Is Anybody Else Doing The PG&E Powersaver Rewards?

[Ampster]

LiFePO4 batteries (server rack 6000 cycles over 16 years, DIY 280 Ah cells 3000 cycles over 8 years, battery inverter not included), my estimate is $0.05/kWh.

My calcs were more conservative, in that I I only use about a quarter of my pack each day. I figured calendar life would degrade my cells first before cycles and I included my hybrid inverter because it is necessary to use the storage in my pack. Even with my higher number, using my batteries to avoid peak rates make a lot of sense.

 

[Hedges]

I'm not confident that quoted battery life will be reached. One test, only 5% of brands tested did.
Betting on only 25% of spec life, ensuring at least break-even by that point, should help avoid financial disappointment.

PV panels I'm pretty confident in. But some degrade, and some of mine (polysilicon from Sharp), have. They still gave quite a few years of service, though.

I've gone PV heavy, battery light. But if I do need to store my own power in the future, will probably find battery prices have skyrocketed.

 

[Ampster]

........
I've gone PV heavy, battery light. But if I do need to store my own power in the future, will probably find battery prices have skyrocketed.

If it makes you feel better, energy prices will also likely skyrocket so the relative economics hopefully will stay the same. Long gone are the days when I could charge my EVs at $0.13 per kWh.

 

[Hedges]

Except, if you can do it from PV, could be $0.025/kWh

For me, of course, it is also about investment. Maybe I should buy batteries now, because my $$ aren't keeping up with inflation.
LiFePO4 has limited life. FLA kept dry should have near unlimited shelf life. Shallow cycled, could be 20 years +/- service life. But $/kWh is not competitive. I thought FLA could be $0.25/kWh, but not at the prices I recently looked up.

One concept that has crossed my mind is V2H. If I had say 90 kWh in an electric car (or even much less), would provide my commute powered by photons. If that battery could be mated to Sunny Boy Storage (AC coupled battery inverter) and if it would interact with frequency-shift of Sunny Island (not just UL-1741-SA curtailment of output, but also ramp-up of charging in other frequency shift direction) ...
During outages, I would plug its AC cord into my house, and lithium would cycle while keeping Sunny Island's AGM at float.

 

[400bird]

Did anyone here sign up and get pay out on the PGE power saver rewards?

 

[BentleyJ]

Did anyone here sign up and get pay out on the PGE power saver rewards?

Last summer I signed up on the CAISO website to get Flex Alert updates but that is just a voluntary program, no monetary rewards. Sometimes a thank you email for participating. I Didn't know about the Power Saver Rewards program. SCE did a poor job of advertising, big surprise there.
About 3 years ago SCE had representatives going door-to-door pushing the remote control thermostat where they could turn off your AC anytime at their discretion. As expected, I declined and wasn't very nice about it.

This new incentive program makes a lot more sense since the customer has total control over how and when they choose to reduce consumption. I went ahead and signed up. At this point we are still Grandfathered in on the old tiered billing rates and haven't been forced to ToU yet. As such its not necessary to use Peak Load Shave everyday but I had been voluntarily doing so on the really critical flex alert days.

Thanks for sharing. Hope we can get the full $40 for the season. With the rate of inflation as is, I suspect that sum of Fiat Currency will buy a 6 pack of Beer by then. Of course I'm referring to any beer other than an Anheuser Busch product.

 

[400bird]

Hope we can get the full $40 for the season.

Holy crap, is that it? Nevermind, I didn't realize there was a max payout.

I'll stick with Ohmconnect, they paid me about $700 last year.

 

[Ampster]

Did anyone here sign up and get pay out on the PGE power saver rewards?

No, since I use my battery to carry me through the peak periods there is nothing I can do to lower my loads during those times. The rates for that time is $0.50 per kWh and that time period is five hours that is $2.50 per day that I am saving for every kWh consumed at that time. I save more than $600 per year so there is no advantage to me. I used to be on Ohmconnect and when I got a battery I did the math and realized I would have to spend $600 on PG&E to get back possibly $400 from Ohmconnect.

 

[400bird]

I used to be on Ohmconnect and when I got a battery I did the math and realized I would have to spend $600 on PG&E to get back possibly $400 from Ohmconnect.

Explain? I don't understand.

 

[Ampster]

Explain? I don't understand.

With Ohmconnect, you get paid for reducing your consumption from some previous average. If I was using ten kWhs during peak time that would be an average of 2kWhs every hour. When an Ohm Hour came along I could shut everything off and get maybe a twenty dollar reward but I would have averaged $5 per day and that would be $35 per week. Ohm Hours did not ocurr every week when I was on Ohmconnect.

 

[400bird]

Oh, sure. My normal used during an Ohm hour is -200 watts (pushing to the grid) during an Ohm hour, I'll push about -6000 watts to the grid. So, yeah about $5-6 normally. They still run the special events, like the heat wave last summer, that pay significantly more. I had multiple events that paid over $40 and one was about $100

But, why would you need to spend $600 with PGE to earn anything with Ohmconnect?

 

[Ampster]

But, why would you need to spend $600 with PGE to earn anything with Ohmconnect?

I did not realize tha you could get credit by pushing power. In that case it makes sense. Some of those Ohm Hours were when solar was still producing. You must have the ability to sell to the grid from your battery?

 

[400bird]

I did not realize tha you could get credit by pushing power. In that case it makes sense. Some of those Ohm Hours were when solar was still producing. You must have the ability to sell to the grid from your battery?

I do, completed the permit and interconnect agreement last fall. But, I was selling from the battery since install 2 years ago.

Edit: most of the events now are from 7-8 pm, so it's mostly battery, not solar.

 

[Ampster]

I have exceeded the 1 kW extra solar allowed on my NEM agreement and added my Solark behind the meter, so I do not want to get their attention by sending power to the grid beyond when the sun is shinning. Only my GT micros are part of my NEM agreement.