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must replace turbines after storm need help with good choice please

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kanelr

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Hi all. We have a pair of Southwest Windpower Air 403 turbines which were installed in 2001. A storm recently damaged them enough to warrant an insurance replacement. The pair are flown on a single 60' guyed tower with a "T" boom separating them. I believe they are max 425 watts each, 24V. I do not think new parts are available, and as an insurance replacement I could go to a single unit instead, one having double (or more) watts. Does anyone know of what is good these days for the above scenario? We go from no wind to 85mph here and there. The two were pretty good at producing above maybe 20mph so I don't want a beast that needs 50 knotts to get it moving.
I have 20 years exp on wind vs solar here in Ohio so I know those issues... still need a replacement.
thanks
 
If you must do small wind again... ha, I get it.

IstaBreeze i-1000 turbine looks interesting. I've seen several YouTube videos indicating it make some power.

Primus the living equivalent of SWWP. I think they might have bought the assets, etc out of SWWP bankruptcy.

One more "Nope" on Missouri Wind and Solar.

Missouri Wind Better Business Bureau Reviews
 
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John Frum said:
Service, support, other?
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I don't remember since at the time I wasn't interested in wind like I was the solar. But I seem to recall it was a quality issue with their products and they were blaming the purchaser instead of standing behind their warranty.. or something like that. And it wasn't just one complaint..

I just know that it set off red flags in the gray mush I call my brain.

Make sure you do your homework. Personally, I'm hyper-interested in wind power right now.. so bad I can taste it. What I'm learning is that if you want a quality turbine, you have to look towards Germany. With the exception of maybe the Bergey in the USA, the German turbines are the best.
 
Tecnodave said:
extremely low output....high wind speed needed to get usable power...alternator type not suitable for low r.p.m. use

my vw generator wind machine with a 6 foot carved sitka spruce blade outpreformed the MWS turbine at any windspeed
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I've been around a fair amount of different small wind turbines by many manufacturers and all overstated thier production by at least 4X's but Missouri Wind takes overstating of production to very special level.
 
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So these Air 403's sing a bit but really worked, though not big watts. Looks like they are now Prius Air and are still around....but at 1k each that gives me a replacement budget of 2k. is there a good vertical unit?
 
OzSolar said:
If you must do small wind again... ha, I get it.

IstaBreeze i-1000 turbine looks interesting. I've seen several YouTube videos indicating it make some power.

Primus the living equivalent of SWWP. I think they might have bought the assets, etc out of SWWP bankruptcy.

One more "Nope" on Missouri Wind and Solar.

Missouri Wind Better Business Bureau Reviews
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Other than coming from turkey (distance not politics) it appears they are AC units...did you see that?
 
kanelr said:
Other than coming from turkey (distance not politics) it appears they are AC units...did you see that?
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Yes, I did. Others can certainly speak more intelligently about this but most wind turbines make 3 phase AC and the factory supplied controller installed next to your batteries converts to the correct DC voltage for your battery bank. That controller also prevents the batteries from being overcharged and in the case of some turbines "dumps" the power to a load to keep the turbine loaded to protect the turbine from spinning so fast it self destructs which can happen even in low wind speeds.

Ironically the noise your Air 403's made was intentionally done as a way of self regulation. They got inefficient by letting the wind deflect the blades above a certain windspeed which spoils the airfoil. I suppose it's crude way of stall regulation like the big boys do.

kanelr said:
So these Air 403's sing a bit but really worked, though not big watts. Looks like they are now Prius Air and are still around....but at 1k each that gives me a replacement budget of 2k.
Click to expand...
I apologize for hijacking your post but it would be irresponsible of me to not point out to others reading this in the future that one will be very lucky to get 15kWH per month at the PERFECT site (doesn't exist) from anyone's 400 watt wind turbine. Even worse, it will make most of those kWh's during a totally unpredictable 2 or 3 windiest days of the month.

To put it in perspective one 200watt solar panel will reliably and predictably make more KWH's and still be making KWH's 20 years from now. What I'm trying to say is set your expectations very low for small wind and still be prepared to be disappointed.

After all of that I get the fascination of small wind, I really do. Please don't take anything I said as an attack, rather a warning to others.
kanelr said:
is there a good vertical unit?
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Vertical wind turbines have always had a bright future.... and always will.

edit: to correct some typos
 
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OzSolar said:
Yes I did. Others can certainly speak more intelligently about this but most wind turbines make 3 phase AC and the factory supplied controller installed next to your batteries converts to the correct DC voltage for your battery bank. That controller also prevents the batteries from being overcharged and in the case of some turbines "dumps" the power to a load to keep the turbine loaded to protect the turbine from spinning so fast it self destructs which can happen even in low wind speeds.

Ironically all the noise your Air 403's made was intentionally done as a way of self regulation. They got really inefficient by deflecting above a certain windspeed which spoils the airfoil. I suppose it's crude way of stall regulation like the big boys do.


I apologize for hijacking your post it would be irresponsible of me to not point out to others reading this in the future that you will be very lucky to get 15kWH per month at a PERECT site from anyone's 400 watt wind turbine. Even worse, it will make most of that during the totally unpredictable 2 or 3 windiest days of the month.

To put it in perspective one 200watt solar panel will reliably and predictably make more KWH's and still be making KWH's 20 years from now. What I'm trying to say is set your expectations very low for wind and still be prepared to be disappointed.

After all of that I get the fascination of small wind, I really do. Please don't take anything I said as an attack, rather a warning to others.

