Did i wreck my battery?

Hi,

This is a long winded explanation before my questions. The TLDR is at the end. You probably need to skim the paragraphs though. Tia!

I'm on my maiden voyage in my travel trailer. It came with a solar system I assume to be lower end. One of the top things on my to do list is to make this system usable, we mostly off grid camp, for extended periods. Our fridge is 12v only no propane but first things first...

First day out we went to a campground with hookups. One of us ? forgot to flip the breaker when we connected. I eventually realized we were running on battery but I think it was too late.

I have a furrion "battery controller" I think most of the system is furrion. It is very basic. Tells me volts, amps, amp hours, % full...

During the demo/ walk through, the guide told me the voltage reading would be how i would know if the battery is full. By observation, trial and error, and asking around the camp grounds, I've realized that it's probably Amp hours.

I thought the "battery controller..."

(I keep using quotes b/c I think calling it that is a disservice to some of the ones I've seen in last few days)

...might not have been calibrated properly and the battery was really full even though the indicator didn't say so.

Now I think it probably is and we've run this battery to near zero.

I don't know what the onboard "convenience center" means when it says the battery is full b/c it definitely isn't.

So I think I've run the battery to zero but I'm not sure. It's supposed to be 100 amp battery but if the indicator is correct charging seems to be stalling between 25 and 30 amps.

(When near zero this morning it took an average of 5 sec/ 0.01 amp hrs

By high noon until now it's taking an average of 25-30 seconds/ 0.01 amp hour.

Sunny day on a beach/ barrier island. Assategue for those that know it. )

This is all with voltage reading 14+

I never saw the controller above 30 amp hours or 30% but I didn't start fooling around with it until after the failure to flip the breaker.

So I'm 95% sure I've damaged the battery. The fridge wouldn't kick on after 11pm last night. Other nights it worked all night.

TLDR

- How do I determine the quality of this battery?

-Can it be fixed\charged or something?

-What retailers can I get another similar one from to get me through the rest of this trip and minimize generator use?
I'm near ocean city Maryland.

-Answers to any other questions I don't know I should be asking?

Tia!

If you are charging at a rate that you see one amp hour on the meter, gained every 30 seconds, does that slow down after a while? How long? 2 amp hours per minute would result in 100 amp hours in 50 minutes.

Edit, what are you charging from? Shore AC power, generator, Solar?

Sadly, you've provided a ton of words, but very little of it is readily useful.

Hortstu said:

TLDR

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TLDR should contain enough information to permit not reading the rest. This is simply where you asked your questions.

Hortstu said:

- How do I determine the quality of this battery?

Click to expand...

what battery?

Hortstu said:

-Can it be fixed\charged or something?

Click to expand...

Not sure. hard to tell what's going on.

Hortstu said:

-What retailers can I get another similar one from to get me through the rest of this trip and minimize generator use?
I'm near ocean city Maryland.

Click to expand...

Can't tell you where to go when we don't know what it is.

Hortstu said:

-Answers to any other questions I don't know I should be asking?

Click to expand...

Only more questions.

Please provide:
Pictures if needed
Product names with links to data. don't make us Google your system for you.

DThames said:

If you are charging at a rate that you see one amp hour on the meter, gained every 30 seconds, does that slow down after a while? How long? 2 amp hours per minute would result in 100 amp hours in 50 minutes.

Edit, what are you charging from? Shore AC power, generator, Solar?

Click to expand...

Charging from solar.

DThames said:

If you are charging at a rate that you see one amp hour on the meter, gained every 30 seconds, does that slow down after a while? How long? 2 amp hours per minute would result in 100 amp hours in 50 minutes.

Edit, what are you charging from? Shore AC power, generator, Solar?

Click to expand...

I did say that in the original post. 0.01amphrs/ unit of time mentioned. I've corrected the original post. Sorry for confusing.

Charging from solar all day. Just turned on generator after 4pm. Still haven't broken 29amphrs in the battery.

Ok, to start,
Do you know the model of the furrion controller ?
Not really sure what the amps reading mean for your controller - so learning about the model of your controller system would be helpful
If it is a very good controller, no more amps would be allowed into your battery if it is fully charged.
Your batttery reading is still 14Volts?
Dont worry about amps now


IF your battery is trashed, I dont think it is completely, and if you get another battery and if your controller cannot stop a low battery discharge from happening, you can go here..
2V Battery Charging Controller Protection Board Module Undervoltage Low Voltage Cut Off Automatic Switch Recovery Protection Controller Module
It's less than $11.00 and has worked great on my battery charged electric fence.


