80+ year old Mother-In-Law 26 solar panels and Two batteries

[idanny76]

In disregards of my advise.... My mother in law decided to get a 25 year Solar lease with SunRun. They installed 26 solar panels and two Powerwall+ batteries. Her system was activated on September 27th and I have the app to monitor the system since she has no clue what anything is. She is 80+ years old and has no Wifi connection, but someone how they manage to get the system to go online. It only goes online sometimes and that's when I get the data.

I know what the Tesla App says about the usage, but it seems ridiculous. She is barely generating any solar power, battery never reaches 100% and most of her consumption is from the grid. When I look at the graph it has empty areas and my guess is that its offline and not recording. I would assume the system is keeping track of the data and when it goes online it should provide all the data. Can anyone help understand whats going on? I cannot ask her anything, as she can barely use her smartphone and doesn't even know how to text.

 

[Mattb4]

Without data we have the same problem you do. So about all I can suggest is you contact the solar company that slicked talked your poor mother into purchasing it and demand some information. Likely they will not respond because any firm that will take advantage of an old person like you describe is as crooked as a dog's hind leg.

 

[Vigo]

Well, she might have been acting with the best intentions if for example they told her that the system would increase her home's value for her heirs, and she figured she wasn't really paying for it anyway since, not to be dark, but life insurance would likely end up indirectly picking up the majority of the bill for the system. Maybe her heirs would have preferred to have that chunk as a cash payout but i'm not interested in the details on that one!!

I agree with Matt, call the company and give them whatever the words are to say you are entitled to act on your mother's behalf (which may or may not be true but i would not expect them to verify it as much as i would expect them to blow you off if you don't claim this). Then bitch them out and threaten them until they either make it functional or tell you how to make it functional..

And maybe find out if the warranty on this thing is transferrable..

 

[idanny76]

I updated the post with more screenshots

 

[idanny76]

Right now the status went from Charging to No Recent Data Available. It seems to go online at certain times. I am not sure if that is the way its setup to work. I would assume that it would be online showing the status of system at all times.

 

[idanny76]

Here is her contract redacted
https://pdf.ac/u63KI

 

[idanny76]

I highlighted the areas of concern on the lease contract. These lease contract are scams and I don't see anything beneficial from it. Here is what I have learned so far from reading the contract that seems to be the same with every leasing solar company. Sunrun was the founder of this scam.... I call it scam, because the buyer does not benefit from anything here. The system will end up costing $110,000 after 25 years. After the 25 years... the system is still not hers and she will have the option to buy it.... lol

Here are a couple of things I saw on the contract.

- First, the monthly payment increases every year for the 25 year life of the lease.
-Solar equipment cannot be removed unless, you complete the 25 year lease, buy the equipment or pay off the remainder of the lease.
- Once the 25 yr lease is over.... the equipment is not yours and they will sell it to you at the current market value or remove it.
- Leaks on the roof are only under warranty for 5 years after installation
- The yearly monthly payment can be increased even more. If SunRun decides to increase the rates per kWh, your payment will increase the next year.
- If there are any fault on the battery or panels.... they have up to 6 months to repair it in the case parts are not available.
- Leasing companies usually use the cheapest bulk materials to keep cost low.
- It will cost you 3x times as much, if you buy the equipment from the leasing company
- The leasing company will not let you pay off the equipment before 5 years, because they cannot keep the federal rebates if you pay it off sooner. They keep the federal rebates too.
- They say you will not pay the local utility company anything, but the contract states the equipment will only cover 78% of your usage. They also do not guarantee any amount of production.
- They do not guarantee you will have power if the utility service goes out
- If you do not have a battery backup...... at night you will be using your local utility electricity. If its mostly cloudy, you will not generate enough energy and will use be using from your local utility.... Basically, with or without battery and whether its cloudy or sunny, you still have to pay the lease and what ever you consumed from your local utility.
- They will place a UCC-1 registration on your property that will come up when ever you apply for a loan and they run a title search. Basically is a lien on your property. You cannot sell unless you fulfill the 25 years, pay the full lease, convince the buyer to take the over the and get approved for the rest of the lease, or buy the equipment.
- The only way they will remove the equipment is after you complete the 25 years and you decide not to buy the equipment or renew the lease.
- They will not relocate the equipment to your new property. The only way to take the equipment with you, is if you pay for it and hire someone to transfer it. Basically, its not worth it and your house is on the line and even harder to sell.

 

[OzSolar]

no Wifi connection, but someone how they manage to get the system to go online. It only goes online sometimes and that's when I get the data.

I'm guessing there's a cellular modem on the system.

