Hi Im looking for Nickel Iron batteries..

[Newbeee]

Ive looked all over and can not find any one that sells these. Seems some LARG players do not want this 100 yr bat in circulation. Any one know where I can get these? Please do not say EDISON in Colo. they do advertise like crazy but when u call they say "no we don't sell nickel iron ?
Thanks.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Nickel Iron Battery

Nickel iron batteries for sale; long lasting NiFe batteries for off grid and renewable energy solar systems. Check our NiFe pricing!

beyondoilsolar.com

 

[Netsua]

I've heard interesting things about these. There was a great youtube video I ran into of a system with a Nickel Iron batter and a Magnum inverter. I'll have to dig it out. I remember looking for them briefly after seeing that video - but then quickly giving up haha.

 

[Newbeee]

Yes LOTS in China none here. Market has been killed for some reason. My first thought is they are so good powers that bee do not want them out in mass.
Can u say EMP? lol

 

[Newbeee]

Nickel Iron Battery

Nickel iron batteries for sale; long lasting NiFe batteries for off grid and renewable energy solar systems. Check our NiFe pricing!

beyondoilsolar.com

Thank u I will check out!

 

[saggys]

I just purchased a small set from Iron Edison in September 2021. I do know they just received a large shipment of inventory very recently. I have no affiliation with them at all.

 

[newbostonconst]

Ive looked all over and can not find any one that sells these. Seems some LARG players do not want this 100 yr bat in circulation. Any one know where I can get these? Please do not say EDISON in Colo. they do advertise like crazy but when u call they say "no we don't sell nickel iron ?
Thanks.

Could you call them back again and ask who their distributors are or who they ship to?

 

[Dave at Terravolt]

Well, at the risk of saying EDISON in Colo, [further information redacted to avoid self-promotion]

Off topic, I've seen a slough of questions regarding the chemistry and operation of Nickel Iron batteries on this forum, just lurking. Being a literal professional, I'd be happy (if slow) to answer any questions you may have. And if that offer can be directed to other threads, I'll trust you good folks to take care of that for me.

I'm excited to be a part of the forum. I have some 10 years in solar and renewables: from valence shell to custom net metering agreements. I hope I'll be a valuable addition to the community.

 

[upnorthandpersonal]

@Iron Edison Support Please read the terms and conditions of this site very carefully. Self promotion is not allowed. Please edit your reply to remove the self promotion parts.

Terms and rules

You must agree to these terms and rules before using the site.

diysolarforum.com

 

[Dave at Terravolt]

@Iron Edison Support Please read the terms and conditions of this site very carefully. Self promotion is not allowed. Please edit your reply to remove the self promotion parts.

Terms and rules

You must agree to these terms and rules before using the site.

diysolarforum.com

Done. Sorry, I didn't think I was being overpromotional. Does my edit work?

 

[upnorthandpersonal]

Done. Sorry, I didn't think I was being overpromotional. Does my edit work?

That will do fine. It's become a very strict rule due to issues we've had in the past.

 

[MurphyGuy]

Nickel Iron batteries have only one positive attribute, and that is their life expectancy. No denying that it far exceeds almost all other battery chemistries.

Everything else about them is a major pain.

They are noisy.. sound like a pit full of angry rattlesnakes when they charge.
They are horribly inefficient at only 70%. That means you have to pump in a lot more juice than you get out of them.
They are maintenance intensive, even more so than typical flooded lead acid batteries.
They have strange charge profiles and it is difficult to find a charge controller than can handle them properly.
They are stupidly expensive considering that nickel and iron are not precious rare elements.

Honestly, for the price of what they charge for Nickel Iron batteries, I would rather sink my money into Lithium Titanate Oxide (LTO). You get almost the same life expectancy out of them, they are far more efficient, do not require maintenance, and are about the same price.

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Nickel Iron batteries have only one positive attribute, and that is their life expectancy. No denying that it far exceeds almost all other battery chemistries.

Everything else about them is a major pain.

They are noisy.. sound like a pit full of angry rattlesnakes when they charge.
They are horribly inefficient at only 70%. That means you have to pump in a lot more juice than you get out of them.
They are maintenance intensive, even more so than typical flooded lead acid batteries.
They have strange charge profiles and it is difficult to find a charge controller than can handle them properly.
They are stupidly expensive considering that nickel and iron are not precious rare elements.

Honestly, for the price of what they charge for Nickel Iron batteries, I would rather sink my money into Lithium Titanate Oxide (LTO). You get almost the same life expectancy out of them, they are far more efficient, do not require maintenance, and are about the same price.

@Iron Edison Support

Comments on the above?

 

[saggys]

I have FLA and NIFE, a couple of things I would add. I don't have to worry about the SOC of the NIFE when I leave the cabin Sunday evening, with FLA I was running the generator if the weather and sun did not look good for the coming week to prevent sulfation.

As far as maintenance, they both require watering and one requires periodic specific gravity readings, and one electrolyte changes, albeit alot less frequent than specific gravity readings on FLA. Our battery shed is heated, but if the heater where to fail that might not bode to well for Lithium chemistry, less of a problem for NIFE.

