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EG4 USE vs BMS Communication Settings

knexbuilder

knexbuilder

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I have been testing the limits of my off grid solar system and have a question for the community/Signature solar on battery communication and charge settings.

A LITTLE BACKGROUND (not necessary reading):
My system consists of two EG4 inverters (6500ex-48) and two banks of EG4 Lifepower4 48V batteries. Originally when I started up my system in late October I used the BMS/Inverter communication cable. All worked well for a time (3-4 weeks) except for the intermittent error 61 code which I devoutly ignored while I attended to more important matters. One day the system just shutdown without any obvious reason. Attempts to restart would only run for 3 minutes or so and shut dwn again. As best as I could diagnose batteries or the inverter were reading low battery and shutting everything down (battery was >50% SOC). Again, I didn't have the time to resolve it and switched to user defined settings as recommended in the EG4 manual (see image). I used this settings without issue for a couple of months.

MY QUESTION (the point of the post):
Now that I have a little more time on my hands I have returned to pondering my BMS/Inverter communication issue. I upgraded the firmware on the inverters and all problems have gone away and things are running smoothly. My question now is, how do the EG4 BMS charge settings differ from the user defined settings recommended in the manual? With the inverters set to use the EG4/BMS communication, settings 26 and 27 in the inverter menu show a bulk/float charge of 58V. This doesn't seem right to me when comparing to the user manual user defined settings. @BenFromSignatureSolar
The second image below is pulled from solar assistant which reports all the battery charge settings at the bottom. These match what is shown on the actual inverter displays themselves.

Thank you all for your help and comments. Happy new year everyone!


1672507937608.png
1672511282561.png
 
Just to note, I am running firmware version 79.02 for the 6500ex-48 inverters which I believe is the latest and greatest version available from EG4's website.
 
Ben posted in another thread somewhere the EG4 use lower bulk charge than the standard 58.4V. I think it was 56.4V. I am unsure of the absorbtion/float profiles.

This is likely done to extend the battery life (my guess).
 
That makes sense to set it lower to extend life. I will go hunt for that thread to see if Ben's comment sheds light on my situation. I did not find it in my searches before creating this post. I am probably going back to the user defined settings until I figure this out. I do not want to damage my batteries.
Maybe the 58/58 is just what it displays in the when setting 5 is set to EG4, and in reality the batteries are charging at another lower value. That would be weird, but strange things happen sometimes.
I do want the battery/inverter communication long run.
 
My understanding is the displayed values have nothing to do with what is happening in the non-USE modes. This is a bug to me. It should either show nothing like "--" or live update to current action.
 
knexbuilder said:
I have been testing the limits of my off grid solar system and have a question for the community/Signature solar on battery communication and charge settings.

A LITTLE BACKGROUND (not necessary reading):
My system consists of two EG4 inverters (6500ex-48) and two banks of EG4 Lifepower4 48V batteries. Originally when I started up my system in late October I used the BMS/Inverter communication cable. All worked well for a time (3-4 weeks) except for the intermittent error 61 code which I devoutly ignored while I attended to more important matters. One day the system just shutdown without any obvious reason. Attempts to restart would only run for 3 minutes or so and shut dwn again. As best as I could diagnose batteries or the inverter were reading low battery and shutting everything down (battery was >50% SOC). Again, I didn't have the time to resolve it and switched to user defined settings as recommended in the EG4 manual (see image). I used this settings without issue for a couple of months.

MY QUESTION (the point of the post):
Now that I have a little more time on my hands I have returned to pondering my BMS/Inverter communication issue. I upgraded the firmware on the inverters and all problems have gone away and things are running smoothly. My question now is, how do the EG4 BMS charge settings differ from the user defined settings recommended in the manual? With the inverters set to use the EG4/BMS communication, settings 26 and 27 in the inverter menu show a bulk/float charge of 58V. This doesn't seem right to me when comparing to the user manual user defined settings. @BenFromSignatureSolar
The second image below is pulled from solar assistant which reports all the battery charge settings at the bottom. These match what is shown on the actual inverter displays themselves.

Thank you all for your help and comments. Happy new year everyone!


View attachment 127182
View attachment 127192
Click to expand...
The LP4 batteries go up to 58V to reach 100%. They are different cells and BMS than the LL. I will follow up with the EG4 guys to see why we have a discrepancy in the manual.
 
knexbuilder said:
I am running firmware version 79.02 for the 6500ex-48 inverters which I believe is the latest and greatest version available from EG4's website.
Click to expand...
There is a newer version that came out 12/23/2022.12232022 Firmware.jpg
diysolarforum.com

Signature Solar EG4 6.5K Off-Grid Inverter | 6500EX-48

Yes, you can use a smart shunt to monitor. I have one I'm going to install on my setup so we'll have a quick look status in the kitchen. @PreppenWolf: Thanks... What smart shunt are you using/would you recommend?
diysolarforum.com diysolarforum.com
 
