The plan so far, thoughts and suggestions please

[ThaiTaffy]

So as the forum is slowly but surely feeding my OCD I'm begining to come up with a plan for my solar project at the end of the year. The finer details I can cover closer to install but deciding the big ticket items is my focus at the moment.

First and foremost is the inverter, I was looking at the Deye SUN-5K-SG05LP-EU at first as this is on the approved list of on-grid inverters for Thailand but after reading posts and multiple comments I've seen by @SeaGal I looked at Solis and the S6-EH1P6K-L-PLUS took my eye this is also on the approved list.
Thailand has a max grid feed of 5kw so many of the higher KW models don't meet their approved list and the fact the Solis is 6kw would give me a tad more headroom, so here's my first question I'll likely only use 1 mppt on either inverter at first and stick to off-grid then get the system approved after installation then I can add the 2nd string at a later date to feed into the grid once the application goes through can I effectively use them off-grid/hybrid to begin with? can anyone see any issues with either of these inverters? The Solis offers more connectivity without having to pay and it's a few $100 cheaper but then there's battery support.

My original idea was to build my own batteries but I've seen reports that the warranty wouldn't apply if DIY batteries are involved, I only have a few thousand to spend on storage so I wanted the most bang for my buck as I possibly could preferably sticking to the Thai market as they're cheaper than ali for DIY or pre built as far as I can see I'll need to go through the supported lists and not only chose based on price but also cooling solutions.

Now last part is the panels I get the gist of sizing voc, amperage and so on but I'm thrown by bifacial panels, with such a low declination will I see any benefit from them? Is there any downside to them? Current plan is to fabricate mobile ground mounts as we still haven't decided where the best place to mount them will be on the farm/forest. I saw wills video last week about his new favourite panels and noted what he said about them working better raised but we don't get snow and the ground is mainly red clay so apart from heat I don't see much being reflected.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Quattrohead]

For solar panels these days I just think you aim for the best bang for your buck. The only physical factor I really see is whether they are too big for you to handle in your situation. Size is either going to be easy to handle on your own around or under 400 watts or 500 watts plus tend to be a two-man job.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

For solar panels these days I just think you aim for the best bang for your buck.

That's the thing ATM they are all pretty much the same price $68 be it 375w mono or 550w bifacial or 600w mono that's why I don't know what to get.

The only physical factor I really see is whether they are too big for you to handle in your situation. Size is either going to be easy to handle on your own around or under 400 watts or 500 watts plus tend to be a two-man job.

Yep I lugged two 45lbs panels up a ladder onto my roof on my own but the larger panels I'm looking at now are closer to 60lbs each and I'm most likely going to want 16 though it will likely be a mobile ground mount system to begin with.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

All around $70

 

[ThaiTaffy]

Another thing though it might be a hard question as I'm more bias to the features of the solis but honestly which is the better AiO the Deye or the Solis?

 

[DIYrich]

There is some discussion about vertical mounting bifacial panels with east-west exposure. Don't know how it would work out with the sun higher in the sky.

If you put white rock under the panels, you nay get some benefit.

Or, mount them high enough, and farm crops that prefer less sun.

 

[Brucey]

The bifacials will let some light through so can be nice to use as shade canopy/pergola etc underneath. The single sided won't. At the same price might as well go for the bifacials.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

There is some discussion about vertical mounting bifacial panels with east-west exposure. Don't know how it would work out with the sun higher in the sky.

I'm kinda leaning towards trying out some rudimentary solar tracking with folding gate linear actuators but it's a pipe dream atm, idea is to place two stings side by side facing south then have the wings on the actuators to either tilt them up or down so east or west the high angle of the sun here makes vertical panels almost useless

If you put white rock under the panels, you nay get some benefit.

They're likely to be placed in our paddy fields to begin with so I wouldn't want to empty rock in there though I could line the top of the frame with mylar or some form of reflective material

Or, mount them high enough, and farm crops that prefer less sun.

I don't really want to go much higher than a few ft as we get some pretty strong storms blow through from time to time and the higher they are on a mobile ground mount the more likely they are to catch the wind.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

The bifacials will let some light through so can be nice to use as shade canopy/pergola etc underneath. The single sided won't. At the same price might as well go for the bifacials.

