Solis RHI 6K 48ES 5G Inverter Fox ESS LV5200 Battery - Charging limit ? and export to grid ...

[SeaGal]

That looks more suitable. Just using resistive heaters - there's a good thread on heaters here...

LiFePO4 heating pad for cold temperatures

I think that item will do next to zero to insulate the battery. What I did and several others have done is using 2" XPS rigid foam. In my case I lined the inside of a box with it. It has an R-value (US units) of 10, so it does provide fairly good insulation. If you read through the rest of this...

diysolarforum.com

It will all depend on the thickness of your pir, volume of enclosure and temperature differentials, as to how much heat you need.

 

[GBRDBRY]

I have the boss of the installation team coming out early next week ... the saga continues... I could but won't do a DIY insulated temp controlled heated cabinet .. they can ! or move it ... The data on the post from @ScottishBadger is bang on for what the chap at Fox told me as well...

 

[coolcarper1]

I have the boss of the installation team coming out early next week ... the saga continues... I could but won't do a DIY insulated temp controlled heated cabinet .. they can ! or move it ... The data on the post from @ScottishBadger is bang on for what the chap at Fox told me as well...

I will hold off too for now. I have sent the Information from our chats to my installer he is now chasing fox for answers as he said none if this Information was passed to them.
Atleast it feels like we are getting closer to sorting this issue.

 

[coolcarper1]

Might be a daft question but if we do have to build a heated cabinet will it need to house the inverter too or just the batteries

 

[SeaGal]

Might be a daft question but if we do have to build a heated cabinet will it need to house the inverter too or just the batteries

No... def only batteries. The Inverter needs to have plenty of space for its natural cooling. Hope the installers gave it the correct amount of space...

see...

 

[GBRDBRY]

I have had the MD of Envo Energy the Company we bought the installation from - very apologetic, .. but he says this is not a common thing .. BS I called .. pointed him to data and facts on here etc .. data from Fox re battery temps .. He promises a senior technical guy from their company here next week ...

Mean time I have just resurrected an old Temp / humidity sensor and it will be going in loft asap .. then I can track the data and correlate exactly the amp charge rate vs temp ...

 

[coolcarper1]

No... def only batteries. The Inverter needs to have plenty of space for its natural cooling. Hope the installers gave it the correct amount of space...

see...

Plenty of room

 

[coolcarper1]

I have had the MD of Envo Energy the Company we bought the installation from - very apologetic, .. but he says this is not a common thing .. BS I called .. pointed him to data and facts on here etc .. data from Fox re battery temps .. He promises a senior technical guy from their company here next week ...

Mean time I have just resurrected an old Temp / humidity sensor and it will be going in loft asap .. then I can track the data and correlate exactly the amp charge rate vs temp ...

To be fair my installer seemed very taken back by the comments so perhaps fox have not been so open to them.
It would be interesting to put some heat up there and watch them work as they should then we have concrete proof.

 

[ScottishBadger]

To be fair my installer seemed very taken back by the comments so perhaps fox have not been so open to them.
It would be interesting to put some heat up there and watch them work as they should then we have concrete proof.

The bloke that called me back today stated quite clearly that all installers purchasing from them are given full tech info and data (that isn't in the little installation guides!) to aid them with their installations. This includes charging rate v's temp info, allegedly. I have to say I'm inclined to believe him, as so far, Fox are the only company to actually get back in touch with me to look into this "fault". I can't get through to Solis and I've waited over 8 days for a callback from my installer, although to be fair I got an email direct from someone within the installation company late this afternoon asking me to contact them direct on a mobile number, which I will do on Monday. Could be an interesting conversation......
I have a space-heater in the workshop, it's tempting to go up there at midnight and turn it on and see if the charge rate is any higher at 00:30..... only problem with that is the noise of the heater, my neighbours might not be too impressed, haha.

