The Ford software has settings that make us think we can pick between the normal flooded lead acid battery and an AGM. I don't recall if the Ford Truck forum member that tested saw any change in the charging.
High Current (100A+) Alternator charging?
- Thread starter tmckenna
- Start date
It actually outputs 40kW at idle (forscan verified) -- it's a 35kW motor, but 40kW generator. I've been compiling data on it to get a full understanding of its logic. Turbos aren't used at idle, it's still drawing vacuum while generating.The Powerboost is sort of a tragic figure because it's incredibly interesting in its own right and almost noone realizes it exists because.. Lightning.
I'm not sure what a 3.5L naturally aspirated engine can actually make at 1000rpm, but 35kw+efficiency losses is ~50hp and that's probably pretty close to maxed out for a 3.5L engine at 1000rpm where the turbos aren't helping, if it's possible at all. So I would verify that before assuming it to be possible. It's likely the engine can't actually make enough power at 1000rpm to max out the electrical conversion capability.
Vigo
Solar Addict
Impressive!! I know a LOT about engines compared to the average person and i would not have assumed that it was either: A. possible for the 3.5 to make 40kw at <1000rpm even WOT without boost, or B. that the engine management system would give its idle control enough 'authority' to run the throttle close to wide open at that low of an rpm.
Just means it's a more fully thought-out and well-integrated system than i would have given them credit for. Very cool.
Just means it's a more fully thought-out and well-integrated system than i would have given them credit for. Very cool.
Sorry to revive an old thread, but since y'all are talking big amp numbers, I'm curious what everyone's strategy is for actually consuming all of that output?
I'll be putting a bigger alternator in my truck soon (300A max) to replace my current (160A max) (12v). My Sterling DC-DC 60A charger complains of voltage loss on its ~30' run over 1/0 copper. I'm unsure if this is due to the alternator or due to the length of cable, but Sterling forces it down to 30A to compensate. It's a very long run to be pushing high current low voltage. Plus, I'd like to add even more charging than the Sterling 60A as well. I'm not sure if I'm comfortable running even bigger wire (4/0) over that distance.
Would either of these alternatives be viable?
I'll be putting a bigger alternator in my truck soon (300A max) to replace my current (160A max) (12v). My Sterling DC-DC 60A charger complains of voltage loss on its ~30' run over 1/0 copper. I'm unsure if this is due to the alternator or due to the length of cable, but Sterling forces it down to 30A to compensate. It's a very long run to be pushing high current low voltage. Plus, I'd like to add even more charging than the Sterling 60A as well. I'm not sure if I'm comfortable running even bigger wire (4/0) over that distance.
Would either of these alternatives be viable?
- Install a 2000-3000W inverter in the truck cab, close to the alternator and truck batteries. Run AC wiring all the way to the back and treat it as shore power. Limit my input power to ~1kW in my existing inverter/charger, or some other number that keeps it safely below the idle alternator output.
- Add a voltage booster (12v to ~48v) near the alternator, run it over the existing 1/0 copper, and then drop it back down to 13.6v for the Sterling
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Zwy
Emperor Of Solar
I have mine in the backseat, too crowded under the hood and it gets hot there. I'd rather have the inverter in the truck cab where there is air conditioning. https://diysolarforum.com/threads/60a-dc-dc-charger-only-pulling-about-40a.29928/post-390576
Cool so it seems you like the approach using a truck-mounted inverter as shore-power for the RV (which may have its own inverter). I'm leaning this way as well, especially since it gives me an additional 3000W of power should I ever need it.
It's probably a ~10% efficiency loss over using high-tech DC-DC chargers combined with massive (properly-sized) wiring, but I think I can live with that.
1/0 awg over 60' (round trip) is just over the 3% voltage drop, assuming 60 amps at 12.0 volts. Using 12.0 volts is pessimistic since the alternator is usually pumping out more than that. 2/0 would be better, but that's expensive.
Using a converter to bump the voltage to 48 volts would allow you to use 4 awg. But is the addition of two converters worth it?
This is for batteries in a trailer? Do you have solar?
Using a converter to bump the voltage to 48 volts would allow you to use 4 awg. But is the addition of two converters worth it?
This is for batteries in a trailer? Do you have solar?
2/0 would be better, but that still only gets me 60A (which still under-utilizes the alternator). A voltage drop calculator suggests 4/0 for the ~100A I'd ideally like to pull. 4/0 is a monstrous nightmare; I have a few short runs of it for my inverter and DC distribution panels. This is all telling me I've reached the upper-end of what a 12v system should really be doing.
My gut says no. I'd need at least two, but perhaps 3 or 4 depending on how much power each can handle. These things aren't physically small either, so I'd be using up a lot of space. And they're expensive. And they seem to fail pretty easily.
I'm leaning towards using a 2nd inverter instead. Easier to install, more utility, and less space needed.
I'm in a self-built motorhome using a refrigerated box truck as the base. The truck is a 2016 Hino 268a, and the total length is ~33'. The truck batteries are up front while the house batteries are all the way at the back. (If I were to re-do it today, I'd put the electrical up front to be closer to the truck engine.)
