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Recommendations for off-grid solar setup expandable to on-grid later.

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tacomaguy20

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So I was looking to start off with a smaller off grid system that was tied into a critical loads panel and use AC power to supplement my solar panels. As I increase my solar panels and reduce my AC usage, eventually I'd like to export to the grid once my system was large enough (and I felt like dealing with the city/power company permits). I was wondering how to do this without buying multiple off grid (and then on grid) inverters but also keep the initial costs low? Am I asking for too much? I imagine I could do this with the EG4 18kvp Hybrid inverter but buying that inverter + panels (and maybe batteries) is a larger investment than I want to spend initially. I was considering buying their 6000xp model (then maybe getting another at some point) but am I then stuck with a strictly off grid system having to replace one or two inverters I no longer need? Or is there a way to tie the off grid inverters into the grid by buying a cheap growatt down the line or something? Anybody have any ideas?
 
The world of off grid and grid tie are really quite different and the equipment for one does not readily lend itself to the other. There is the hybrid units but as you noticed they are more expensive. Yes, you can run an un-permitted pirate setup that will parallel with grid and run as Zero export and hope to not get caught.
 
Well I think it is a time for a bit of reality check.

1) If going OFF GRID meaning that you are NOT pushing anything to the grid BUT may use Grid Power as an AC Input or charging batteries.
This requires less permits if any (depends on where you are) and is generally much less hassles AND COST (permits, inspections etc = $$$).
Many Insurance Companies will still require electrical inspections and may have other requirements for coverage. Some companies are "Battery Shy" simply because they are stupid and stuck in historical invalid info. Boy do we see some stupid come from insurance co's & local "Governing Mentals".

2) Grid Connected for Feed-In to Grid is far more complicated because you will need inspections & certified equipment as well as permits & such and THAT CAN EASILY ADD 25-40% ON TOP OF COST. Largely due to Certification requirements & if they insist on Commercial Installations you are paying the Big Bux for that. AGAIN - Depends on WHERE you are and BE READY FOR DUM-DUM !

The Good News:
Plan FORWARD and build with an eye towards the future to grow the system. With LFP Batteries, you can add more later if/when wanted WITHOUT ILL EFFECTS unlike the old Lead Acid battery days ! So YES you can add batteries later without any loss. You can add more solar or Inverter in parallel as well as your needs/wants grow.

MOST IMPORTANTLY - DO NOT BUY ANYTHING TILL YOU HAVE A SOLID PLAN !
Know "what" direction you are going in.
Know what the Local/Regional rules & requirements are (both ON & OFF grid options)
KNOW What your Insurance Company will need / want ! (they can be a real PITA)
When you KNOW what is legal/not and what you can do THEN start considering the hardware.
Be sure to know what your usage is / will be and then add 20% ON TOP ! (everyone ALWAYS undershoots)
Be CERTAIN to select equipment that meets TODAYS Needs but that can handle the future expansions.

BE CAUTIOUS !!! While some equipment may seem a good deal with lots of features etc, it's best to understand it ! This takes a while. COST is NOT a measure of Quality & Cheaper does not mean good value. AIO's may seem good idea & deal and can be BUT NOT IN ALL SITUATIONS (quite a few actually).
 
Frankly I wouldn't put much effort into grid export. Just stick with "off grid" with AC input for those loads when solar/battery isn't enough.

That's my plan if we ever move to a homestead. Heck of a lot easier and cheaper to set up. I even have 1:1 net metering.
 
ALSO of Note. A LOT of Power Co's are fiddling with the Feed In Tariffs and "Service Fees" which are mostly negating the value of feeding in and actually getting anything from them. It really is best to be OFF GRID or what more people are doing now which is running 2 separate power-panels, 1 powered from Grid for the usual stuff - the extras and then running a Power-Panel from Solar/Battery that handles the "Needed Criticals" like Fridge/Freezer, Sump Pump, Heat/AC systems.
 
Steve_S said:
Well I think it is a time for a bit of reality check.

1) If going OFF GRID meaning that you are NOT pushing anything to the grid BUT may use Grid Power as an AC Input or charging batteries.
This requires less permits if any (depends on where you are) and is generally much less hassles AND COST (permits, inspections etc = $$$).
Many Insurance Companies will still require electrical inspections and may have other requirements for coverage. Some companies are "Battery Shy" simply because they are stupid and stuck in historical invalid info. Boy do we see some stupid come from insurance co's & local "Governing Mentals".

