Not sure if you've seen the thread where a pair of 18kpvs went berserk and killed a bunch of appliances when a longer crossover cable was accidentally used for the comms instead of the shorter provided straight cable. Any kind of rodent damage to a straight cable could end up with a similar failure so protect it well.
I think it's staring you right in the face that solar is not for you. If you don't want to worry about it, get grid tied. Solar is not a thing where you can just suck down massive amounts of energy for your hot tub without ever thinking about it. Most people doing off grid setups aren't building large conventional houses. If you need a system that can feed multiple residences, you will spend more on buying it, building it and maintaining it than you will putting power poles in and paying for grid power for decades. Remember, this stuff doesn't last forever and will need to get replaced at some point. Also, you live in New York. Your government may complicate things.
That was a crazy thread.
This is great feedback. Thanks! Yes, it will be great to watch your story unfold.Hi @djparnell and welcome to the forum. Well, I can't help you too much right now except for my planning, but feel free to follow my progress over the next year or two. My wife and I are building an off grid barn/garage (36x44) with living quarters over it right now (should be weathertight in July) and then a 40x40 home either late this year or more likely next (contractor availability). We're in midcoast-central Maine and given that our current home just a few miles away just sold quickly, we're going to be living there starting in September, in the barn quarters until the house is built (will be pretty nice barn quarters, so not too much of a hardship). So, we'll be decent test subjects, in a real world situation except that we'll likely be less wasteful than renters (we have a house we rent out on VRBO and renters are often horrible about energy use).
I can say that once you solve the heat problem, off grid appears to be attainable. I have several friends in the area who do it now. We're going with a heat pump (not propane) dryer and electric stove with induction cooktop, and heat pump hot water heater, and even then my math says its perfectly achievable as long as we don't try to heat with electric. Both buildings will have R40 walls, R60 ceilings, triple pane (U-factor 0.18) windows but even then, heat (not AC, as summer brings sun) is the real problem. So, we're installing a propane boiler with hydronic heat, and air source heat pumps for AC and even shoulder season (when the sun cooperates) heat. I see no need for air circulation other than an ERV, which accomplishes that and far more, so I respectfully suggest you rethink heating and consider hydronic, as water is a wonderful heat transfer medium - much more efficient than air.
Where things will get interesting for us is when we also install an air-to-water heat pump, once Mitsubishi releases their new model to the US. We'll then automate the hydronic to switch back and forth between that unit and the propane boiler based on outside air temp (not the biggest factor actually) and sun availability (that's the big factor), as the source of heat for the buffer tank. It may take years to break even on that, but since I gave up golf and avoided a boat I need an expensive hobby.
Where I THINK (we're going to find out soon enough!) many people go astray is a feeling that they need many days of battery backup, no matter what happens. If my math is right, we'll have about 4-4.5 days of battery in the building we're occupying as our primary residence (first the barn quarters, then the house) at just 42KWH of battery, with normal energy use, if we don't use electricity (heat pump) for heat. I'll report back on that through the winter. And if I'm wrong, well, we'll just recharge with a few hours use of the generator, which most people seem to forget or think they need to avoid. If I must recharge even once per week in the worst weeks of the year by running the generator for a few hours, I'm fine with that. It becomes a tool for avoiding a grid connection rather than an emergency backup. Might be worth considering that view. Anyway, once we start the install in a few weeks I'll start a thread in Show and Tell and document what happens.
I would 100% agree with no resistive heat.
I use induction. Again though in the overall scheme your oven/range just doesn't use that much electricity unless you are running a bakery or a restaurant or something.
Most everything you say here is a 100% valid and should not be ignored for sure. I used to feel mostly this way as well. Actually having now installed and running solar, The rebuttal I have starts with CAPEX vs OPEX. The capital expenditure now eliminates a large chunk of the operation expenditure during the lifetime of the project. The cost of propane/other is non-static and unpredictable. Now one guy on this forum was buying propane at a buck or so a gallon, tough to get an ROI on the capital at that price. OTOH if it shoots up to $5 or more that paridigm no longer holds up.
FUD! Jeeze, not this again. I would find it highly unlikely a rodent chewing thru the cable would create the bizarre signal cross wire condition encountered in that thread because someone used a random RJ-45 cable that was wired to shuffle the pinouts at each end scrambling the sync signals. Further with 4 inverters the cables should be in a full communication loop. If any condition causes a disconnect the inverters shut down they do not go "berzerk". This gentleman seems to be a competent installer, I doubt he would make such a severe wiring error.
He has a little way to go, I am at around 185 or so 400 watt panels, lol.
I am a "Sparky" have been for almost 25 years. I don't normally play in the residential market because it doesn't pay well but I have wired more than a few houses nonetheless.
All RJ45 cables should ALWAYS be tested IMO, even "factory" ones. With there being two different standards and those wires being so small and darn hard to see, it is very easy for them to be wrong and I have done it more than a few times myself.
If everyone was building new perhaps.
Absolutely true, retrofitting is the hardest and most expensive path and sometimes the larger solar system is the best option.
That's a number for sure. Several years ago, I asked a guy to run fiber to a building about 150 ft away. He bid it with copper. I said no, ... fiber. He said "but fiber is going to cost you about $800 more!". At which point I looked at the $4500 quote and said: "So $5300 instead of $4500, how soon can you get started". If I'm spending $200K or so on a house, saving even $1000 to not wire for electric is dumb IMNSHO.
I don't think you can get out from under having some fuel based generation unless you are willing to go dark every once and a while. What we are talking about is where the curves are that minimize costs/roi and how much you need it.
My brother owns a construction company in Charleston. There are laws on the books that prevent demolishing some of the structures that are "historical" in nature. Myriad rules on remodeling and maintaining the "integrity" of the existing structure while doing so. Oddly many of these buildings get abandoned, taken over by careless homeless people, catch fire, and burn down. At which point they can be rebuilt with modern materials as long as they maintain the original architectural look.
Charleston SC is it’s own animal.
I appreciate everyone's thoughts on this.
