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Help planning small rv setup

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haze5736

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Hello. I'm looking for some help planning the upgrade of my current rv electrical system.

Current setup is a 12v 100ah LifePO4 battery with bms. This is connected to a progressive dynamics all in one power distribution center. It contains ac, dc and charge controller. It is connected to a shore power plug for charging.

My plan for the short term is to charge the battery from a gas powered generator connected to the shore power plug.

The first thing I want to do is add a 1000w inverter. I don't understand how to tie this into my current setup.

As funds become available I will be adding solar panels for charging and will use the gas generator as backup for extended periods of reduced sun. I live in Central New York and get a lot of cloudy days. I will be using the rv seasonally for camping, not living in it full time. Although, camping trips to my 25 acre property may be for a couple of weeks at a time.

I also don't understand how I will tie solar into this setup, but my priority for right now is to get the inverter up and running.

At this point I'm considering the Renogy 1,000 watt pure sine wave inverter. I'm not sure if this is a decent choice but once I started looking at Victron inverters I started to get confused.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
please post a picture of your ac/dc distribution panel with the lid open so that we can see the breakers, fuses and corresponding maps.
Also what is the amp rating on the converter?
 
What he said - what is the model of the progressive dynamics unit you have? You flipped a switch for the Lithium when you got them yes?
 
I would take a Victron inverter any day over a Renogy.

I have a 1000 watt inverter in my RV trailer now. I have plenty of battery to run the microwave, but my inverter is too small. When I upgrade the inverter, it will be to a 2000 or 3000 watt Victron inverter.

To tie the PV into the system, the easiest way is to have a set of common bus bars. Everything connects to the common bus bars. Add the output of the solar charge controller to the common bus bar and you're done. The inverter doesn't need to know anything about the solar charge controller. They are two distinct devices.
 
HRTKD said:
I would take a Victron inverter any day over a Renogy.
Click to expand...

Go ahead, steal my thunder :D

There are two things to initially consider about Victron Inverter selections 1) what is your new system voltage ie: 12, 24, 48 and 2) What is the desired size of the inverter ie: 1kw or 5kw etc? These are specified in the naming conventions.

After that, folks may want to have both 120v and 240v, depending on 30A or 50A hookup.

But ya, the ONLY reason I went with an AIO was Victrons reputation and vast US support. I bought a Quattro 5kw.

Victron parts talk to each other and work together to control the charging states of the batteries, regulate the charge controllers, turn on or turn off other circuits or generators etc. The Quattro can load balance between shore power and your batteries if you need more in a pinch. There's a number of highly qualified Victron folks in this forum.

As for wiring HRTDK said correct, it isn't much to resitribute the output of the inverter to busbars and then tie all the AC to those through the breaker panel.
 
Boondock Saint said:
What he said - what is the model of the progressive dynamics unit you have? You flipped a switch for the Lithium when you got them yes?
Click to expand...

There was no need to flip a switch. My original PDC was set up for lead acid. In order to use the PDC with my LifePO4 battery I had to replace the charger with one specifically for Lithium.

smoothJoey said:
please post a picture of your ac/dc distribution panel with the lid open so that we can see the breakers, fuses and corresponding maps.
Also what is the amp rating on the converter?
Click to expand...

The PDC is 30amp. I attached an image of the wiring diagram from the owner's manual.
 

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smoothJoey said:
Suggest you look at inverter/chargers instead of updating the converter as you mentioned in your other thread.
Inverter/chargers have a built in automatic transfer switch.
Its 3 components in one.
Here is a good one https://www.donrowe.com/samlex-evo-1212f-hw-pure-sine-inverter-charger-p/evo-1212f-hw.htm
Click to expand...
My other thread is a year old. I replaced the charger/converter board last year and would like to build off of what I already have if possible. This only has to be good enough. I don't plan on living in the rv full time and have very small power needs when I do use it. No microwave or other small kitchen appliances. I only want the 1,000 watt inverter to power the outlets so I can run a 4G router for a portion of the day and recharge a laptop and possibly a couple of cell phones. Although, I normally charge the phones direct from dc. The main goal is to power the router.
 
haze5736 said:
My other thread is a year old. I replaced the charger/converter board last year and would like to build off of what I already have if possible. This only has to be good enough. I don't plan on living in the rv full time and have very small power needs when I do use it. No microwave or other small kitchen appliances. I only want the 1,000 watt inverter to power the outlets so I can run a 4G router for a portion of the day and recharge a laptop and possibly a couple of cell phones. Although, I normally charge the phones direct from dc. The main goal is to power the router.
Click to expand...
Understood.
That narrows the options to either an inverter with integrated automatic transfer switch or an inverter + discrete transfer switch.
You could also forgo the automatic transfer switch entirely.
Here is an example of an integrated transfer switch.
www.donrowe.com

Xantrex 817-1000 Freedom X 1000 Inverter with Transfer | DonRowe.com

The Xantrex 817-1000 Freedom X 1000 Inverter features true sine wave output, a built-in automatic transfer switch and is designed with integrated inverting functions and power management features suitable for marine, recreational, and commercial vehicle applications.
www.donrowe.com
 
