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diy solar

Change my Mind: Why buy server rack when you get 4x Chins/redodo/amperetime 100 shipped for $500 less?

Alkaline

Alkaline

Solar Wizard
Joined
Jul 26, 2020
Messages
2,074
Location
Orange, Tx
I fail to understand this server rack form factor, its heavy and not cheap, you have to buy racks. Only thing I can say its looks cool, and I work at a data center so thumbs up for that, But even the cheapest one around is going to run almost $1800 by the time you add shipping.

Vs

4x Chins/zoom/redodo 100ah are under $1200 shipped from there sites.

For what I understand most people aren't even doing the inverter communication bit so I fail to understand the appeal. I would be if these were significantly cheaper but they are not.

so what am I not understanding here?
 
You'll need a 4x 12V balancer, messier unprofessional looking build, less features.
 
4x 12v balancer? They would be connected in series in 48v.

Eventually I will have enough $ to get the LV6548 have a LV2424 right now.
 
Alkaline said:
4x 12v balancer? They would be connected in series in 48v.

Eventually I will have enough $ to get the LV6548 have a LV2424 right now.
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That's why you need the 4x 12V balancer. The individual 12V BMSs in each chins battery have no way of staying in balance with other series connected batteries.
 
Alkaline said:
4x 12v balancer? They would be connected in series in 48v.

Eventually I will have enough $ to get the LV6548 have a LV2424 right now.
Click to expand...

He means so you can keep them nice and balanced. Four 12v batteries in series will become uneven without balancing. Personally I don't think it's a big deal to balance them and like the options / redundancy multiple batteries allows for. Especially if you keep 12v equipment around for cars or portable systems anyway.
 
niktak11 said:
That's why you need the 4x 12V balancer. The individual 12V BMSs in each chins battery have no way of staying in balance with other series connected batteries.
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I have never had a problem running 2 12v batteries in series, they are using overkill solar 12v-120AH bms and always stay in balance, even if they were slightly when the reach 100% they are perfectly balanced and same voltage.

I verified this with the xioaxing app, each cell is 3.56v on both batteries, I actually thinking running in parallel will be worse for balancing.
 
Alkaline said:
I have never had a problem running 2 12v batteries in series, they are using overkill solar 12v-120AH bms and always stay in balance, even if they were slightly when the reach 100% they are perfectly balanced and same voltage.

I verified this with the xioaxing app, each cell is 3.56v on both batteries, I actually thinking running in parallel will be worse for balancing.
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Which Chins battery do you have specifically? I like to know which BMS they are using in which ones and they don't always advertise it as they are able to change them to a different one anytime they like.
 
I don't have chins, I have 2 diy batteries. After doing diy, I find its completely not worth the hassle.

My next project is going to be a 48v setup, for that I"m thinking just going with 4x of the budget batts and say the heck with it, It would be quite cheap all things considered.
 
Server rack batteries you also have the option of user serviceable like with Pytes or SOK I forget which but you can't do that in a Chins. If you have an problem, you start over with a new one
 
I am dependent on battery power…I can’t afford magic smoke or an outbuilding with $50k of equipment up in flames.

That being said, I went DIY to ensure communication between my batteries and inverter. If I was positive that the SOKs were going to communicate, I likely would’ve gone that direction.
 
Greenbug said:
Server rack batteries you also have the option of user serviceable like with Pytes or SOK I forget which but you can't do that in a Chins. If you have an problem, you start over with a new one
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At least you're starting over with one out of four, assuming you are ok with a new one being put into the rotation. I'm guessing you are, if you were willing to possibly replace cells in a 48v rack battery.

Some of the 12v lifepo4 brands have cases that are easily opened with screws, and bolted cells (vs welded). Just gotta look around. SOK has a 12v serviceable battery, as tested by none other than @Will Prowse

 
Alkaline said:
My next project is going to be a 48v setup, for that I"m thinking just going with 4x of the budget batts and say the heck with it,
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I’ve considered the same but chickened out due to the balance concerns mentioned. I haven’t seen much on the forum, good or bad, from folks with real experience using 4 of those in series.

I tore my rotator cuff getting my 48V server rack battery in place and moving 4 lighter batteries instead is of interest for obvious reasons ?.

After surgical repair of my shoulder I hung a chain hoist in the basement to lift the server rack one when necessary.

Please let us know if they get out of balance or if any other issues arise.
 
