MPP Solar All in one system

[gouthro2002]

Hello,
I was thinking of building a solar energy system as a backup for my house and also for camping. In reading Will's site a little more carefully, I noticed that he recomends an all in one system. And I am wondering whether it would work for me? As you see, I am on the beginners corner, so a lot of what is said goes over my head and I would appreciate it if someone could clarify me on whether this system will do what I want.

One thing that Will says makes me a bit concerned. I want to run a 12 volt fridge/freezer when camping and one of the cons that Will mentions makes we wonder about this possibility:

Cons: High idle consumption. If you wish to have your inverter on 24/7, you may want to invest in a victron or xantrex (but they will cost 3x-5x as much money). Because the idle consumption is high on these all-in-ones, you will need at least 400 watts of solar panels attached to your system to offset the loss. If you do not plan to have your inverter on 24/7, this is not a problem. As i understand it to run a fridge would require 24/7 an hence this may not work.


That makes me think that a fridge,which you would normally want to run all the time, might not work on this. I have to admit, though, that I am not really sure what he is saying here. I would appreciate any help on this question thanks Joe

 

[Bud Martin]

So are most of your loads running on 12VDC but do you need to run 1220VAC loads some time too?
Do you know what your power consumption will be each day?

 

[gouthro2002]

So are most of your loads running on 12VDC but do you need to run 1220VAC loads some time too?
Do you know what your power consumption will be each day?

hi bud,
thanks for the response. Like I said, much of the terminology here goes over my head. For camping I will certainly be using the 12 volt system. And the refrigerator would be one of the regular ones that they sell, Iceco, or somethng like that. I hear that these refrigerator freezers might not consume much electricity if they are just sitting there. But, I am not sure if it will work.

Regading your second question of1220VAC loads. I don't know what that means. As I say, it will be for camping, a few lights, charging cell phones, and the fridge. At home as a backup, it will only be for emergencies and I would hope to run a few lights, again cellphone charge, etc.
joe

 

[gouthro2002]

i checked into 1220VAC and see that it is regular house current. So, yes, as I mentionned, i would hope to use it for that in emergency situations of loss of poser. Not an ongoing thing. But, just to have a few things working, as I said earlier, like lights, cell chargers etc. nothing permanent here, though, except, possibly once again the fridge freezer that i would also be using for camping.
thanks jeo

 

[pollenface]

The statement "high idle consumption" refers to that of the inverter side of the AIO unit which can be switched OFF when not required.

Running a 12v fridge directly from a 12v battery is not a concern for you. The charge controller side of the AIO unit will function independent of the inverter functionality.

 

[Rednecktek]

You want the fridge to run on 12v which makes things much easier. You can turn the inverter off to save the power consumption and still have it charging the batteries. Since your 12v loads would come straight from the battery, the inverter would only need to be on when you needed 1220 err... 120v for something.

The huge benefit to using an AIO is that it's really, really easy to get things installed and running. With an AIO you get the MPPT charger for your panels, an AC charger to plug into a wall outlet, a transfer switch to prioritize between battery and wall power, the inverter to convert the battery power to wall power.

If you wanted to do components you'd need a lot of individual parts, wires, extra pieces, and would most likely cost more than the AIO was.

I did something similar with my solar dolly where I run the AIO off the battery and a bunch of 12v stuff off the same battery. I can turn off the inverter and still have all my 12v stuff and USB stuff without having to eat up battery power.

 

[Bud Martin]

hi bud,
thanks for the response. Like I said, much of the terminology here goes over my head. For camping I will certainly be using the 12 volt system. And the refrigerator would be one of the regular ones that they sell, Iceco, or somethng like that. I hear that these refrigerator freezers might not consume much electricity if they are just sitting there. But, I am not sure if it will work.

Regading your second question of1220VAC loads. I don't know what that means. As I say, it will be for camping, a few lights, charging cell phones, and the fridge. At home as a backup, it will only be for emergencies and I would hope to run a few lights, again cellphone charge, etc.
joe

Sorry, that is my typo, it is 120VAC.