Lead acid battery is considered to be fully discharged when a car battery dips to around 10.5 volts, altho 80% of its capacity remains.

Going very low can cause irreversible damage to the plates through excessive sulfation, this will crystalize on the battery plates, sulfation can be to reversible by charging.., but the crystals on the plates really cant. Amperage will decline.. but you should be able to charge it back up and get use out of it.... but everytime you go below 10.5 more damage is done.
m

sunshine_eggo said:

what battery?

Click to expand...

12v 100amp

sorry I didn't provide make and model didn't know that was relevant to my question but I'm learning.

Ultra power ev24

I don't know where to find the data. Google it can't find a manufacturer site or spec sheet. Pardon my ignorance.

sunshine_eggo said:

Only more questions.

Please provide:
Pictures if needed

Click to expand...

If anyone needs pictures of be happy to provide. Just tell me what to take them of.

sunshine_eggo said:

Product names with links to data. don't make us Google your system for you.

Click to expand...

Furrion 165w rigid solar panel
Model: fsfp16mw-bl

Furrion net-zero 25A wall mount
Mppt solar charge controler
Model: fscc30psw-bl

sunshine_eggo said:

Sadly, you've provided a ton of words, but very little of it is readily useful.



TLDR should contain enough information to permit not reading the rest. This is simply where you asked your questions.



what battery?



Not sure. hard to tell what's going on.



Can't tell you where to go when we don't know what it is.



Only more questions.

Please provide:
Pictures if needed
Product names with links to data. don't make us Google your system for you.

Click to expand...

I'm compiling my systems component info. I'll be back.

You cannot measure amp hours, directly live voltage
Your controller probably reasons like this
There is a12V, 100 amp hour battery
when the battery is 13V, it is fully charged, and therefor has 100 amp/hours that can be used.

How much the battery is damaged would reveal lower amp/hours.
I think, but am not sure as I never witnessed it, if your 13V battery put out say 10 amp hours and you saw a sig drop it go to near 10.5, then that is indicative of it being damaged.. a quick discharge.

Furrion net-zero 25A wall mount
Mppt solar charge controler
Model: fscc30psw-bl

https://cdn.accentuate.io/6641527586999/5237057388633/MS_25-50A-MPPT_v01-v1617097014132.pdf

For the spec.s I see overcharge protection, but do not see over and under voltage protection, unless I am missing it.

MrMatt said:

Ok, to start,
Do you know the model of the furrion controller ?

Click to expand...

Fscc30psw-bl

MrMatt said:

IF your battery is trashed, I dont think it is completely, and if you get another battery and if your controller cannot stop a low battery discharge from happening, you can go here..
2V Battery Charging Controller Protection Board Module Undervoltage Low Voltage Cut Off Automatic Switch Recovery Protection Controller Module
It's less than $11.00 and has worked great on my battery charged electric fence.

Click to expand...

Ty!

MrMatt said:

Lead acid battery is considered to be fully discharged when a car battery dips to around 10.5 volts, altho 80% of its capacity remains.

Going very low can cause irreversible damage to the plates through excessive sulfation, this will crystalize on the battery plates, sulfation can be to reversible by charging.., but the crystals on the plates really cant. Amperage will decline.. but you should be able to charge it back up and get use out of it.... but everytime you go below 10.5 more damage is done.
m

Click to expand...

Thanks for the explanation!

To start:

MrMatt said:

Lead acid battery is considered to be fully discharged when a car battery dips to around 10.5 volts, altho 80% of its capacity remains.

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This is complete nonsense. A battery discharged to 10.5V has very nearly 0% of its capacity remaining.

Hortstu said:

12v 100amp

sorry I didn't provide make and model didn't know that was relevant to my question but I'm learning.

Ultra power ev24

Click to expand...

Group 24 size batteries are usually around 85Ah. I would be very surprised if it's actually 100Ah unless it's a group 27 size.

Hortstu said:

If anyone needs pictures of be happy to provide. Just tell me what to take them of.

Click to expand...

Battery top and labels.

Hortstu said:

Furrion 165w rigid solar panel
Model: fsfp16mw-bl

Click to expand...

So one single 165W panel?

