Daly BMS problems... I think

[YahwehisKing]

I have a 16s 280ah build all new eve cells grade A so I didn't top balance -_- same reason as most now "brand new, grade A, will prowse recommendation and advice.." I'm using a 100amp 16s Daly with UART, and a 3k Growwatt lvm es I believe. I don't know if the BMS is dead a few things makes me think it's not, I get same voltage on P- and B-. The cell harness is correct and goes up in the correct increments, my Growwatt says it's charging, at first the solar was charging and then would rest and go and rest and go but with no errors or faults I disconnected everything and reconnected and there doesn't seem to be that issue any more . My thing is my Bluetooth app reads incorrect data and I can't connect via USB I can establish a port but no communication occurs so I don't know if the cells are being balanced or equally charged. I was reading the cells this morning and the last cell and first cell will read 3.5-3.7 whiler charging but the others at the same time are 3.45 and rising. I don't know if that's a problem and the BMS isn't working properly or what Ill attach pics

 

[YahwehisKing]

Bump Bump Bump

I'm not being lazy guys, I'm using the newest of PC master and every other solution I've read on here I can't find anyone with similar issue. My harness is correct voltages are the same across both leads. I'm super off grid and really need to know if I'm about to damage my investment. Any help is much appreciated.

 

[YahwehisKing]

Someone PLEASE HELP!!! I depend on this system for all electrical way off grid, I was using SLA but switched. I really want to make sure I don't destroy this system and waste all this money which was a hard spend to begin with. This is not a hobby..... I keep searching and searching I can't find ANYONE with the same problem.........

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

if you have 3.7 at one cell and 3.45 at other cells then they are either way out of balance or you have a wiring issue. if your connections are not clean, tight with good contact you will have serious losses and wonky readings same goes for the BMS's harness they must have clean solid connections.
I use the DALY 16s 100 amp units, 3 units paralleled at the buss bars and I have noticed that one pack was always wonky. a little testing showed that I had not gotten a good top balance on that pack and I am awaiting spring to tear it apart and rebalance that pack. the other two are rock solid.

what data is your bluetooth reading that is incorrect? how do you know its wrong? (are you backchecking with a multi meter or something?)

I will be in and out depending upon time so answer the above two questions and I will get back as soon as I can.

 

[YahwehisKing]

if you have 3.7 at one cell and 3.45 at other cells then they are either way out of balance or you have a wiring issue. if your connections are not clean, tight with good contact you will have serious losses and wonky readings same goes for the BMS's harness they must have clean solid connections.
I use the DALY 16s 100 amp units, 3 units paralleled at the buss bars and I have noticed that one pack was always wonky. a little testing showed that I had not gotten a good top balance on that pack and I am awaiting spring to tear it apart and rebalance that pack. the other two are rock solid.

what data is your bluetooth reading that is incorrect? how do you know its wrong? (are you backchecking with a multi meter or something?)

I will be in and out depending upon time so answer the above two questions and I will get back as soon as I can.

Thankyou very much for responding !!

The reading of 3.7 at the first and last cell was only when pv charge is high. While under load they all have the same voltage, is that supposed to happen?

Right now all cells are sitting at 3.326 except cell 1 and 16 which vary between 3.324-3.326 but I figure that's visual consumption?

The Bluetooth shows 26.4v and 15amp charge. Measuring P- and B- with a multimeter they read 53.1 and the temp are 0-10-20-30-40-50-60-70 which looks to be default data
But nothing it says is legit and I can't operate it at all no buttons work except back

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

OK there is something wrong as that screenshot of the "status" should show you individual cell voltages with one temp reading. You only have one temp sensor...how does it come up with 10?

I would try reloading the app as it makes me think that the app is messing up. Did you set the parameters for individual cell voltage on the protect screen? (3.65) you should never see 3.7 volts if the bms is set correctly and operating. and you need to top balance regardless of how good the cells are or are not.

 

[DerpsyDoodler]

Maybe he downloaded the wrong app?

 

[YahwehisKing]

OK there is something wrong as that screenshot of the "status" should show you individual cell voltages with one temp reading. You only have one temp sensor...how does it come up with 10?

I would try reloading the app as it makes me think that the app is messing up. Did you set the parameters for individual cell voltage on the protect screen? (3.65) you should never see 3.7 volts if the bms is set correctly and operating. and you need to top balance regardless of how good the cells are or are not.

