EG4 6000xp in three phase?

[Odonata]

I have a three phase motor I'd like to run in my off grid setup, in the 6000xp manual I see there is an option for running two units in parallel in three phase mode, but there is nothing more than the option listed, no info on wiring or further detail on setup, I tried calling current connected and they said that it does have three phase but that option is for professionals only and they don't give out any information regarding it.

Is it true three phase with each leg 120 degrees out of phase with the others? I'd assume it would be L1, L2 on the main unit and L1 on the secondary, just curious if anyone has any more information before I buy them.

 

[42OhmsPA]

@HighTechLab @Markus_EG4 @Zapper77

@Odonata, welcome to the forum.

 

[Zapper77]

Edit: See comment from Markus below.

 

[HighTechLab]

According to the manual it supports 3 phase 120/208 mode but the manual isn’t very clear as to how to wire / set it up.

Page 21 mentions 3 phase config and page 50 goes further into it.

 

[Markus_EG4]

There is no 3 phase at the moment thats why its not in the manual yet or the actual set up for 3 phase that is. We took it out until it is fully tested before we can release the firmware for it

 

[Odonata]

Sounds good thank you for the information @Markus_EG4 and everyone else who commented!

 

[badazin]

There is no 3 phase at the moment thats why its not in the manual yet or the actual set up for 3 phase that is. We took it out until it is fully tested before we can release the firmware for it

Wait! is this statement valid for the 18kpv also?

 

[Markus_EG4]

Wait! is this statement valid for the 18kpv also?

18k has 3phase

 

[badazin]

18k has 3phase

3 phase with 2 18kpv right?

 

[Markus_EG4]

3 phase with 2 18kpv right?

Yes but 1 leg will be weaker then the others. 3 inverters would be best option

 

[Hedges]

Several 120V and some 120/240V inverters support 120/208Y.
Some, like SolArk, I think the two 120V that are in series for 120/240V are instead connected in parallel.

Yes but 1 leg will be weaker then the others. 3 inverters would be best option

Do you mean 60 degree, open leg 240V delta?
Or 120/240 high-leg delta with a 90 degree phase?

Or are the inverters meant for 120/208Y?

 

[Markus_EG4]

Several 120V and some 120/240V inverters support 120/208Y.
Some, like SolArk, I think the two 120V that are in series for 120/240V are instead connected in parallel.



Do you mean 60 degree, open leg 240V delta?
Or 120/240 high-leg delta with a 90 degree phase?

Or are the inverters meant for 120/208Y?

120/208

 

[Hedges]

2 inverters out of 120/208Y, call it 120/208 "V"?

I think that would work badly for a 3-phase motor. The phases aren't the same angle apart, or the same voltage.

If the inverter could do 60 degree angle 240V open-leg delta, might be OK.

3 inverters would be best, as you say.
Or, get a VFD.

 

[Theory_N]

Yes but 1 leg will be weaker then the others. 3 inverters would be best option

Talking with Sol-Ark, when using 2 units for 120/208V/3P, for example, on the 15K, 2 legs would have 15kW available, and the 3rd leg 30kW.
Would the EG4 18K (and 6000XP) work in a similar fashion? Wouldn’t the third leg be stronger, as with the Sol-Ark?

Any progress on 3 phase for the 6000XP?

 

[HighTechLab]

Talking with Sol-Ark, when using 2 units for 120/208V/3P, for example, on the 15K, 2 legs would have 15kW available, and the 3rd leg 30kW.
Would the EG4 18K (and 6000XP) work in a similar fashion? Wouldn’t the third leg be stronger, as with the Sol-Ark?

Correct.

I think that would work badly for a 3-phase motor. The phases aren't the same angle apart, or the same voltage.

Not quite correct.

Remember, these units are two 120v inverters in one

You would still have a Y connection - just one leg of the Y would have two inverters on it. You still get 120 degree phase separation - if you went to 60 degrees, you would have six phase and the smoke would come out.

 

[Hedges]

Right, two SolArk, one with 2x 120V inverters on L1, the other for 1x 120V on L2 and 1x 120V on L3, would be fine. Makes 120/208Y.

Having just 2x 120V (or 2x 230V) inverters 120 degrees apart would be bad.

I think I missed that each 18kpv has 2x 120V inverters. 2x 18kPV would work well, just limited to about 3x 6kW = 18kW of balanced load.

A single 18kPV could be set for 0 degrees, 180 degrees, or 120 degrees. By itself, not good for 3-phase loads (but good for backup in a building fed L1 and L2 of 3-phase.)

