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diy solar

Deciding between Victron, Enphase and possibly Sol-ark. Input?

zanydroid said:

What is the game plan for commissioning/debugging/ongoing maintenance of Victron?

In general, what is the game plan for ongoing maintenance across all three?
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zanydroid said:
You can have multiple batteries to diversify the SPOFs on Enphase. However the MID is likely still a SPOF (albeit one with no active power handling equipment, it has CTs, relay, some brains).

I don't think the extra cost in Enphase system is being invested in the right places, if the goal is to increase availability. Better to just, like, install two string inverters.

Arguably the SolArk tax is also not invested in the right place (but probably better than Enphase b/c it's a system targeted more towards off-grid) because there appear to be no need for inspections or interconnection agreement here, so why not just get 4 cheap 6000XP class inverters for the price of one SolArk. They'll probably not all fail at the same time.

Victron has a lot more off-grid users than SolArk does. A lot of them roll on wheels / float. While I question the value-add of Victron in hybrid or heavily inspected situations, off-grid in a place where nobody inspects and needs autonomy makes more sense.

What is the game plan for commissioning/debugging/ongoing maintenance of Victron?

In general, what is the game plan for ongoing maintenance across all three?

EMP hardening is nonsense IMO unless somebody tosses a non-economical test at it. Which they won't do, because it costs too much to test.
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Well the Victon system does have 2 MultiPlus-II inverters so I guess that is some redundancy if the system can function (and not be overloaded/ruined) if one goes down.

Plan for maintenance is to have a local electrician do the install so they are also around to do repairs (unlike most solar installers up there that just provide a cell # and could easily disappear when inconvenient service requests come up).
 
S610 said:
Well the Victon system does have 2 MultiPlus-II inverters so I guess that is some redundancy if the system can function (and not be overloaded/ruined) if one goes down.
Click to expand...

If you set them up in split phase (two stacked 120s) you will have one leg left but no 240.

The other option is 240 into an autotransformer which is janky in hybrid setup but maybe OK in off grid. If the AT dies you have no 120v anymore unless the multiplus can be configured for either 230V or 120V

S610 said:
Plan for maintenance is to have a local electrician do the install so they are also around to do repairs (unlike most solar installers up there that just provide a cell # and could easily disappear when inconvenient service requests come up).
Click to expand...
Hmm you need to carefully interview the electrician to make sure they can do full service (or honestly say which layers they can handle). There’s a ton of software and config involved.
 
S610 said:
Well the Victon system does have 2 MultiPlus-II inverters so I guess that is some redundancy if the system can function (and not be overloaded/ruined) if one goes down.
Click to expand...

It's not seamless. When Victron inverters are configured to operate in parallel they basically act as one big inverter. The malfunctioning one will require you to reconfigure for single unit operation. I'm running on the same principle with 2X quattros in parallel.
 
sunshine_eggo said:
It's not seamless. When Victron inverters are configured to operate in parallel they basically act as one big inverter. The malfunctioning one will require you to reconfigure for single unit operation. I'm running on the same principle with 2X quattros in parallel.
Click to expand...
What do you think about the reliability of 2x 230V into a AT? (variant of this would be keep an extra AT in a box, $300, which is cheaper than keeping an extra inverter in a box)

vs 2x 120V with no AT?

2x 6000XP has the advantage that each box can do everything 120/240 on its own, it's just 50% of the power. There are also an extra set of MPPTs, not just inverters.
 
zanydroid said:
What do you think about the reliability of 2x 230V into a AT? (variant of this would be keep an extra AT in a box, $300, which is cheaper than keeping an extra inverter in a box)

vs 2x 120V with no AT?

2x 6000XP has the advantage that each box can do everything 120/240 on its own, it's just 50% of the power. There are also an extra set of MPPTs, not just inverters.
Click to expand...

I would expect an inverter to fail before an AT, so 2X 230V + AT for 120/240 is probably a little more reliable if maintaining 100% backup is needed. I'm willing to accept losing 240VAC.
 
zanydroid said:
If you set them up in split phase (two stacked 120s) you will have one leg left but no 240.