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Hello, just my 2 cents. I have 8 dumb batteries 2p4s at 48v. No communication with the Growatt. They take more space, and require more cabling joy. So here are some facts to take in consideration. The Growatt and many other AIO inverters don't have a built in shunt, so they can not guesstimate the SOC of dumb batteries, I use a smart shunt for that, is a BT device and has an app to monitor the SOC and works like a charm, case solve. Series Parallel for me is practical, simpler in some ways, and if a battery goes bad it can be replaced easily. Balancing, is and issue with any of these batteries, including server type, but with the server type you get a smart BMS that takes care of balancing (within limitations), you can also use the AIO dashboard if you own a data logger or the tiny built in screen to get a glance of everything that is going on at the moment, voltage, SOC, even balancing status. They are great but pricey. If you just need backup power and lots of it, the drop-ins will give it to you and they do it well at a more affordable price tag. If you must have the server type, they will do well, at a price. I chose drop-ins and don't look forward to do their semi annual manual balancing, is long and tedious, but I saved approx. $2000.00 by going with them. Beware though, some manufacturers will cut corners, and produce shady products and some are fire hazards, hold their feet to the fire, I had 2 battery capacity issues and got refunded but still get the advertised capacity out of the bank. Deal with sellers that honor their warranty terms and post the bad ones here! I would ask what is more important for you. For me more capacity is more important at this time.
 
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This is apropos for me, as I've just started looking into doing this exact thing, four 12V batteries in series to make a 48V bank. Even when you factor in some extra cabling and a battery equalizer/balancer, it looks like you can still come out significantly ahead, how much depends on what sales are currently running on each type of battery. Earlier this year I saw some server racks (big name brand, I forget which) going for only $1400. That's a pretty good deal, even adding $125 for shipping. Definitely a single server rack battery would make a cleaner installation, but the form factor is kind of wonky if you don't want a huge wide, deep component sitting in your room. It would be a lot nicer, IMHO, for those who only need one such battery, to have the same factor upright against the wall. Not sure if that is recommended for any of the standard server rack batteries. Wall mount or otherwise vertical form factors seem much harder to come by and at a premium price. Having four 12V batteries gives a lot more options in terms of physical arrangement.
 
cs1234 said:
To be fair the Chins 12v batteries probably won't keep themselves balanced internally either.. :ROFLMAO:
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I got 8 dumb ones in series parallel at 48v and they stay pretty much balanced, unless there is an issue with them, I had 2 with issues, lower capacity but still had the advertised capacity and got refunded, so no a bad deal. Some manufacturers are better than others. I do a manual balance every 6 months and is long and tedious but worth the money I saved for their purchase. (y)
 
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Alkaline said:
I have never had a problem running 2 12v batteries in series, they are using overkill solar 12v-120AH bms and always stay in balance, even if they were slightly when the reach 100% they are perfectly balanced and same voltage.

I verified this with the xioaxing app, each cell is 3.56v on both batteries, I actually thinking running in parallel will be worse for balancing.
Click to expand...

past performance does not indicate future results
 
Alkaline said:
I fail to understand this server rack form factor, its heavy and not cheap, you have to buy racks. Only thing I can say its looks cool, and I work at a data center so thumbs up for that, But even the cheapest one around is going to run almost $1800 by the time you add shipping.

Vs

4x Chins/zoom/redodo 100ah are under $1200 shipped from there sites.

For what I understand most people aren't even doing the inverter communication bit so I fail to understand the appeal. I would be if these were significantly cheaper but they are not.

so what am I not understanding here?
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I'm had the same question.
You get the 24V 200AH versions from those for like $1400-1500 delivered - which is 5kWH, same as the server rack - no wiring.

The form factor is smaller then the server racks. I mean a lot smaller - one battery is only about half the volume of racks - similar weight - but much less boxy.

For instance - when you want to build a 20kWH system you buy 4x 24v 200AH - you can do 48V 2S2P and save about $1600 vs a Rack.

I got the Chins batteries for my RV - since they fit underneath the couch - I can put 4 batteries there - while the rack batteries - I would be limited to two.
 
JoeHam said:
I’ve considered the same but chickened out due to the balance concerns mentioned. I haven’t seen much on the forum, good or bad, from folks with real experience using 4 of those in series.
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The 24V version of those manufacturers - is similar cheap. You can either rig a 24V direct system or do two batteries in series for 48V- which is not a big deal - I wouldn't trust 4 batteries in series - but two.
 
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