Okay, so here's some math:

165W / 12V = 13.75A

Your MPPT is 25A, so it can handle it.

165W/14.4V = 11.5A - the maximum current the MPPT can deliver to the battery at peak solar and peak battery voltage.

Assuming you have an 85Ah batter, you'd need about 85Ah/11.5A = 7.39h of full power output from the panel. You might get this in 1.5 days worth of sunshine on the panel. Nor would you be able to power any loads during the charge.

I await battery pictures.

Hortstu said:

Charging from solar.

I did say that in the original post. 0.01amphrs/ unit of time mentioned. I've corrected the original post. Sorry for confusing.

Charging from solar all day. Just turned on generator after 4pm. Still haven't broken 29amphrs in the battery.

Click to expand...

After charging all day, if you don't use the battery at all, but wait and charge the next day, will the amp hours (on your meter) get above 30, maybe 50 or so? If it does, it could be that the solar charging is just not enough to recover the battery in the time that you expect. I would test as described, charge more than one day without an evening/overnight load. Solar charging can be slower than expected, if you don't have an understanding from experience.

sunshine_eggo said:

To start:



This is complete nonsense. A battery discharged to 10.5V has very nearly 0% of its capacity remaining.

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Sorry I mislead, ...better said this way after I looked it up..."normal car batteries are considered to be “fully discharged” at 10.5 volts, which is only about 80 percent of full."

MrMatt said:

Sorry I mislead, ...better said this way after I looked it up..."normal car batteries are considered to be “fully discharged” at 10.5 volts, which is only about 80 percent of full."

Click to expand...

This still doesn't make sense. In most cases, any lead acid battery discharged to 10.5V is 0% full.

sunshine_eggo said:

This still doesn't make sense. In most cases, any lead acid battery discharged to 10.5V is 0% full.

Click to expand...

I agree.

Try this rewrite:
(I edited the wrong sentence first time around)
Normal car batteries are considered to be “fully discharged” at 10.5 volts, which is only about 80 percent of full voltage.

MrMatt said:

Lead acid battery is considered to be fully discharged when a car battery dips to around 10.5 volts, altho 80% of its capacity remains.

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No. 12.01- 12.1V is fully discharged for a lead acid battery. You can take it down to 10V but with damage.

EDIT to say the effective use discharge of lead acid batteries is what I was referring to. Flooded batteries in general will experience shorter lifespans if discharged below 12V. A commodity flooded lead battery should not be discharged below 12.06V in common practice.

MrMatt said:

Sorry I mislead, ...better said this way after I looked it up..."normal car batteries are considered to be “fully discharged” at 10.5 volts, which is only about 80 percent of full."

Click to expand...

No. Normal car batteries should never get to 10.5V either, there ain’t no percent there never mind 80%

OP
Can you add a second identical or nearly identical panel? I’d do that and right away go buy a $100 walmartha deep cycle marine battery “29DC”
That’s the cheapest way out imho

You probably should have two batteries but with 165W solar that ain’t quite enough panel for recharge. A second panel for a camping scenario should meet one battery’s need and a bit more.

12VoltInstalls said:

OP
Can you add a second identical or nearly identical panel? I’d do that and right away go buy a $100 walmartha deep cycle marine battery “29DC”
That’s the cheapest way out imho

You probably should have two batteries but with 165W solar that ain’t quite enough panel for recharge. A second panel for a camping scenario should meet one battery’s need and a bit more.

Click to expand...

I am running the same system (stock Grand Design 'Solar Package')...
I have 2 GC-2s in series.
Things I noticed last year, when it was all new.

1) that 12v fridge NEEDS over 200Ah of lead acid batts or 100Ah of lithium. With a group 24 batt, my BIL barely gets an overnight before running that battery flat. Waking up to alarms going off all over the place (similar package without the GC-2s)
2) the solar panel and SCC *CAN* keep up to the fridge, as long as the ambient temperatures stay below 75*F. Above that; 3 days is the max I can boondock.
3) I added an additional 200w panel this spring (matched amperage and wired in series). Makes all the difference in the world. It took a little splicing on the roof, but it now allows us to run indefinitely...

12VoltInstalls said:

No. 12.01- 12.1V is fully discharged for a lead acid battery. You can take it down to 10V but with damage.

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No 12.01V is around 50% SOC...it's not fully discharged. You may reduce the battery's capacity by further discharging it but it is in no way fully discharged.