2) Grid Connected for Feed-In to Grid is far more complicated because you will need inspections & certified equipment as well as permits & such and THAT CAN EASILY ADD 25-40% ON TOP OF COST. Largely due to Certification requirements & if they insist on Commercial Installations you are paying the Big Bux for that. AGAIN - Depends on WHERE you are and BE READY FOR DUM-DUM !

The Good News:
Plan FORWARD and build with an eye towards the future to grow the system. With LFP Batteries, you can add more later if/when wanted WITHOUT ILL EFFECTS unlike the old Lead Acid battery days ! So YES you can add batteries later without any loss. You can add more solar or Inverter in parallel as well as your needs/wants grow.

MOST IMPORTANTLY - DO NOT BUY ANYTHING TILL YOU HAVE A SOLID PLAN !
Know "what" direction you are going in.
Know what the Local/Regional rules & requirements are (both ON & OFF grid options)
KNOW What your Insurance Company will need / want ! (they can be a real PITA)
When you KNOW what is legal/not and what you can do THEN start considering the hardware.
Be sure to know what your usage is / will be and then add 20% ON TOP ! (everyone ALWAYS undershoots)
Be CERTAIN to select equipment that meets TODAYS Needs but that can handle the future expansions.

BE CAUTIOUS !!! While some equipment may seem a good deal with lots of features etc, it's best to understand it ! This takes a while. COST is NOT a measure of Quality & Cheaper does not mean good value. AIO's may seem good idea & deal and can be BUT NOT IN ALL SITUATIONS (quite a few actually).
Click to expand...
Okay so what is your recommendation for how to configure the system?
 
SparkyJJO said:
Frankly I wouldn't put much effort into grid export. Just stick with "off grid" with AC input for those loads when solar/battery isn't enough.

That's my plan if we ever move to a homestead. Heck of a lot easier and cheaper to set up. I even have 1:1 net metering.
Click to expand...
I'm paying over 400 dollars a year just for connection fees, which I'd like to help negate by exporting power. Last year I paid about $1500 for electric because I've cut my electric usage significantly to get it down to this amount. That total is not much compared to other people's power usage I'm sure, but when nearly a 1/3 of what I paid is strictly in connection fees, that sucks. Ultimately I'd like to not have a power bill at all. May not be realistic but the goal is to get it as close to zero as possible.
 
tacomaguy20 said:
I'm paying over 400 dollars a year just for connection fees, which I'd like to help negate by exporting power. Last year I paid about $1500 for electric because I've cut my electric usage significantly to get it down to this amount. That total is not much compared to other people's power usage I'm sure, but when nearly a 1/3 of what I paid is strictly in connection fees, that sucks. Ultimately I'd like to not have a power bill at all. May not be realistic but the goal is to get it as close to zero as possible.
Click to expand...
You should check with your local utility.
A lot of times it doesn't apply to the standard fees. Only applies to the usage charges.
 
if you start off-grid and don’t get inspections, I doubt you will ever be able to use any of that equipment in an grid-tied system. Because I doubt any installer would touch anything already installed without the proper inspections when initially put in. Insurance and license considerations
 
if you are new to the off grid world . I would like you to check out a brand rocksolar .They have a wide option of off grid system that might suite to your needs.

Thanks
 
I am using zumax 6.2 kw hybbrid inverters work great connected to 5 kw step up/ down transformer to create 120/240 split phase. On 1 installation i paralleled 2 3kw transformer and have 4 120 outlet and 4 240 outlets
 
tacomaguy20 said:
So I was looking to start off with a smaller off grid system that was tied into a critical loads panel and use AC power to supplement my solar panels. As I increase my solar panels and reduce my AC usage, eventually I'd like to export to the grid once my system was large enough (and I felt like dealing with the city/power company permits). I was wondering how to do this without buying multiple off grid (and then on grid) inverters but also keep the initial costs low? Am I asking for too much? I imagine I could do this with the EG4 18kvp Hybrid inverter but buying that inverter + panels (and maybe batteries) is a larger investment than I want to spend initially. I was considering buying their 6000xp model (then maybe getting another at some point) but am I then stuck with a strictly off grid system having to replace one or two inverters I no longer need? Or is there a way to tie the off grid inverters into the grid by buying a cheap growatt down the line or something? Anybody have any ideas?
Click to expand...
Grid tie is dying ever so slowly.

Eventually the power companies will force people to pay to export to the grid.

Sarcasm, but you might get the point. Go off grid and forget about export. Build in stages if necessary, the first 90% of usage is easy to cover.
 
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