Nope didn't set anything as I had no access to any settings. Well the day I posted this I also purchased an overkill BMS and got it yesterday, got everything set up about 3hra ago and that Daly was definitely not working. The first and last cells were definitely taking almost all the charge and threw them out of balance.
My cell 15 Is sitting at almost .2v diff

Will needs to make a new vid then stating that even if you buy grade A cells you need to stop balance.

 

[DerpsyDoodler]

Nope didn't set anything as I had no access to any settings. Well the day I posted this I also purchased an overkill BMS and got it yesterday, got everything set up about 3hra ago and that Daly was definitely not working. The first and last cells were definitely taking almost all the charge and threw them out of balance.
My cell 15 Is sitting at almost .2v diff

Will needs to make a new vid then stating that even if you buy grade A cells you need to stop balance.

There are some details to be aware of if you don't manually top balance. The idea is to let the BMS top balance them as charge reaches full over several charge/discharge cycles. This happens over time and by letting charge rate drop low enough so passive balancing has time to make a difference. Of course, this assumes that your terminal/bus bar connections are clean and well contacted.

 

[YahwehisKing]

There are some details to be aware of if you don't manually top balance. The idea is to let the BMS top balance them as charge reaches full over several charge/discharge cycles. This happens over time and by letting charge rate drop low enough so passive balancing has time to make a difference. Of course, this assumes that your terminal/bus bar connections are clean and well contacted.

Lol that's what I've been reading/watching about for the last hr, disable charge balance so the BMS continually balances, also would disconnecting solar for a day or two help? So there isn't much charge going in I use at max 500 wall and that's when the ovens on my steady rate is 30watts. My connections are good lol beside the magic grease i hear of now and then.

 

[DerpsyDoodler]

That'sa lotta spaghetti.

You're not supposed to disable balance on charge. disable balance on discharge and only allow balancing over around 3.35v

 

[YahwehisKing]

That'sa lotta spaghetti.

You're not supposed to disable balance on charge. disable balance on discharge and only allow balancing over around 3.35v

Lol look at my first setup with the Daly even bigger plate of pasta.

I disabled balance during charge according to this vid

says to do it so that balance happens during "idle"

I'm experiencing lockout happening though I'm not sure why voltages aren't crazy or anything no overvolt no under no temp or anything is it because I'm playing with settings to much?

 

[wholybee]

The passive balancing in a BMS takes a looooong time. It might take weeks or months getting it just a little closer every day. It is intended only to keep the pack in balance.

To make it work better, you need a longer Absorption time. Victron chargers let you set this, others might as well. So, instead of charging to 3.65v per cell and then stopping, you want the charger to charge to 3.4v per cell, hold that for some time (possibly hours depending on the size of the battery), and then stop. All that time the voltage is held at 3.4v per cell, the BMS will be balancing. If you charge to 3.65v, the balance time will be much shorter, because the battery charges from 3.35v to 3.65v fairly quickly.

There is a formula for how long to hold in absorption. I don't recall for sure, but I think it is 20min per 100Ah. So a 300Ah battery would absorb for an hour, or a 600Ah for 2 hours.

You should top balance manually. The overkill solar manual is pretty clear on that point, describing why and how. With your pack charged as it is, and with a 10A power supply, it shouldn't take more than half a day, maybe only a couple hours.

 

[YahwehisKing]

The passive balancing in a BMS takes a looooong time. It might take weeks or months getting it just a little closer every day. It is intended only to keep the pack in balance.

To make it work better, you need a longer Absorption time. Victron chargers let you set this, others might as well. So, instead of charging to 3.65v per cell and then stopping, you want the charger to charge to 3.4v per cell, hold that for some time (possibly hours depending on the size of the battery), and then stop. All that time the voltage is held at 3.4v per cell, the BMS will be balancing. If you charge to 3.65v, the balance time will be much shorter, because the battery charges from 3.35v to 3.65v fairly quickly.

There is a formula for how long to hold in absorption. I don't recall for sure, but I think it is 20min per 100Ah. So a 300Ah battery would absorb for an hour, or a 600Ah for 2 hours.

You should top balance manually. The overkill solar manual is pretty clear on that point, describing why and how. With your pack charged as it is, and with a 10A power supply, it shouldn't take more than half a day, maybe only a couple hours.

Here's my only problem and why I really avoided top balancing even though I bought the recommended 10amp charger on here. I don't have shore power I'm completely off grid...I have a 6500watt predator gene but other than that the SLA batts I have it should be charge those then use them with inverter or gene with the 10amp charger. If Ido can I disconnect the BMS harness and put charge leads on each cell while they're still connected in series ??