 

[coolcarper1]

Better to heat it in the morning and see if you get better charge results I would have thought,

 

[coolcarper1]

Here we have 3 screen shots to show the charging limit
6am is 10amp
11am 24amp
Afternoon 100amp
This is for 2 batteries so half that if you have 1
Times are appox

 

[coolcarper1]

Agree with PIR... my DIY battery box has 100mm of A1-grade fire-resistant celotex around it and some temperature driven low wattage heaters ?‍. Sitting at 23 degrees right now, 10 degrees above ambient

Can you tell me what heaters you are using please

 

[coolcarper1]

I have built a insulated box using 18mm ply lined with 50mm pir board and put a small heater in it with a thermal cut off.
This morning it was reading maximum charge 30amp 15amp per battery.
I turned the heater on and after 4hrs it is still reading maximum 30amp. I'm confused as to why this has not made any difference and can only assume it's because the batteries are enclosed in a metal case or the problem is something else.
The temperature in the box is reading 21.5c
See attached screen shot

 

[SeaGal]

What is the battery temperature, according to the BMS? LiFePO4 cells are pretty solid, so best to keep them at a steady temperature, rather than expecting them to warm up quickly when cold.

 

[coolcarper1]

As a test I have just force charged the system and after running for 5 mins it has now gone to 100a maximum charge.
So it seems that it does not recognise any heat increase until it starts to draw a charge.
So the heating does work but won't register on bms untill the system is drawing a charge.

What is the battery temperature, according to the BMS? LiFePO4 cells are pretty solid, so best to keep them at a steady temperature, rather than expecting them to warm up quickly when cold.

I can't see anywhere it states the battery temperature

 

[coolcarper1]

What is the battery temperature, according to the BMS? LiFePO4 cells are pretty solid, so best to keep them at a steady temperature, rather than expecting them to warm up quickly when cold.

I can't find a battery temperature on the system

 

[coolcarper1]

Due to having 2 batteries and cables spanning both batteries I have had to make a larger box and it would take a larger heater to keep it warm so leaving a heater on constantly might not be a good idea.
I have pushed back to the installers to see if they can fit batteries better suited to the loft.

 

[coolcarper1]

UPDATE
I have put 100mm celotec pir insulation board around my batteries.
I have attached a 12w (11"×11") habistat reptile mat to the front panel of the batteries.
I have fitted a inkbird thermostat controller for safety so it cuts the power if it gets too hot.
This seems to have worked and today my battery was working at 25a and after a few minutes got upto its maximum 50a per battery. So this seems to be a solution.
I spoke to fox about the battery problem myself and like others have said it's down to the cold temperature and he claims all batteries regardless of make will act the same.
Hope this update helps.

 

[SeaGal]

Good you have something usable before the colder weather this week. Well done . Should work a treat now with the celotex and good to have the safety cut-off too.

I don't believe that all battery packs will act the same - I heard Pylontech (for example), restrict charge current at around 5 degrees, not 15 degrees as FOX do.

Having said that, I would far prefer to keep batteries around 20 degrees anyway and I agree that restricting charge current from 10 degrees makes sense and is in line with manufacture recommendations, which is why my system does similar. (Obviously this is possible for grid-connected systems, but impractical in remote cabins / camper-van scenarios).

It's just a shame that a) FOX aren't more upfront about the specifics and b) that their installers will just install anywhere without any thought or discussion about the temperature limitations and then refuse to rectify their mistakes.

 

[Frankie1000]

Hi All, just had my Solis 6kw inverter and two Fox LV5200s installed too and noticed exactly the same problem others were having. Charge rate was maxing out at 1300w or 24A, BMS error stating low temp on inverter. Only way of knowing via app appears to be looking at what the charge current limit is.

Just added some insulation around them (rockwool inside insulating bubble wrap) and will see if that does the job over winter months. Hoping the hest generated by the internal resistance of the batteries is enough to get it up to 15c, but hope it won't exceed 30c.

The hest mats might be a better solution in the long term with a modest amount of insulation instead, so if the batteries get hot during the summer months they can still radiate the heat away.