same model will handle twice the watts.

 

[Jamie.sanders]

eight 12V batteries, wired 2s4p
OK, plenty of current for the inverter, at 4000W only about 50A from each battery.

"Water well"
Motors are a difficult load to start, for inverters. Probably 5x whatever their nameplate rating says, or see if there is "LRA" (locked rotor amps) rating.
Your batteries should be sufficient, with 100A continuous and 200A for 30 seconds, they could supply 8kW to 16 kW.

Have a link to the inverter you're considering? Picture showed Giandel; I found a 4000W 12V but not 24V. It said 8000W surge but not how long that lasts. Some may quote milliseconds but that isn't long enough to start a motor; need 3 seconds or longer.

A high-frequency inverter without much surge rated 4000W might start an 800W motor. An inverter (low frequency or some quality high frequency) with 8000W surge for a few seconds might start a 1600W motor; that still isn't a large motor.

Depending on your well pump, you may need a higher end inverter. Or get a soft-start and measure how much starting current before selecting an inverter. High quality low frequency inverters would be the best way to go (and consider soft-start too.)

Consider 48V system. Since you will have enough batteries to wire 4s2p, it just means selecting 48V components. Things like charge controller same model will handle twice the watts.

Thank you so much, great information, I did strongly considered going 48 volts but I didn't want to veer away from the "blueprint", since my knowledge is limited so staying with the components listed and going as closed to the blueprint as I can seemed like a good idea, I just needed a bit more power!!!
Trying to learn as I go, been reading everything i can find and tons of YouTube videos.

 

[Jamie.sanders]

eight 12V batteries, wired 2s4p
OK, plenty of current for the inverter, at 4000W only about 50A from each battery.

"Water well"
Motors are a difficult load to start, for inverters. Probably 5x whatever their nameplate rating says, or see if there is "LRA" (locked rotor amps) rating.
Your batteries should be sufficient, with 100A continuous and 200A for 30 seconds, they could supply 8kW to 16 kW.

Have a link to the inverter you're considering? Picture showed Giandel; I found a 4000W 12V but not 24V. It said 8000W surge but not how long that lasts. Some may quote milliseconds but that isn't long enough to start a motor; need 3 seconds or longer.

A high-frequency inverter without much surge rated 4000W might start an 800W motor. An inverter (low frequency or some quality high frequency) with 8000W surge for a few seconds might start a 1600W motor; that still isn't a large motor.

Depending on your well pump, you may need a higher end inverter. Or get a soft-start and measure how much starting current before selecting an inverter. High quality low frequency inverters would be the best way to go (and consider soft-start too.)

Consider 48V system. Since you will have enough batteries to wire 4s2p, it just means selecting 48V components. Things like charge controller same model will handle twice the watts.

see above post, and here I found a Giandel 4,000 watt 24v inverter,

Amazon.com

 

[Jamie.sanders]

eight 12V batteries, wired 2s4p
OK, plenty of current for the inverter, at 4000W only about 50A from each battery.

"Water well"
Motors are a difficult load to start, for inverters. Probably 5x whatever their nameplate rating says, or see if there is "LRA" (locked rotor amps) rating.
Your batteries should be sufficient, with 100A continuous and 200A for 30 seconds, they could supply 8kW to 16 kW.

Have a link to the inverter you're considering? Picture showed Giandel; I found a 4000W 12V but not 24V. It said 8000W surge but not how long that lasts. Some may quote milliseconds but that isn't long enough to start a motor; need 3 seconds or longer.

A high-frequency inverter without much surge rated 4000W might start an 800W motor. An inverter (low frequency or some quality high frequency) with 8000W surge for a few seconds might start a 1600W motor; that still isn't a large motor.

Depending on your well pump, you may need a higher end inverter. Or get a soft-start and measure how much starting current before selecting an inverter. High quality low frequency inverters would be the best way to go (and consider soft-start too.)

Consider 48V system. Since you will have enough batteries to wire 4s2p, it just means selecting 48V components. Things like charge controller same model will handle twice the watts.

I did find this review, looks like the 4,000 ran at 4,500 watts until the batteries went down.

"Recharged batteries and then did second test by adding one more 1500 watt heater (3x) and still work. Went into overload of 6200 watts on startup and then down to 4200 watts and still worked great until the batteries were discharged below 10 volts then auto shut off.
The unit does suck power, but provides the power needed".

 

[Hedges]

So it puts out 4.5kW

But you need to determine what is required to start your well pump (and any other large motors you may have.)