Charge controllers seem to be easier to find for NIFE than inverters. I am in the process of trying to decide which inverter to replace our Exeltech XP1100, as it does not have enough output to wash clothes and run the well pump at the same time without using the generator.

Everything else Murphyguy says is spot on. I will probably go to a lithium chemistry next time if I need to. Just don't know that much about them at this time.

 

[sunsurfer]

Nickel Iron batteries have only one positive attribute, and that is their life expectancy. No denying that it far exceeds almost all other battery chemistries.

Everything else about them is a major pain.

They are noisy.. sound like a pit full of angry rattlesnakes when they charge.
They are horribly inefficient at only 70%. That means you have to pump in a lot more juice than you get out of them.
They are maintenance intensive, even more so than typical flooded lead acid batteries.
They have strange charge profiles and it is difficult to find a charge controller than can handle them properly.
They are stupidly expensive considering that nickel and iron are not precious rare elements.

Honestly, for the price of what they charge for Nickel Iron batteries, I would rather sink my money into Lithium Titanate Oxide (LTO). You get almost the same life expectancy out of them, they are far more efficient, do not require maintenance, and are about the same price.

I would add that they are abuse resistant. LTO typically has similar cycle life to lifepo4. LTO is really good at fast charge rates.

NIFE wins in the cycle life by a large shot. All that is needed is electrolyte change every 10 years if you want max capacity. I considered them but Lifepo4 came down in price. I got twice the capacity for 40% the price.

I really want to get a NIFE bank some day but I would probably go with more lifepo4 when I expand in the future. Its just the best option right now.

 

[OzSolar]

Interesting discussion.

A lifetime ago I did some work with these so maybe something has changed....

-Generally speaking thier charge/discharge efficiency might even be in the low 60's.

-One thing that hasn't been mentioned is thier self discharge approaches 30% per month. On a 30kWh battery bank that ~500 watt hours/day that just vaporizes.

There's probably a calculator around but in most systems I'd you're going going to need at least 30% PV to end up with the same kWh's delivered to your loads as lead acid and even more PV if you're comparing it it LiFEPO4. EG: Do you want a 6kW array or 10kW array?

 

[MurphyGuy]

I would add that they are abuse resistant. LTO typically has similar cycle life to lifepo4. LTO is really good at fast charge rates.

NIFE wins in the cycle life by a large shot. All that is needed is electrolyte change every 10 years if you want max capacity. I considered them but Lifepo4 came down in price. I got twice the capacity for 40% the price.

I really want to get a NIFE bank some day but I would probably go with more lifepo4 when I expand in the future. Its just the best option right now.

LTO is rated for 30,000 cycles. At one cycle per day, that works out to 82 years.

Not sure if it matters, you'll probably have a refrigerator sized fusion reactor behind your home by then.

 

[sunsurfer]

LTO is rated for 30,000 cycles. At one cycle per day, that works out to 82 years.

Not sure if it matters, you'll probably have a refrigerator sized fusion reactor behind your home by then.

Ok, so I see those higher numbers now on manufacture websites. Interesting since it would take a full capacity charge/discharge every 18 minutes for a year to test to 30,000. Obviously they are guessing but it looks like most are comfy with those numbers.

I searched and I could not find any info on rate or DOD to get 30k. If this a legit number, could be nice in the future. I have seen mid 80% for efficiency though which is low, again, not sure at what charge/discharge rates since I do see much specs out there.

 

[MurphyGuy]

Ok, so I see those higher numbers now on manufacture websites. Interesting since it would take a full capacity charge/discharge every 18 minutes for a year to test to 30,000. Obviously they are guessing but it looks like most are comfy with those numbers.

I searched and I could not find any info on rate or DOD to get 30k. If this a legit number, could be nice in the future. I have seen mid 80% for efficiency though which is low, again, not sure at what charge/discharge rates since I do see much specs out there.

LTO is well known now and even the used battery packs sell at a huge premium. They're like 5 times more expensive than any other lithium battery.
They can be discharged to zero, they do not catch fire. You can even drive a nail through one and they won't catch fire.

LTO is superior to the nickel iron cells in every way, but make sure you're sitting down when you see the prices.

One other drawback to the NiFe cells is that, like lead acid cells, they have a big voltage sag when you put a large load on them. LTO behaves like most other lithium in that respect.

Nickel Iron is just too expensive to justify all the undesirable traits.

 

[toms]

NIFE wins in the cycle life by a large shot. All that is needed is electrolyte change every 10 years if you want max capacity. I considered them but Lifepo4 came down in price. I got twice the capacity for 40% the price.

Not in my experience, i looked at NiFe when i purchased my LiFePO4 cells (2012). A group of people i was chatting with online at the time purchased NiFe. Only one of them still uses his NiFe cells (in combination with LiFePO4), the others have given up on them altogether.

I can point you in the direction of dozens of people that have switched from NiFe to LiFePO4 - don’t know of anyone that has gone the other way.