That's not a bad idea Tnx I'm still really undecided on placement yet but I'm ;okely just going to fab a ground mount for now and try them at various points on the farm till I come up with a permanent solution from my rough guesstimate I'll have two 4.5m² strings that could technically be used as shade on the garden if I go with your idea.

 

[Brucey]

That's not a bad idea Tnx I'm still really undecided on placement yet but I'm ;okely just going to fab a ground mount for now and try them at various points on the farm till I come up with a permanent solution from my rough guesstimate I'll have two 4.5m² strings that could technically be used as shade on the garden if I go with your idea.

Don't get me wrong the grass under the Aptos I laid down is dying, not enough light to survive. so I'm not sure about having a garden underneath.

 

[Brucey]

I'm kinda leaning towards trying out some rudimentary solar tracking with folding gate linear actuators but it's a pipe dream atm, idea is to place two stings side by side facing south then have the wings on the actuators to either tilt them up or down so east or west the high angle of the sun here makes vertical panels almost useless

They're likely to be placed in our paddy fields to begin with so I wouldn't want to empty rock in there though I could line the top of the frame with mylar or some form of reflective material

I don't really want to go much higher than a few ft as we get some pretty strong storms blow through from time to time and the higher they are on a mobile ground mount the more likely they are to catch the wind.

with panels so cheap now doesn't make sense to go with trackers unless space is critical and sounds like you may have a lot of open paddy fields, maybe locate them near the edges.

 

[OffGridForGood]

I wonder if a north-south running frame line, that tilts east-west set high enough for the patties so you can work under them, partial shade, with the bifacials letting some light through. put linear actuators on them to tilt east-west during the day, program a park-setting - dead level for high wind days so they don't catch much wind. Seems like a lot of plus features.
Maybe a pergola makes good sense with bifacials for a partly shaded area? I still remember installing my very first bi-facial panels on a super hot sunny day; working under them was noticably cooler. Win-Win for a partly shaded sitting area if you can find a way to make that work on your property.

 

[cs1234]

with panels so cheap now doesn't make sense to go with trackers unless space is critical and sounds like you may have a lot of open paddy fields, maybe locate them near the edges.

Probably not a concern where he is, but in some places you are only allowed to install so much panel wattage. A tracker might be nice in those situations to maximize what you can produce from what you are *allowed* to install.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

with panels so cheap now doesn't make sense to go with trackers unless space is critical and sounds like you may have a lot of open paddy fields, maybe locate them near the edges.

So the issue is the perimeter of the paddy fields is covered in endangered trees species' so I can't cut them down there's one spot near the center of the 5 fields that gets continuous light throughout the day but here's the big but. During the summer equinox the sun rises north east and sets north west so with fixed panels pointing south I miss out alot on the morning and evening energy also bear in mind a full tracking system will likely cost me less than $200 to support all 16 panels

 

[OffGridForGood]

Don't get me wrong the grass under the Aptos I laid down is dying, not enough light to survive. so I'm not sure about having a garden underneath.

you put the panels directly on the ground - not just "not enough light" it will be super hot under those panels in the sun.
Check out Agra-voltaics - there are many crops that benefit from partial shade - lettuce for example.
Often the best layout is to space rows of PV to allow some direct light to the plants for part of the day, while keeping these areas cooler at the same time, and reducing water evaporation rates.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

I wonder if a north-south running frame line, that tilts east-west set high enough for the patties so you can work under them, partial shade, with the bifacials letting some light through. put linear actuators on them to tilt east-west during the day, program a park-setting - dead level for high wind days so they don't catch much wind. Seems like a lot of plus features.

That's my idea but i wasn't thinking of placing it that high maybe 1ft till the frame then another ft to the panels

Maybe a pergola makes good sense with bifacials for a partly shaded area? I still remember installing my very first bi-facial panels on a super hot sunny day; working under them was noticably cooler. Win-Win for a partly shaded sitting area if you can find a way to make that work on your property.

It really hard we either have large fruit trees we don't want to cut down or endangered trees we can't cut down

 

[Quattrohead]

But with your sun being so high I'm not sure tracking makes much of a difference, just add an extra panel or two. From your pricing it seems like bifacial is a no-brainer if you're going to be ground mounting them.

