Expedition plus AGM deep cycle batteries....anyone use them?

[Willbiker]

Hi all. I want to replace my leisure batteries with agm batteries for my off grid solar setup for my caravan.

Has anyone had any experience with Expedition plus agm batteries? They seem good value for money and read well.....

https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/12v-130ah-expedition-plus-agm-leisure-battery-exp12-130/

Anyone got one?

 

[Willbiker]

Bump!

 

[Substrate]

Looks to be a pure-lead agm. That's a good choice for your location, since the lower internal resistance of pure-lead has a better charge acceptance rate and can charge faster. On discharge, a pure-lead agm also holds its voltage higher under heavy load.

Normally a "conventional agm" made of recycled lead has higher internal impedance, and as such can't be charged any faster than about 0.25C. But pure-lead can surpass this rate easily.

Pure-lead can easily handle 0.5C easily, which would be ideal under cloudy / intermittent sunshine climates such as the UK. Sooo ... that 130ah pure-lead could handle 65A easily - meaning for a nominal 12v panel, that would mean you could run a 1KW panel. So don't be afraid to run with a large array if you have the space and means for it.

But by all means ask the dealer if indeed 0.5C charge rate is possible with that battery - else they may be playing word-games with "Pure Primary Lead". But after looking at their recommendations for AGM charge and care, they appear to be legit. Maybe next time I cross the pond I'll have to visit them.

I've always recommended to those in the UK that want to run lead-acid to run pure-lead agm to take advantage of this when the sun does actually peek out from the clouds - allows you to nab a lot of current while you have it available if you have the panel power available.

My long-winded way of saying looks ok to me...

 

[Willbiker]

Looks to be a pure-lead agm. That's a good choice for your location, since the lower internal resistance of pure-lead has a better charge acceptance rate and can charge faster. On discharge, a pure-lead agm also holds its voltage higher under heavy load.

Normally a "conventional agm" made of recycled lead has higher internal impedance, and as such can't be charged any faster than about 0.25C. But pure-lead can surpass this rate easily.

Pure-lead can easily handle 0.5C easily, which would be ideal under cloudy / intermittent sunshine climates such as the UK. Sooo ... that 130ah pure-lead could handle 65A easily - meaning for a nominal 12v panel, that would mean you could run a 1KW panel. So don't be afraid to run with a large array if you have the space and means for it.

But by all means ask the dealer if indeed 0.5C charge rate is possible with that battery - else they may be playing word-games with "Pure Primary Lead". But after looking at their recommendations for AGM charge and care, they appear to be legit. Maybe next time I cross the pond I'll have to visit them.

I've always recommended to those in the UK that want to run lead-acid to run pure-lead agm to take advantage of this when the sun does actually peek out from the clouds - allows you to nab a lot of current while you have it available if you have the panel power available.

My long-winded way of saying looks ok to me...

Thanks very much for taking the time to look into them and reply in such detail! I have a 400w array which is plenty of umph for my caravan holidays and will peak at about 36 amps input to the batteries in the blazing sun. I think I will go for a couple of these Expedition plus AGMS.

Thanks again

 

[Short_Shot]

I just want to point out that there's zero reason why recycled lead can't be "pure".

The issue is quality of the recycling process.

Not that it changes the context here.

 

[Willbiker]

For a novice, the stats can be confusing so I have been relying on reviews to help choose which AGM deep cycle to go for. The xtreme 110ah AGM seems a popular choice on various forums however it looks to be duel purpose which puts me off as I'm unsure if it will function as well as a specific deep cycle battery. These expedition plus agms have a high cycle rate of 700 at 50% discharge and from glancing at the stat sheet and trying to compare to other more expensive agm battery stats, I think they look to be ok. Sods law that there are no reviews on these batteries anywhere! This concerns me but I think I will still go ahead.

 

[mikefitz]

Alpha Batteries situated in the UK are a (mostly) online trader in batteries. Collect from their depot ( North Manchester) for a little more discounted. Good to deal with and fast delivery.
Now the not so good news.
Their battery warranty does not cover loss of capacity. Charging AGM with solar is an issue as often the current available is too low to charge effectively . Typically your 400 watts of panels will be charging at a maximum of just over 20 amps, perhaps 25 amps.
To stop a capacity walk-down the AGM need a charge current of at least 0.2C, between 40 and 50 amps for your two batteries.
Also under charging will also create a capacity walk down. If you refer to the charge graphs given in the specifications you can see many hours are needed for a full charge.
If you treat well with shallow discharges then expect 3 years before loss of capacity will become apparent. With less than ideal care they may reach end of useful life earlier .

My advice would be to spend a little more and consider a lithium battery. You won't need the same capacity, even single 120 Ah lithium will be an adequate replacement for 240 Ah of lead.

Mike

 

[Willbiker]

Alpha Batteries situated in the UK are a (mostly) online trader in batteries. Collect from their depot ( North Manchester) for a little more discounted. Good to deal with and fast delivery.
Now the not so good news.
Their battery warranty does not cover loss of capacity. Charging AGM with solar is an issue as often the current available is too low to charge effectively . Typically your 400 watts of panels will be charging at a maximum of just over 20 amps, perhaps 25 amps.
To stop a capacity walk-down the AGM need a charge current of at least 0.2C, between 40 and 50 amps for your two batteries.
Also under charging will also create a capacity walk down. If you refer to the charge graphs given in the specifications you can see many hours are needed for a full charge.
If you treat well with shallow discharges then expect 3 years before loss of capacity will become apparent. With less than ideal care they may reach end of useful life earlier .

My advice would be to spend a little more and consider a lithium battery. You won't need the same capacity, even single 120 Ah lithium will be an adequate replacement for 240 Ah of lead.

Mike

Thanks Mike. I have Epever Tracer mppt charge controller which I understand can have its settings adjusted to match the charge requirements of the battery. I cant bring myself to pay 700 quid for a lithium battery :S do you think I'm better off going with cheaper sealed lead acid batteries instead? or maybe gel?

Here is a snapshot of my controllers stats when in full blazing sun.. I can hit 30 amps almost however on a cloudy day, I get about 8a to 15a charge going into the battery and it sounds like AGM wouldnt appreciate this charge rate long term.

I currently have 2x 120ah sealed lead acid batteries from ebay which have lasted only a year before dropping in capacity. Maybe i should just increase my bank with a couple more cheap 70 quid ebay jobbies and expect to replace them more frequently.

 

[mikefitz]

I often recommend Varta LFD90 a low profile sealed lead acid or a Yuasa L36 EFB, both these batteries exceeded 200 charge/discharge in independent tests. It might not sound a lot of cycles but the typical 'leisure battery' is only good for 20 to 50 cycles.
The Yuasa L36EFB is also available from Halfords branded as HLB700 at £110 ( and discount with the trade card).

The LFD90 and the L36EFB from online outlets like Alpha batteries, £105, £120.

All things considered the Halfords deal seems good even without discount ( and they tend to be less fussy if there are problems within the warranty period).

Mike