 

[Hedges]

Talking with Sol-Ark, when using 2 units for 120/208V/3P, for example, on the 15K, 2 legs would have 15kW available, and the 3rd leg 30kW.
Would the EG4 18K (and 6000XP) work in a similar fashion? Wouldn’t the third leg be stronger, as with the Sol-Ark?

If one SolArk can make 15kW and drives L2 & L3, then it can probably supply 15kVA, 15kW as 2x 120V 7.5kW loads.
Between L2 and L3 is 208V, and current limit is probably the same, but outputs loaded out of phase.
I would guess 15kW / 240V = 62.5A available
62.5A x 208V = 13kW

If other SolArk has both 120V inverters driving L1, then it can supply 15kW on L1, not 30 kW.

For a balanced 3-phase load, either delta or wye, there is up to 7.5kW per phase available x 3 phases = 22.5kW max.
(Not counting starting surge, and motor loads have to be smaller due to 5x surge.)

But yes a total of 30kW with all 3 legs, if suitably distributed.

All assuming the "15kW" rating is AC watts, not max PV or something like that.

 

[EG4_Jared]

Any progress on 3 phase for the 6000XP?

I believe that three-phase is operational on the 6000XP's and that documentation should reflect this soon.

 

[carsantini]

There is no 3 phase at the moment thats why its not in the manual yet or the actual set up for 3 phase that is. We took it out until it is fully tested before we can release the firmware for it

Hi Markus, i have a different question about the 6000xp. I have a split phase connection from the utility. The two legs (L1 & L2) comes from a 3-phase grid system. The combine measurement on the red and black wires is 240v. Measuring each cable with the neutral is 108 not 120v as we usually have in my location. Thats probably because its an apartment. Can the 6000xp work with this grid connection to charge my battery and to used the UPS feature? I want to be in bypass mode with the grid to supply a critical loads panel and would like the UPS activated in case of a blackout. I dont have solar. I have EG4-LL v2 batteries. Thank you in advanced!

 

[Hedges]

Hi Markus, i have a different question about the 6000xp. I have a split phase connection from the utility. The two legs (L1 & L2) comes from a 3-phase grid system. The combine measurement on the red and black wires is 240v. Measuring each cable with the neutral is 108 not 120v as we usually have in my location. Thats probably because its an apartment. Can the 6000xp work with this grid connection to charge my battery and to used the UPS feature? I want to be in bypass mode with the grid to supply a critical loads panel and would like the UPS activated in case of a blackout. I dont have solar. I have EG4-LL v2 batteries. Thank you in advanced!

I don't think this geometry adds up.

If you had 120/240 high leg delta, you would see 240V between those two line, 120V (not 108V) from each of those to neutral, 208V from 3rd leg to neutral. (and 240V from 3rd leg to either of the other two.)

What is common is 2 legs of 120/208Y, so Red to Black is 208V, Red to White is 120V, Black to White is 120V.

Please double check and report what it is. Check each to Ground as well. See if it matches any of these configurations:

https://files.sma.de/downloads/COMMONGRIDCONFIG-A-en-30.pdf

 

[theonlydave]

Hi @Markus_EG4 @EG4_Jared,

Any update on the XP6000 and three-phase compatibility with just two units? I want to be sure before ordering for a friend.

Kindly let me know, thanks!

 

[EG4_Jared]

I don't have the complete testing document at hand, but based on the 18kPV, using two 6000XPs might lead to an imbalance on the third leg. I would recommend using three inverters for three-phase. However, I'll provide an update as soon as I obtain more details.

 

[Hedges]

Keep 4th leg separate, so 3 legs balanced?
That's single phase 120V for other loads.

 

[HighTechLab]

Keep 4th leg separate, so 3 legs balanced?
That's single phase 120V for other loads.

No need, you would just have one strong B phase. Throw more 120v loads on that one - it can be balanced if you have loads to neutral. The only loads that would be unbalanced are ones that are purely 3 phase like motors.

 

[carsantini]

I don't think this geometry adds up.

If you had 120/240 high leg delta, you would see 240V between those two line, 120V (not 108V) from each of those to neutral, 208V from 3rd leg to neutral. (and 240V from 3rd leg to either of the other two.)

What is common is 2 legs of 120/208Y, so Red to Black is 208V, Red to White is 120V, Black to White is 120V.

Please double check and report what it is. Check each to Ground as well. See if it matches any of these configurations:

https://files.sma.de/downloads/COMMONGRIDCONFIG-A-en-30.pdf

Sorry for my late response. Got my measurements mixup. Its 202v (L1 & L2) and 115v (N & L1/L2). Everything is working at home but what's is going on here?