Thank you sharing what appears to be predatory sales and leasing practices. It continues to appear that most solar sales people make the timeshare cons seem down right honest.

 

[Ampster]

I highlighted the areas of concern on the lease contract.

Yes that sounds familiar from descriptions of other Sunrun leases.

 

[RCinFLA]

Worse than the technical attributes, check the contract fine print.

It likely has some nasty entanglements if you try to sell the house. The usual scheme is you either have to pay off a large single payment of a larger amount than if you paid for an install up front, to get out of the lease or have the new owners take over the contract, which can be a deal breaker for many prospective buyers.

These leases count on the average home flip time is five to seven years and usually the bloated lease cancellation payment must be paid in order for a new buyer to agree to buy the house. Selling to an old, naive retired homeowner is pure gold to them.

 

[idanny76]

Worse than the technical attributes, check the contract fine print.

It likely has entanglements if you try to sell the house. The usual scheme is you either have to pay off a large single payment of a larger amount than if you paid for an install up front, to get out of the lease or have the new owners take over the contract, which can be a deal breaker for many prospective buyers.

These leases count on the average home flip time is five to seven years and usually the bloated lease cancellation payment must be paid in order for a new buyer to agree to buy the house.

Check out page 35 and 40..... Monthly payment increase toward the end of the lease to $500 a month. Final cost of lease is $110,000 and there is a clause on the contract that state that at anytime sunrun can increase the kWh cost and the monthly payment can go up as much as they want.

 

[Mattb4]

I highlighted the areas of concern on the lease contract. These lease contract are scams and I don't see anything beneficial from it.

Ouch!

Yeah that is as bad as it comes. With the lien against the property tittle it not only cheats your mother but any heirs if she should pass away.

ETA: looking over the screenshots you posted I see the one where it has a Yes - No button for permission to Export. Has the Yes ever been made? I assume that grid tie was approved.

If you she is not exporting to the grid than most of the time her array will be doing little.

 

[OzSolar]

Ouch!

Yeah that is as bad as it comes. With the lien against the property tittle it not only cheats your mother but any heirs if she should pass away.

Terrible stuff. Yeah I know guy that had a UCC filed on his property for his NEIGHBORS solar system. Somehow the solar company got the wrong address and no one caught it. Took the guy 6 months to straighten it out.

 

[idanny76]

I went with a 50/50 on the battery backup reserve in hopes it will reduce her consumption from the grid. Now when I go into My Home Info, in My Products it only shows Powerwall Gateway. The gateway is the device that provides all the data. My questions is.... Should both batteries be also added in the My products page in settings?

My main concern is that she will be paying the $291 monthly for the lease and a utility bill of $80+. If thats the case, she will be paying as much or more as she was paying without solar. Her utility bill for power was between $280-380.... $380 being at the peak of the hot season.

 

[Ampster]

The gateway is the device that provides all the data.

Did they give you access to the Tesla app so you can change configuration?

 

[idanny76]

Did they give you access to the Tesla app so you can change configuration?

I was able to get access to the app by changing the password. She did not know what the app was, the password and how to use it. So I did the password reset and I have access to the information and can change the settings. A neighbor who has solar panels also, is stopping by today to check her system. I had my mother in law check the utility meter and the wheel was spinning. So she is currently pulling from the grid and not her solar...... which should be supplying her now during sunlight. I dont see why 26 solar panels and two backup batteries should not be supplying her energy needs. They are two elderly people in a very small house. How much can they use, that there would be pulling from the grid also?

Solar Panels (26) Canadian Solar, CS3N-390MS
Inverter 1 x Tesla Powerwall+ 1538000-xx-y
Battery Backup 2 x Tesla, Powerwall 2 AC

 

[Mattb4]

If her meter is the old style analog with spinning disc you have to know if it is spinning in the opposite direction for grid feed. I will ask again if you have given permission for this system to feed to grid?

 

[idanny76]

If her meter is the old style analog with spinning disc you have to know if it is spinning in the opposite direction for grid feed. I will ask again if you have given permission for this system to feed to grid?

I believe she did. I didn't think of asking the direction it was spinning. It usually spins counter clockwise for usage. I have a digital now and if I remeber the old analog meter would spin counter clock wise. So if she is giving back to the grid it will spin clockwise.

 

[v_green57]

There's usually an arrow silkscreened onto the rotor which shows direction of rotation. Can be on the top or bottom of the disc.

 

[Ampster]

There is also a fairly active Powerwall community on the Teslamotorsclub forum that can give you a clue to which settings can give her the optimal benefit. If Sunrun hasn't kept it for themselves, Tesla is also enrolling Powerwall users into VPP (Virtual Power Plant).