Sundown said:
There is a newer version that came out 12/23/2022.View attachment 127539
diysolarforum.com

Signature Solar EG4 6.5K Off-Grid Inverter | 6500EX-48

Yes, you can use a smart shunt to monitor. I have one I'm going to install on my setup so we'll have a quick look status in the kitchen. @PreppenWolf: Thanks... What smart shunt are you using/would you recommend?
diysolarforum.com diysolarforum.com
Click to expand...
79.60 is the correct CPU firmware and 61.60 is the display file

(I've updated this since the original post)
 
Last edited:
thejazzoflife@protonmail. said:
If I set the 6500ex to EG4 battery type, it only seems to bulk charge to 53V and then it floats at 52.6V or so. Which means the battery SOC doesn't reach 100%.

Is this normal @BenFromSignatureSolar ?
Click to expand...
How long ago did you commision the batteries? If you just hooked them up recently I would advise top balancing and deep cycling them. The battery BMS is what is going to pull the charge. Are they the LP4 or LL batteries? Editing:*** To do the deep cycle you will need to switch over to USE mode, open the batteries up to charge to 100% and then back down to 20%. Do that for 7-10 days then put the unit back in EG4 mode. Your BMS should open up a bit and give you more voltage.
 
Last edited:
BenFromSignatureSolar said:
How long ago did you commision the batteries? If you just hooked them up recently I would advise top balancing and deep cycling them. The battery BMS is what is going to pull the charge. Are they the LP4 or LL batteries?
Click to expand...
I have 6 Lifepower4 batteries of differing ages. The oldest pair has about 120 cycles on them, the newest has about 20 cycles. They were previously hooked up to an MPP inverter, but I just bought a pair of 6500s about a month ago.

However, we have had about two week of clouds,rain and fog so today was the first day of getting up to almost fully charged (SOC of 96%) using the 6500s. But it appears I may have just discovered a different problem. Both inverters have somehow changed themselves to a max charging current of 10A and I can't seem to change the setting. Perhaps that is why they didnt get fully charged. Any input on how to change this setting?
 
thejazzoflife said:
I have 6 Lifepower4 batteries of differing ages. The oldest pair has about 120 cycles on them, the newest has about 20 cycles. They were previously hooked up to an MPP inverter, but I just bought a pair of 6500s about a month ago.

However, we have had about two week of clouds,rain and fog so today was the first day of getting up to almost fully charged (SOC of 96%) using the 6500s. But it appears I may have just discovered a different problem. Both inverters have somehow changed themselves to a max charging current of 10A and I can't seem to change the setting. Perhaps that is why they didnt get fully charged. Any input on how to change this setting?
Click to expand...
The bms from the master battery takes over that setting when in EG4 mode. It's a safe bet that the battery chemistries are not quite matched up with such different cycle counts. If you have a stand alone battery charger, I would recommend charging the batteries individually to max and go through the deep cycle process with them(in use mode). This should balance your stack and when you go back into eg4 mode, that amperage throttling will likely go away.
 
BenFromSignatureSolar said:
The bms from the master battery takes over that setting when in EG4 mode. It's a safe bet that the battery chemistries are not quite matched up with such different cycle counts. If you have a stand alone battery charger, I would recommend charging the batteries individually to max and go through the deep cycle process with them(in use mode). This should balance your stack and when you go back into eg4 mode, that amperage throttling will likely go away.
Click to expand...
Ah yes, I forgot about the EG4 setting changing the other parameters automatically. I will try them in USE setting for a while and see if that helps. Thanks for the input.

One other brief off topic question for you. I have had issues with other settings changing by themselves when I change a different setting. Like the LED strip will turn off on one of the inverters when I change other settings, or the SOC for TO GRID and BACK TO BATTERY will go to 0%. Is this a common issue?
 
thejazzoflife said:
Ah yes, I forgot about the EG4 setting changing the other parameters automatically. I will try them in USE setting for a while and see if that helps. Thanks for the input.

One other brief off topic question for you. I have had issues with other settings changing by themselves when I change a different setting. Like the LED strip will turn off on one of the inverters when I change other settings, or the SOC for TO GRID and BACK TO BATTERY will go to 0%. Is this a common issue?
Click to expand...
Can you tell me which firmware it's running on currently?
 
BenFromSignatureSolar said:
If you have the firmware cables, I would recommend going to eg4electronics.com and loading fw 79.02. There was a batch of inverters that came in with 79.03 and we've been seeing some issues arise, similar to the ones you are having.

If you do not have the cable I can have one sent to you tomorrow
Click to expand...
I have the cables that came with the inverters will have to get a USB adapter.
 
Set the inverters to USE today with bulk voltage at 56.2 and float at 54. The SOC did finally reach 100% but battery voltage won't go above 53.5V
 
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