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Door to door sales people

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mjgonsow

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Jun 30, 2022
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So a friend at work just got a quote for a system of an unknown size and he signed paperwork for a nearly $50,000 dollar system at a 1.95% interest rate over 25 years. I believe he said he gets back 26% when he files his taxes. He doesn't believe this includes any kind of battery back-up, I'm guessing it's going to be about a 10+ KW Grid tied system. They take care of everything, permitting, install, any roof repair before mounting etc...

When he told me this price I couldn't believe anyone would pay this kind of money, but I guess it's somewhat easily justifiable since his monthly payments will be less than what he is going to be saving on his electric bill.

My question is, how common is it to buy good, but slightly used panels. Do all the permit pulling/work yourself and save an absurd amount of money? I was doing a little math and it seemed I could get everything I need minus the panels/mounting for under 5k ... does this sound possible?

These door to door salesmen/companies must be raking in the money.
 
mjgonsow said:
My question is, how common is it to buy good, but slightly used panels. Do all the permit pulling/work yourself and save an absurd amount of money? I was doing a little math and it seemed I could get everything I need minus the panels/mounting for under 5k ... does this sound possible?
Click to expand...
The permitting and racking are going to be the hardest parts to keep costs down, everyone wants their cut. On top of that there are some municipalities that don't allow DIY grid-ties and with the new NEC2020 rules it's even harder.

Better check with your local PUD first and see what their rules are before you start doing anything.
 
mjgonsow said:
So a friend at work just got a quote for a system of an unknown size and he signed paperwork for a nearly $50,000 dollar system at a 1.95% interest rate over 25 years. I believe he said he gets back 26% when he files his taxes. He doesn't believe this includes any kind of battery back-up, I'm guessing it's going to be about a 10+ KW Grid tied system. They take care of everything, permitting, install, any roof repair before mounting etc...

When he told me this price I couldn't believe anyone would pay this kind of money, but I guess it's somewhat easily justifiable since his monthly payments will be less than what he is going to be saving on his electric bill.

My question is, how common is it to buy good, but slightly used panels. Do all the permit pulling/work yourself and save an absurd amount of money? I was doing a little math and it seemed I could get everything I need minus the panels/mounting for under 5k ... does this sound possible?

These door to door salesmen/companies must be raking in the money.
Click to expand...
It is certainly feasible, but it is a lot of work. I was able to DIY my solar system at about $1.2 per watt, but I put in lots of my own time to figure out the process. Permitting and paperwork was indeed the most challenging part.
I think that was the most complex DIY project I ever did.
 
This is common practice. You have to read the fine print of the contract.

They are counting on you selling your home in the future. The contract likely states any new prospective owner must take over contract, which they are counting on them not to be willing to do, requiring you pay off the loan which has a hefty buyout fee.

Some have contract that continuously takes a portion of the projected electric bill savings. Some contracts take all or a portion of energy tax savings rebates.
 
mjgonsow said:
door to door salesmen/companies must be raking in the money
Click to expand...
I casually know a guy through my employment context. 4-5 sales a month lands him $7-8K taxable and ‘wins’ cruises and weekends in Las Vegas. He looks at it as a numbers game for 35-40hrs. When people resist after a quote he says things like, “I spent a lot of time on this to answer your questions. It cost me money to have an engineer design the system and apply for the permit. And I thought you wanted this. Did you want me to lose all that time and money?”
That is why salespeople get a bad reputation.
Plus his employer has boilerplate designs and submitting the permit is automated in their quote system- AND they don’t actually pull a permit (pay anything) until the contract is payed and signed. Their “engineers” are salaried specialists overseen by an EE.
Scammy McFadden. And we pay for the lavishness in our taxes because of the subsidies and rebates they promote. If someone gets rebates on a fairly priced system so what but the schkamee part pisses me off. I would fail miserably at that job.
 
I always wondered why anyone would deal with these door to door sales types. Typically the best companies do not need to advertise or cold call. They are so busy from word of mouth from their previous customers they don't need to resort to these tactics.
When dealing with big dollar purchases, do your research! Talk with previous customers, read reviews from multiple sources, check previous complaints, and read the d@mn contract, every word! Get an explanation of anything you don't understand. Get multiple quotes. Put in the time. It is worth it.
 
BoloMKXXVIII said:
Typically the best companies do not need to advertise or cold call. They are so busy from word of mouth from their previous customers they don't need to resort to these tactics.
Click to expand...

Well as someone currently employed in sales that hurts my feelings. ??

Many things over the years have been and are sold by salespeople. Without ‘tactics.’

You find/meet customers where they are- if you sell a product used at home that is where you meet them. I ‘miss’ sales I know I could get because I have a very sensitive conscience and therefore can’t handle doing ‘tactics.’

But word of mouth isn’t the end-all. A part of the mix but not the bulk of my new leads. Sales isn’t easy but it’s not difficult and doesn’t need to be dishonest.
 
In Australia even if you sign a contract we have a cooling off period where both parties are able to withdraw. I hope your friend has this option because I do not know what prices are like over there but last December it cost me AU$7,490 for a 9.9kW grid tied system or US$5,095. That was for REC panels and and 8.2kW Fronius inverter. There are much cheaper option by dodgy companies that wont be around in a few years time.
 