The other option is 240 into an autotransformer which is janky in hybrid setup but maybe OK in off grid. If the AT dies you have no 120v anymore unless the multiplus can be configured for either 230V or 120V


Hmm you need to carefully interview the electrician to make sure they can do full service (or honestly say which layers they can handle). There’s a ton of software and config involved.
Click to expand...

I believe both inverters are 120v only (I do not need 240). As far as interviewing the electrician, there aren't very many options in that small town. Only found 1 other installer in that region and he mainly does Sol-Ark not Victron.
 
Another option is the Solis S6 paired with a Pylontech Force H1 ( 21 Kwh ) for under 12K USD, finally shipping.

I just got the above S6 inverter ( 11.4kw ) 2 weeks ago and initial impressions are its a solid unit can do anything the Sol-Ark 15K within a few hundred watts at 1/3 the cost. All UL certifications including UL9540 with the linked battery.

Here is the spec sheet with very impressive surge ratings, manual here as well

Best feature is NO FANS, NO NOISE just a huge heatsink.
 
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sunshine_eggo said:
I would expect an inverter to fail before an AT, so 2X 230V + AT for 120/240 is probably a little more reliable if maintaining 100% backup is needed. I'm willing to accept losing 240VAC.
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More boxes = more problems. I'm really a bit skeptical of inverter failure being much of an issue, if your not tapping it at 110% 1/2 the time. I'd rather just get two EG4 6000's, simplify cabling, lots of power, lots of PV, nice cable boxes.
 
S610 said:
Well the Victon system does have 2 MultiPlus-II inverters so I guess that is some redundancy if the system can function (and not be overloaded/ruined) if one goes down.

Plan for maintenance is to have a local electrician do the install so they are also around to do repairs (unlike most solar installers up there that just provide a cell # and could easily disappear when inconvenient service requests come up).
Click to expand...
Oh, I missed the part that $13k doesn't include install. Ground mount the system to make it easier to service.
You should get install quote to make a more apples-apples comparison.

The alternative to Victron would be to upgrade to the Sol-Ark 12k (without EMP).
 
S610 said:
I believe the new off-grid Enphase system does not require an Internet connection. I did ask the electrician that sells those systems about that and he swore they don't. Also said there is no single point of failure.
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Ask him what happens when the System Controller box fails. I don't trust salesmen who either lie or don't know the product.
 
BentleyJ said:
There is a big difference between a 5.4kW and a 8kW system. Seems like you want to base the choice on Brand name and price vs. what you actually need as far as system size to provide adequate solar for your usage. Since this is an Off-Grid system its even more important to size the solar array, inverter and batteries accordingly.

EDIT: Personal Opinion, Enphase makes good equipment BUT If I were Off-Grid I would not want a 100% proprietary system that I couldn't service and had to wait for warranty repairs on someone else's timeline. Victron, Sol-Ark or Schneider would be better for Off-Grid.
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Outback 8048A-01 prebuiltwith 2 fm100 scc's.
 
On that Victron system a 48/3000 may be a bit light for a house - I would want the two 48/5000 inverters - so I have 240v. (YMMV).

Also the quote is missing the shunt - Smartshunt or BMV712 or Lynx (probably the Lynx).

If you want more than one battery- get a PowerIn for the battery side bus bar.
 
DIYrich said:
Oh, I missed the part that $13k doesn't include install. Ground mount the system to make it easier to service.
You should get install quote to make a more apples-apples comparison.

The alternative to Victron would be to upgrade to the Sol-Ark 12k (without EMP).
Click to expand...
I will get an install quote.
 
DIYrich said:
Ask him what happens when the System Controller box fails. I don't trust salesmen who either lie or don't know the product.
Click to expand...
He is an electrician not a salesman. : ) I don't think he is lying though I do think he is doing his best to come up to speed on solar. He works for a company that has 2 offices and lots of other guys but he is the only one that does solar installations.

Plus he had never heard of Victron until I mentioned them (yeah....I know....but as I said this is a very rural area and it is hard to find people).
 
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