 

[gouthro2002]

Thanks to everyone for jumping in. I can see now that this much simpler system will do pretty much what I want. That’s great!

Just out of curiosity, what kinds of things would Will be referring to when he says that you will not be able to use this system 24/7?

Also, it looks like this system could be quite portable, would it not? I don’t mean you would drag it all over the place all the time. But, you could keep it in the house when you are there. And then detatch it and put it in the van when you want to go camping. Am i correct in that?
Thanks joe

 

[gouthro2002]

You want the fridge to run on 12v which makes things much easier. You can turn the inverter off to save the power consumption and still have it charging the batteries. Since your 12v loads would come straight from the battery, the inverter would only need to be on when you needed 1220 err... 120v for something.

The huge benefit to using an AIO is that it's really, really easy to get things installed and running. With an AIO you get the MPPT charger for your panels, an AC charger to plug into a wall outlet, a transfer switch to prioritize between battery and wall power, the inverter to convert the battery power to wall power.

If you wanted to do components you'd need a lot of individual parts, wires, extra pieces, and would most likely cost more than the AIO was.

I did something similar with my solar dolly where I run the AIO off the battery and a bunch of 12v stuff off the same battery. I can turn off the inverter and still have all my 12v stuff and USB stuff without having to eat up battery power.

I had a look at your solar dolly. An impressive rig. As a beginner i am wondering why you would have a fuse box between the ( i think) usb outlets and the AIO? And why not one on the regular wall outlet?

Also, you say that you tested the jackery on it. I would be planning on using a smaller version of the AIO in place of a Jackery. I know that it is not as compact and convenient. But other than that, am I missing something on why I cannot do that?
Thanks joe

 

[Zwy]

Probably the best way to run a 120V fridge is to have a small inverter to run just the fridge. Something like a 300W to 400W inverter. The truly best way to have a fridge for a camper is to use a 12V/24V fridge. I have a Dometic CFX95 and it will run on 12V/24V and takes about 36W when running.

For larger loads such as microwaves, blow driers, electric kettles, and inverter style mini splits, then a AIO is a good choice. Built in transfer switch, ac charger, larger inverter power for those larger loads. Simply have a switch where it can be turned on/off to limit idle consumption.

 

[gouthro2002]

i will be using a 12 volt fridge
thanks

 

[Rednecktek]

I had a look at your solar dolly. An impressive rig. As a beginner i am wondering why you would have a fuse box between the ( i think) usb outlets and the AIO? And why not one on the regular wall outlet?

The regular outlets connect to the AC Out from the inverter which has a breaker in the AIO where the fuse block feeds the USB, the cig lighters, and the 12v terminals. I can turn the inverter off and still use the 12v/USB/Stuff ports without having to drain the battery with the standby power draw of the inverter. Basically there are 2 complete systems there, a 120v and a 12v.

Also, you say that you tested the jackery on it. I would be planning on using a smaller version of the AIO in place of a Jackery. I know that it is not as compact and convenient. But other than that, am I missing something on why I cannot do that?
Thanks joe

Nope, I was just making sure the 12v and the 120v charging worked at full speed. It was a light load test to make sure the ends were running like I thought and that I hadn't messed anything up on the wiring. ?

The old circular saw at 900+ watts was the REAL test!

Just out of curiosity, what kinds of things would Will be referring to when he says that you will not be able to use this system 24/7?

Not sure on that one, I'd have to re-watch the video to find the reference. There's no reason I could think of to not be able to use it 24/7 as many people do that with off-grid shops and sheds and such on a pretty regular basis. I think he may be referring to just how much battery the inverter needs to survive just to exist (the standby power) draining a good chunk of your capacity. I got around this by building myself a 280Ah battery. It's about the same physical size as a deep cycle lead acid, but has 4.5x the energy capacity. Most people use the bog standard off the shelf LFP batteries which are only 100Ah.