 

[Brucey]

So the issue is the perimeter of the paddy fields is covered in endangered trees species' so I can't cut them down there's one spot near the center of the 5 fields that gets continuous light throughout the day but here's the big but. During the summer equinox the sun rises north east and sets north west so with fixed panels pointing south I miss out alot on the morning and evening energy also bear in mind a full tracking system will likely cost me less than $200 to support all 16 panels

Sounds like it makes sense in your case then. What is the distance from the planned array to the charge controller?

 

[ThaiTaffy]

But with your sun being so high I'm not sure tracking makes much of a difference, just add an extra panel or two. From your pricing it seems like bifacial is a no-brainer if you're going to be ground mounting them.

Only now during summer though as we head to winter the sun will drastically drop to the south and in theory we should get better producing days in winter as there's less cloud cover and no rain.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

Sounds like it makes sense in your case then. What is the distance from the planned array to the charge controller?

Likely anywhere from 100-300ft I'm still undecided on where I'm building the room one position has good shading and lays directly beneath our incoming grid power the other spot is closer to the fields but requires a fair bit of alterations to the farms main lines.

 

[OffGridForGood]

depending where in the country you live, Thailand is generally only 15-degrees north of the equator, but the tilt of the earth is 23.5 so you can expect laying your PV at 'about' 15-degree angle to the south will be ideal for March and Sept, and no more than 23.5 degrees off of ideal in Dec and June.
You could lay them level and get pretty good PV all year around, although rain will clean them best if they are not laying flat.
Your idea of just making a mobile mount initially, so you can play with various locations may be the best idea, so you can test different locations during a year of operation and then pick the ideal location for the permanent set up.
I had one PV panel that was damaged during shipping (got a free replacement) - I use this one single panel as a test unit, moving it around and checking how it does in less than ideal locations (like vertical, west facing, south-west facing, east facing etc) I have found this very handy for testing (at low cost) various options around the property during different seasons.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

depending where in the country you live, Thailand is generally only 15-degrees north of the equator, but the tilt of the earth is 23.5 so you can expect laying your PV at 'about' 15-degree angle to the south will be ideal for March and Sept, and no more than 23.5 degrees off of ideal in Dec and June.

I'm at 17° latitude right next to Vientiane the capital of Laos on the river Mekong

You could lay them level and get pretty good PV all year around, although rail will clean them best if they are not laying flat.

It's a very rural area with a high pm10 count so panels will need to be cleaned regularly in the dryer months that's the main reason I don't want to place them on the roof of the house, just too high to effectively clean.

Your idea of just making a mobile mount initially, so you can play with various locations may be the best idea, so you can test different locations during a year of operation and then pick the ideal location for the permanent set up.
I had one PV panel that was damaged during shipping (got a free replacement) - I use this one single panel as a test unit, moving it around and checking how it does in less than ideal locations (like vertical, west facing, south-west facing, east facing etc) I have found this very handy for testing (at low cost) various options around the property during different seasons.

I have my server ups setup atm with two panels at 17° declination and 200° SW and so far I'm smashing any predicted solar forecast I'm getting by a fairly high margin. I also have some smaller panels and small epever charge controllers placed around the farm for controlling solenoids for irrigation so I could try experimenting with those and altering the panel positions.

 

[OffGridForGood]

I hear ya,
it seems no matter what solar calculator I use, actual live-testing is needed to really "know" what I will get on the various areas of the property.
There are just too many variables, from partial shading to local temperatures to reflection on the backs of bi-facials. A test on the actual spot you want to check is the best solution, too bad it takes 12 months to know - yeah but then again a full year means nothing when each winter is different than the last one...yeah it is still a guessing game, but at least a real test with a real panel makes me feel like I know more about a target location.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

Shading is an issue as I'm not that familiar with optimizers and haven't even seen them sold here it's the main reason I've looked at the center of the paddy fields as it's the most barren spot of the land.
Alot of my irrigation solar panels got taken over by trees, just everything grows too fast here, we tried to grow devils lettuce one year when they legalized it and they ended up like Douglas furs.

Panel placement, battery room placement and is the Solis a better fit than the Deye are my top concerns the approved inverter list is pretty much a shambles here as far as I can tell, multiple inverters on it aren't even sold in Asia and Importing anything is only for the mega rich or corrupt.

Edit: just looked them up and found these but not far off the price of a panel

 

[DIYrich]

Might want to consider mounting parallel to the ground to minimize wind load.