Vertical wind turbines have always had a bright future.... and always will.
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no hijack thanks for the courtesy.
Wish I knew about the AC, I have 300'of #2 tied up in these. (at 2001 prices thankfully).
I have had a chance to test these a lot. they do have a passive brake however they also are set up to lock when you short the inputs, so we have a " lockdown" switch for each. The flex happens at 45 mph. If our sump pump has no power the basement becomes something wetter. We are on grid however when off grid the 403's produce enough to assure that even during days of overcast (14 panels) we have no water issues....maybe no lights but no water. (in a storm sump may run twice hourly That would be in a long power failure of course. these are at 25-28v dc at the output with an internal regulator and screw adjustment. With our original lead acid you ran them right to the batteries no charge controller. Now with LifePo4, a charge controller must be used and you turn the air 403's internal trim full on. I dont think i will need a diversion load as I will be using a relay from the inverter to lock them down when SOC is above float.
 
OzSolar said:
Yes, I did. Others can certainly speak more intelligently about this but most wind turbines make 3 phase AC and the factory supplied controller installed next to your batteries converts to the correct DC voltage for your battery bank. That controller also prevents the batteries from being overcharged and in the case of some turbines "dumps" the power to a load to keep the turbine loaded to protect the turbine from spinning so fast it self destructs which can happen even in low wind speeds.

Ironically the noise your Air 403's made was intentionally done as a way of self regulation. They got inefficient by letting the wind deflect the blades above a certain windspeed which spoils the airfoil. I suppose it's crude way of stall regulation like the big boys do.


I apologize for hijacking your post but it would be irresponsible of me to not point out to others reading this in the future that one will be very lucky to get 15kWH per month at the PERFECT site (doesn't exist) from anyone's 400 watt wind turbine. Even worse, it will make most of those kWh's during a totally unpredictable 2 or 3 windiest days of the month.

To put it in perspective one 200watt solar panel will reliably and predictably make more KWH's and still be making KWH's 20 years from now. What I'm trying to say is set your expectations very low for small wind and still be prepared to be disappointed.

After all of that I get the fascination of small wind, I really do. Please don't take anything I said as an attack, rather a warning to others.

Vertical wind turbines have always had a bright future.... and always will.

edit: to correct some typos
Click to expand...
Interesting, with my Missouri Wind and Solar turbine, I got 3Kw in one day. It is the perfect complement to my 15Kw solar system.
 
OzSolar said:
If you must do small wind again... ha, I get it.

IstaBreeze i-1000 turbine looks interesting. I've seen several YouTube videos indicating it make some power.

Primus the living equivalent of SWWP. I think they might have bought the assets, etc out of SWWP bankruptcy.

One more "Nope" on Missouri Wind and Solar.

Missouri Wind Better Business Bureau Reviews
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Right - if you look at any BBB COMPLAINT page, you will see complaints. If you look at the customer reviews page you will see over 600 reviews with a weighted average of 4.89/5.00. It's quite an excellent rating.
 
wshankmo said:
Interesting, with my Missouri Wind and Solar turbine, I got 3Kw in one day. It is the perfect complement to my 15Kw solar system.
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You got 3kW of instantaneous power or 3kWh of energy production in one day? What is your turbine's kW rating and annual kWh production?
 
As I said, it was 3kw in one day. If you talk with a Missour Wind sales person, they will tell you that you will get about 500 watts at 15 mph. It has the potential to make 2000 watts in certain wind conditions. The turbines are rated the way they are to ensure the system is configured to take that maximum input and not damage your system. We do not use the rating to tell people that is what they will get hour after hour. We tell people they are rated to make sure the additional design elements are correctly sized.
 
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OzSolar said:
I've been around a fair amount of different small wind turbines by many manufacturers and all overstated thier production by at least 4X's but Missouri Wind takes overstating of production to very special level.
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Actually, we are very, very serious about making sure our systems are rated so that we never un-size the components that go with the system. As a manufacturer of small/micro wind, this is how they rated. If you are dealing with a company that does not share their high rating, you run the risk of compromising your safety.
 
OzSolar said:
If you must do small wind again... ha, I get it.

IstaBreeze i-1000 turbine looks interesting. I've seen several YouTube videos indicating it make some power.

Primus the living equivalent of SWWP. I think they might have bought the assets, etc out of SWWP bankruptcy.

One more "Nope" on Missouri Wind and Solar.

Missouri Wind Better Business Bureau Reviews
Click to expand...
As I have to go through so many of OzSolar bashing of our company, we are very proud of our Better Busines Bureau reviews. You can certainly find bad reviews about but you can find bad reviews about any company you want. We make a point of trying to push all of our reviews through the BBB as they strive to help resolve issues rather than so many other sites that attempt to financially extort companies to keep bad reviews from happening.
 
wshankmo said:
As I have to go through so many of OzSolar bashing of our company, we are very proud of our Better Busines Bureau reviews. You can certainly find bad reviews about but you can find bad reviews about any company you want. We make a point of trying to push all of our reviews through the BBB as they strive to help resolve issues rather than so many other sites that attempt to financially extort companies to keep bad reviews from happening.
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wshankmo said:
As I said, it was 3kw in done day. If you talk with a Missour Wind sales person, they will tell you that you will get about 500 watts at 15 mph. It has the potential to make 2000 watts in certain wind conditions. The turbines are rated the way they are to ensure the system is configured to take that maximum input and not damage your system. We do not use the rating to tell people that is what they will get hour after hour. We tell people they are rated to make sure the additional design elements are correctly sized.
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The fact that you are in the the business and don't know how to use kWh and kW properly is astonishing. Quite telling honestly.

Wow. This and the others posts against me and others is just appalling.

You're only managing to make a mockery of yourself and your company.

We will shut up once you produce any sort of graph or datalogging showing the kWh of your turbines.

images
 
Don't hide behind your login. Come to the store and let's have a hands-on honest evaluation of what your problem is.
 
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