Does the transfer switch isolate the inverter in the event that I am plugged into shore power? And if so, would i have to do something manually when hooked up to shore power if I don't have an automatic transfer switch?
 
haze5736 said:
Does the transfer switch isolate the inverter in the event that I am plugged into shore power? And if so, would i have to do something manually when hooked up to shore power if I don't have an automatic transfer switch?
Click to expand...
I just read the info in the link you provided and it answers my question. Thanks for that.
 
haze5736 said:
And if so, would i have to do something manually when hooked up to shore power if I don't have an automatic transfer switch?
Click to expand...
Not necessarily, you could just power the converter off of shore power which converts ac to dc and feed that to the inverter to get ac from dc.
Its not terribly efficient but it can work.
 
smoothJoey said:
Not necessarily, you could just power the converter off of shore power which converts ac to dc and feed that to the inverter to get ac from dc.
Its not terribly efficient but it can work.
Click to expand...
Do you know how I would feed the ac output from the inverter back to my power distribution center (PDC) so I can feed all the outlets in the rv?
 
haze5736 said:
Do you know how I would feed the ac output from the inverter back to my power distribution center (PDC) so I can feed all the outlets in the rv?
Click to expand...
Yes but it depends on which topology you choose.
With which of the several options we have discussed would you like to proceed?
 
I'm not concerned with having uninterrupted power. So I think that means I don't need the integrated transfer switch. I am looking for the lowest cost and easy installation at this point. I do want a fairly decent unit but not necessarily top of the line. I would also like relatively low stand by power consumption. I would also like easy access to power the unit on/off. In my case that would mean remote turn on since the location of the inverter will not be convenient to get to.
 
This is the topology map
Code: 
inverter_no _ats {
    ac {
        inlet->surge_protector->breaker->converter

        inverter->30a_master_breaker
    }
    dc {
        legend {
            nnn|NNN| { fused busbar position where nnn is wire guage and NNN is fuse rating in amps
            nnn|UUU| { un fused busbar position where nnn is wire guage
            <-> { bi-directional current flow }
            -> { uni-directional current flow }
            <- { uni-directional current flow }
            eg { equipment ground }
        }
        pos {
            nnn|NNN|<->battery.pos
            nnn|NNN|<-converter.pos
            nnn|NNN|->inverter.pos
            nnn|NNN|->distribution_panel.pos
        }
        neg {
            nnn|UUU|<->battery.neg
            nnn|UUU|->converter.neg
            nnn|UUU|<-inverter.neg
            nnn|UUU|<-distribution_panel.neg
            nnn|UUU|<->converter.eg
            nnn|UUU|<->inverter.eg
            nnn|UUU|<->chassis_bond
        }
    }
}
 
You would have to re-wire the converter as above and add the inverter.
 
My most frequently pondered thoughts on RVs surround the question, “why?”

why what?

Since converters only serve those in parks or semi-fulltime locations with grid: WHY don’t they just provide a decent 12V/solar/inverter from the oem? I know, it’s all about money and I guess most people don’t know how stuff works or want to know, they just want to plug in.

For me the purpose of a camper (or tent) is to not be plugged in; to be independent, autonomous, portable, and free.

My summer digs is a camper. My location for a few months right here is only 150-200’ from grid power. I’m not plugged in, don’t need it. Only 400W.

An RV on the road could be/should be just as useable imho.

Oh, and btw I’d get a 1200W or 1400W inverter. That gives you 10+ amps headroom if you ever want to use it for basically the same money as 1000W, and some electric motor fridges can freak out a 800W or 1000W inverter on startup. My 1200W has never tripped but smaller ones I’ve been involved with in the past didn’t do as well. With the 1200W my fridge starts fine while running the coffeemaker (600W) and phone charger (34W), and the vacuum is about 1000W
 
12VoltInstalls said:
Since converters only serve those in parks or semi-fulltime locations with grid: WHY don’t they just provide a decent 12V/solar/inverter from the oem?
Click to expand...
Converters are a sunset technology.
Discrete inverters are also noticing long shadows.
They probably won't go away anytime soon but their markets will shrink as all_in_ones and inverter_chargers displace them.
 
Last edited:
smoothJoey said:
Converters are a sunset technology.
Discrete inverters are also noticing long shadows.
They probably won't go away anytime soon but there markets will shrink as all_in_ones and inverter_chargers displace them.
Click to expand...
Maybe on part B.
I think charge controllers being separate from an inverter is a bonus along the lines of redundancy in a system.
Maybe you’re speaking purely RV world, and then you might be right. However, to my way of thinking most of the RV stuff is poorly conceived and implemented.
i think the ‘small solar’ market outside of RV will provide sufficient independent devices for quite some time into the future.
 
Or he could just by a Victron MultiPlus II or a Quattro and half the posts in this thread are no longer relevant.

BAM there's the transfer switch, there's the 30A or 50A choices, there's the LifeP04 charger/inverter . . A I O.


.
 
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