I have 960W of solar on top (through a 50A MPPT, so only ~600W max usable). Up here in the northeast, I don't get nearly enough solar yield for my needs, especially during the winter months. I have a diesel generator, but it's the loudest machine on the planet, so I'd rather rely on the truck engine/alternator and only use the generator as a backup/emergency.
I have 640 watts of PV on the roof of my RV trailer. It's been sufficient that I do not use the power from the tow vehicle to charge my LiFePO4 batteries. When I need more power, I deploy another 640 watts of PV on the ground. The only time I feel the need for even more power is when I run the air conditioner, which is quite rare. I have an onboard generator (gas) that sees more hours getting exercised monthly than it does in actual use.
I have plenty of alternator capacity available from my truck, I just don't need it. Ground deployed panels are very effective, but storing and moving them is not a lot of fun, mainly because I chose panels that are large.
I have plenty of alternator capacity available from my truck, I just don't need it. Ground deployed panels are very effective, but storing and moving them is not a lot of fun, mainly because I chose panels that are large.
Zwy
Emperor Of Solar
The ability to move large wattage on smaller wires is the reason I went with the system.
The side benefits of using an additional inverter is it doesn't care what voltage the system is on the other end. In my case it was 24V, a step up DC to DC providing 30A at 24V output requires 60A at 12V input. Down the road if a 48V system is desired, it can still be used with the AC output of the inverter. The additional benefit is redundancy. I travel with the truck camper, losing the Growatt inverter I can still power up 120V items off the truck inverter.
I don't use mine often enough to worry about any efficiency loss. I have a remote on/off switch for the Growatt and we don't idle it so our usage is pretty low. Might be different if I install a compressor refrigerator. We have a Dometic in the backseat of the truck and don't use the 3 way in the camper now but I would like to install a DC compressor fridge.
My first worry would be the ability to melt the existing vehicle wires with 300 amps vs the 160 design amps. Might press 200, but 300 wow.
Has the drive belt system been determined to be adequate?
Are you trying to run the A/C while rolling down the road? Can't imagine why all the power is needed.
Otherwise I would be looking at a second alternator with a dedicated system to provide the monster power. Maybe even a 24v alternator.
I made the mistake of assuming solar would be adequate for my needs. Trying to live through freezing temperatures with constant cloud coverage for a week straight really woke me up from the solar dream. My solar yield for that entire week was <2kWh, despite having 960W of solar panels on top. Don't get me wrong, I love solar power, but I'd be a complete fool to rely on it again.
I didn't start out this project with the intention of turning the truck into a diesel powerplant, but that's where I'm at given the experience I've had so far. I invested a significant amount of money in my CIGS solar panels, but they've let me down so far.
That's a good point on the wiring; I've already got some extra 2/0 that I plan to let the mechanic use. The belt may need to be replaced for something stronger, but they're okay with that. The engine itself should be able to handle it though.
I have a lot of 12VDC low-current draws in my setup (fridge, computers, routers, pumps, inverter idle, heater controls, etc.). 150W may not be much, but over the course of 24-hours it's quite a lot.
I really really wish a 2nd alternator was possible, but everyone I've spoken to about it has no idea how to do it on my particular truck. For now, it seems a higher-output single-alternator is my only option, but with any luck, I'll eventually find someone who could fabricate a custom bracket for a 2nd alternator.
Yea these are all great points. Honestly the inefficiency doesn't worry me quite so much since I'm going to have some no matter what.
I think there has been a lot of disappointment in CIGS overall. Regular panels would probably work better. However, panels mounted in a fixed horizontal orientation are poor performers in winter. My ground deployed and tilted panels more than double the over all output in the winter.
I've done a lot of work to my trailer to improve its ability to operate in winter, but it's still an inefficient setup. The 360° skirt helped a lot.
May as well post the make, model, year and the engine. Lots of custom outfitters around if this is anything common.
My vehicle is height-constrained already. It's at 12'6" which is why I went with the CIGS panels since they only had a few millimeters. Conventional framed panels would add to my clearance height which I don't want to do. That said, my previous RV had 600W of conventional solar panels and I suffered similar issues. The panels aren't really the problem; it's the lack of sun (and angle of the sun as you mentioned).
Having separately deployable panels also isn't really an option. My vehicle may not be very weight-constrained, but it is space-constrained. Plus, I move much more frequently in a motorhome than I do in a trailer, so the constant setup/teardown would be a nuisance. I'm on the reservation list for Xpanse's Solar Awning though, so eventually I'll be able to capture the sun angle a bit better.
All that said, it doesn't matter how much I invest into maximizing my solar potential if the system is almost entirely defeated by cloudy days. On sunny days, I will happily take the solar energy to avoid running the truck engine or generator. But I need to plan for bad weather.
I'm not so worried about staying warm in the winter; my rig is very well suited to handle it (refrigerated box truck). But my diesel hydronic heater still takes electricity to run. And it's plumbed in such a way that I benefit from running the truck anyway (capturing waste heat via heat exchanger).
It's a 2016 Hino 268a with a j08e engine. The current alternator is a Delco Remy 24SI. It's being replaced by a Delco Remy 40SI once the part arrives.
Yea too bad there was no factory option for dual alternators. The 300 may resolve the voltage issue and get your charging back up to 60 amps. That alone will make a world of difference. If adding more power I recommend a close review of the wiring system and where the power gets connected.