 

[YahwehisKing]

The passive balancing in a BMS takes a looooong time. It might take weeks or months getting it just a little closer every day. It is intended only to keep the pack in balance.

To make it work better, you need a longer Absorption time. Victron chargers let you set this, others might as well. So, instead of charging to 3.65v per cell and then stopping, you want the charger to charge to 3.4v per cell, hold that for some time (possibly hours depending on the size of the battery), and then stop. All that time the voltage is held at 3.4v per cell, the BMS will be balancing. If you charge to 3.65v, the balance time will be much shorter, because the battery charges from 3.35v to 3.65v fairly quickly.

There is a formula for how long to hold in absorption. I don't recall for sure, but I think it is 20min per 100Ah. So a 300Ah battery would absorb for an hour, or a 600Ah for 2 hours.

You should top balance manually. The overkill solar manual is pretty clear on that point, describing why and how. With your pack charged as it is, and with a 10A power supply, it shouldn't take more than half a day, maybe only a couple hours.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

Maybe he downloaded the wrong app?

Very possible, DALY apps are wildly varying as to their ability and functionality. some of them out there are flat out bonkers.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

Bro your best bet is a solid top balance, even if you have to use a genset to do it. haul the batteries down to the closest place with power and the 10 amp charger you bought and pay someone for the power to top balance them properly. if you have your setting wrong they will never balance.
I have had one perfectly balanced pack go out of balance due to setting the balance settings wrong. if the setting are wrong you will slowly lose capacity (not permanently thank god) but what will happen is as the top and bottom get further apart, they will cause the BMS to shutdown to protect the pack. for instance if not in balance, one cell will hit 3.65 and shut off charging...and balance at the same time while one of the cells is at 3.35 (for instance) then with each succeeding cycle the gap will grow and you will get less capacity with each succeeding charge until you cannot charge at all.

TOP BALANCE PROPERLY, reload or update your app, it should show a voltage for each cell or pack. it should show one temperature and only one as you only have one temp sensor for the DALY BMS.

is you have a separate smaller battery pack that you can use, then use it at a reduced level to TOP BALANCE. I cannot say it enough...TOP BALANCE. once you have done that 90% of your issues should be eliminated. anything after that is an APP issue. I have 3 16s packs and on 2P4S pack as my backup power source. the 48 volt packs take care of the house, the 12 volt pack runs my battery heaters, I can use for TOP BALANCING or as an emergency backup (for the essentials) I use the same APP for both 16s and 4S packs this is on an I Phone. until last year I used a android but my phone self destructed and I used a friends old I phone to run things. there were differences in the APPS and I had some issues with the first APP i loaded for the android... I loaded a different app and all was good. I has some minor issues with the apple APP but overall it has worked to date, either will work if you get the correct app.

As always, good luck and keep asking questions, provide lots of photos and as much info as you can.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

Nope didn't set anything as I had no access to any settings. Well the day I posted this I also purchased an overkill BMS and got it yesterday, got everything set up about 3hra ago and that Daly was definitely not working. The first and last cells were definitely taking almost all the charge and threw them out of balance.
My cell 15 Is sitting at almost .2v diff

Will needs to make a new vid then stating that even if you buy grade A cells you need to stop balance.

sorry I saw this after the earlier posts, once again TOP BALANCE and good luck!

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

That'sa lotta spaghetti.

Wait until you have three 16s packs I am still waiting upon definitive proof of if I can shorten the balance leads to keep the spaghetti to a minimum. I had to extend all of my leads as a 16S pack is long no matter what you do, as a result I had to "coil" and zip tie some of the leads to keep them tidy. Would much rather trim them and be rid fo them but afraid that they might not read correctly if I do... any good word Brother?

 

[DerpsyDoodler]

Wait until you have three 16s packs I am still waiting upon definitive proof of if I can shorten the balance leads to keep the spaghetti to a minimum. I had to extend all of my leads as a 16S pack is long no matter what you do, as a result I had to "coil" and zip tie some of the leads to keep them tidy. Would much rather trim them and be rid fo them but afraid that they might not read correctly if I do... any good word Brother?

I'd be concerned with shortening the leads, too, although I read somewhere in this forum it may not be that much of a difference. You can determine the resistance in the wire and calculate the voltage drop for the length. There should be almost no current running through the leads under normal operation, anyway. Maybe start a new thread with the question or search to see if the question was already answered somewhere. I think it was.