Also, it looks like this system could be quite portable, would it not? I don’t mean you would drag it all over the place all the time. But, you could keep it in the house when you are there. And then detatch it and put it in the van when you want to go camping. Am i correct in that?

It can be as portable as you can physically make it. Mine is pretty tall because I wanted all sorts of things on there like the different USB's and the 12v terminals and the like, plus I didn't want to have to mangle my monster hands into really small wire harnesses and there was no reason I had to. It's really up to your imagination on how you would like to build it, and your abilities with power tools.

You can head over to Youtubes and search for "DIY solar generator" and you'll see dozens of examples of people putting them on carts or tool boxes or travel totes or dollys or the like. Let your imagination run wild!

 

[gouthro2002]

I have a Dometic CFX95 and it will run on 12V/24V and takes about 36W when running.

Just a small bifurcation on the main question, if you have the time. I have wondered whether you need to keep the 12 volt fridge connected to the battery all the time? I ask this because I would like to take the battery out and use it in my canoe for a few hours. Would I be better to get another battery, or do you think the fridge and freezer will keep during that time, in the same way, say, that a 120 volt freezer can be disconnected from power for a day or two with things staying cold
thanks joe

 

[Rednecktek]

If it's only a couple hours and nobody is going in and out of it you should be fine.

 

[OffGridForGood]

For a very small set up you can use the 'solar generators' like Jackery/Bluetti/Ecoflow delta - for a beginner, these are impossible to mess up, but you will pay maybe double what a home made small set up might cost you, if you have would like to DIY.
Another route may be a small AIO like the 12-volt MPP 1012 which has all the outlets 120 and USB and 12-volt already built in.
I went with 24-volt and got the MPP 2724 - also with 120volt plugs and USB built in for my portable camping small set up.
These small units literally take five minutes to set up, attach a battery, connect a PV solar panel directly to MC-4 connectors on the unit and push Start. your running. Going this way you can look for the best battery you can, or start with a cheap AGM and later trade up to LiFePO4 when your comfortatble, and ready to spend a bit more.

 

[gouthro2002]

For a very small set up you can use the 'solar generators' like Jackery/Bluetti/Ecoflow delta - for a beginner, these are impossible to mess up, but you will pay maybe double what a home made small set up might cost you, if you have would like to DIY.
Another route may be a small AIO like the 12-volt MPP 1012 which has all the outlets 120 and USB and 12-volt already built in.
I went with 24-volt and got the MPP 2724 - also with 120volt plugs and USB built in for my portable camping small set up.
These small units literally take five minutes to set up, attach a battery, connect a PV solar panel directly to MC-4 connectors on the unit and push Start. your running. Going this way you can look for the best battery you can, or start with a cheap AGM and later trade up to LiFePO4 when your comfortatble, and ready to spend a bit more.

Thanks yes, that is my plan

 

[Zwy]

Just a small bifurcation on the main question, if you have the time. I have wondered whether you need to keep the 12 volt fridge connected to the battery all the time? I ask this because I would like to take the battery out and use it in my canoe for a few hours. Would I be better to get another battery, or do you think the fridge and freezer will keep during that time, in the same way, say, that a 120 volt freezer can be disconnected from power for a day or two with things staying cold
thanks joe

Should be fine for a few hours. You could run it off the truck battery during that time. If the Dometic runs half the time on a normal day and it is unplugged for 2 hours, it will have used 36Wh in that time. On a 12V system, that's 3Ah.

There is also a cover available to help insulate the Dometic.

 

[Swamplizard]

FWIW I made a mistake - my Rv battery system is 24v and I have an all in one. The fridge is a dorm-type 120v minifridge and I picked up a small 500 watt pure sine inverter for when all I need is the fridge running....BUT....I purchased a 24v to 12v step down that cant handle 500w. When the fridge kicks in and the LEDs lights are on the ceiling they blink - Close but no cigar ;-)

 

[Rednecktek]

Sounds like you need a beefier 24v->12v converter.

 

[OffGridForGood]

Seen 30A model on Aliexpress for $40USD -about.