Tim Tim said:
In Australia even if you sign a contract we have a cooling off period where both parties are able to withdraw. I hope your friend has this option because I do not know what prices are like over there but last December it cost me AU$7,490 for a 9.9kW grid tied system or US$5,095. That was for REC panels and and 8.2kW Fronius inverter. There are much cheaper option by dodgy companies that wont be around in a few years time.
Click to expand...
That's a great price. ?
They canvas my area hard in Arizona.
I watched the video a while back where they showed how they trick you with the low interest rate and actually charge you more in the long run where's the higher interest rate ones actually end up being cheaper. Especially if you sell the house early. I personally knew nothing before a few months and just thought it was par for the course to pay 20k for a average system. My old lady's grandmother lives in Phoenix and leases her panels or something. Brags how here bill is 20 a month but had a $150 lease payment lol.
Here if I don't use ac my bill is usually $30-80 a month. I wish I could afford to diy my own grid tie but here I wouldn't ever get the permit. And none of the diy stuff I have is ul listed lol. I would have to buy much more expensive stuff like midnight solar or outback, solar ark, fronius etc.
 
My electricity bills generally were between US$462 and US$510 for a quarter. My first bill after the system was installed was US$39 and received my second one yesterday for US$42.

Electricity prices are taking a jump here and I reckon payback time will eventually be less than four years.
 
Tim Tim said:
My electricity bills generally were between US$462 and US$510 for a quarter. My first bill after the system was installed was US$39 and received my second one yesterday for US$42.

Electricity prices are taking a jump here and I reckon payback time will eventually be less than four years.
Click to expand...
That's amazing. With these troubled times we face its good to have solar .is yours just grid tied or do you have a option for battery bank. I saw will i think reviews a all in one unit that can run without a battery bank and off grid
 
Tim Tim said:
My electricity bills generally were between US$462 and US$510 for a quarter. My first bill after the system was installed was US$39 and received my second one yesterday for US$42.

Electricity prices are taking a jump here and I reckon payback time will eventually be less than four years
Click to expand...
And your payment on the system is how much?
 
mjgonsow said:
So a friend at work just got a quote for a system of an unknown size and he signed paperwork for a nearly $50,000 dollar system at a 1.95% interest rate over 25 years. I believe he said he gets back 26% when he files his taxes. He doesn't believe this includes any kind of battery back-up, I'm guessing it's going to be about a 10+ KW Grid tied system. They take care of everything, permitting, install, any roof repair before mounting etc...

When he told me this price I couldn't believe anyone would pay this kind of money, but I guess it's somewhat easily justifiable since his monthly payments will be less than what he is going to be saving on his electric bill.

My question is, how common is it to buy good, but slightly used panels. Do all the permit pulling/work yourself and save an absurd amount of money? I was doing a little math and it seemed I could get everything I need minus the panels/mounting for under 5k ... does this sound possible?

These door to door salesmen/companies must be raking in the money.
Click to expand...
I had one of these guys give me a 'quote' (that's being generous with what I received) for $90,000. I asked him to break it down of the costs and he said he wouldn't without a contract. Because I live in a neighborhood of multi-million dollar homes, I'm sure they just index their quotes against what they perceive as your ability to pay. scumbags.
 
mvonw said:
I had one of these guys give me a 'quote' (that's being generous with what I received) for $90,000. I asked him to break it down of the costs and he said he wouldn't without a contract. Because I live in a neighborhood of multi-million dollar homes, I'm sure they just index their quotes against what they perceive as your ability to pay. scumbags.
Click to expand...
They come through here so often I had to put up no soliciting signs. They like to park their little car at the end of the block and walk around and knock on everybody's door and bug everybody
 
mvonw said:
I had one of these guys give me a 'quote' (that's being generous with what I received) for $90,000. I asked him to break it down of the costs and he said he wouldn't without a contract. Because I live in a neighborhood of multi-million dollar homes, I'm sure they just index their quotes against what they perceive as your ability to pay.
Click to expand...
The installer that im using right now gave me a breakdown without me even asking, he broke it down all the way to what he marked up each individual product, what his commission would be, and everything. I was quite surprised!
 
RCinFLA said:
This is common practice. You have to read the fine print of the contract.

They are counting on you selling your home in the future. The contract likely states any new prospective owner must take over contract, which they are counting on them not to be willing to do, requiring you pay off the loan which has a hefty buyout fee.

Some have contract that continuously takes a portion of the projected electric bill savings. Some contracts take all or a portion of energy tax savings rebates.
Click to expand...
Sounds like the timeshare cats have got a new concept to sell people on…watch yer step folks…
 
OzSolar said:
Good for you. What was the system size and how much did you pay? None of my business is the answer I expect.
Click to expand...
Sry but I’m not that rude ;) , more than happy to share the details which I had already posted.

It cost me AU$7,490 for a 9.9kW grid tied system or US$5,095. That was for REC panels and and 8.2kW Fronius inverter.
 
The best $8 I've ever spent ;)
713Xn+aX24L._SL1500_.jpg
 
73powerstroke said:
That's amazing. With these troubled times we face its good to have solar .is yours just grid tied or do you have a option for battery bank. I saw will i think reviews a all in one unit that can run without a battery bank and off grid
Click to expand...

It is grid tied but yes I have an option for a battery bank but to be honest it isn’t worth it. I use very little from the grid and the largest cost on my bill is the daily connection charge of AU$1.04 per day. The buyback rate is only AU 7.6 cents but it is enough to keep my bill down substantially. I must admit though the climate here makes a huge difference with the winter month of June producing an average of 37.26kW a day.

I haven't looked at whether I could buy, build and connect up my batteries as the payback time would be substantial and something like a Tesla Powerwall is about AU$14,000 to AU$16,000 fully installed so that is most definitely not worth it.
 
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