pilotdrh
New Member
I would expect the top to be line/source. That is where I would connect the inverter.
Finally, the start of my 25kw Ground Mount grid-tie system
- Thread starter live4soccer7
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Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
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It shows inverter connected to same side of meter as utility grid to its meter.
These are just numbers. Assuming meters are bidirectional, utility could use "+" vs. "-" and get oppose behavior. I think the answer has to come from utility company to be certain.
I hope they don't credit you $0.05 for power you're producing while charging you $0.20 for the same electrons making a sharp left and flowing to your own loads.
These are just numbers. Assuming meters are bidirectional, utility could use "+" vs. "-" and get oppose behavior. I think the answer has to come from utility company to be certain.
I hope they don't credit you $0.05 for power you're producing while charging you $0.20 for the same electrons making a sharp left and flowing to your own loads.
fromport
Solar Addict
A PV meter is used to measure how much electricity your solar system generated. I have to assume this is a one-directional meter, as you won’t be transferring power to your solar system.
I would hook it up with the Inverter on the grid side and the Side Tap to the load of the meter.
Isn't that specified in the one line diagram you submitted for the permit btw ?
I would hook it up with the Inverter on the grid side and the Side Tap to the load of the meter.
Isn't that specified in the one line diagram you submitted for the permit btw ?
wattmatters
Solar Wizard
That's a different meter. The Fronius inverter already has a in-built measurement of its power and energy production.
What live4soccer7 is talking about is a separate Fronius consumption meter (not the utility meter but a private meter). This meter connects to a data manager card inside the inverter to provide full visibility of production, consumption, imports and exports.
wattmatters
Solar Wizard
The Fronius meter can be placed in a couple of different locations with respect to he utility meter and loads (consumption path or feed-in point), and there are settings to tell the system where it is placed so it knows how to correctly update all the various energy registers (it also monitors a whole range of other system data).
I don't know which side of the meter's terminals are inverter/load and which are the utility meter - I can only assume that's shown in the meter's installation manual. I think the US the Fronius meters are a different type to the ones we use here in Australia (and Europe).
I don't know which side of the meter's terminals are inverter/load and which are the utility meter - I can only assume that's shown in the meter's installation manual. I think the US the Fronius meters are a different type to the ones we use here in Australia (and Europe).
fromport
Solar Addict
I based my reply of @live4soccer7 provided diagram. It has a supply side tap, where there is no usage allowed.
Only feeding solar in at that point. So only production/export is allowed.
He mentioned in a reply "At some point down the road I would like to look into batteries". (posting #961)
With a supply side tap that is not allowed AFAIK. PV only.
He must have pulled a permit. would be nice to see the one line diagram he provided for the permit.
That would probably explain a lot more than us trying to guess his setup.
wattmatters
Solar Wizard
@live4soccer7 never posted a diagram.
fromport
Solar Addict
Yep, you are correct. pilotdrh did.
pilotdrh
New Member
That was a pic I found on the internet. I assume he was referring to the meter that measures his produced power and required by the utility company. Here in the PI they call it the CEP meter. It's all part of the dance. The utility replaces your standard meter with a bidirectional meter, why do you also need another meter? Because they want to charge you every penny they can for what you take from the grid.
wattmatters
Solar Wizard
@live4soccer7 has 1:1 flat rate net metering. IOW the grid is a virtual battery so having a bidirectional utility meter is to his advantage. It's about as ideal a scenario as you can imagine for a home solar PV system.
It was a fundamental parameter considered when designing his PV system.
I wasn't however talking about the utility meter. I was talking about (and I think live4soccer7 was too) the private metering for his own data monitoring - Fronius have their own meters. Placement of those meters can vary.
pilotdrh
New Member
I would expect that meter would come with wiring info.
wattmatters
Solar Wizard
Most Fronius kit has installation guides/manuals online.
live4soccer7
Solar Enthusiast
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I found some info online. The inverter outputs should go to the "line side".
I accomplished quite a bit this weekend. A lot of wiring on AC side. That is all finished minus torquing a couple large lugs that I need to get a bigger allen for, otherwise AC is done beside the interconnection to the grid itself.
I've applied stickers everywhere and just need to get a few more made up and put the phenolic on.
I ran out of heyco panel/wire clips, so ordered more of them. Finally got in the MC4 tools for tightening the connectors that I terminated. Got those done.
Got the 100A disconnect that will go to the shop wired on the input side.
Ground rods installed and wired.
all conduit that comes out of the ground has the sealant on them now.
What's left:
----------------
Phenolic and a few stickers
A couple KOs to install when they show up
Interconnection with utility company
wire clips and plug in panels to complete the series (test voltage after this is done at multiple location)
Fab up an end plate for one of my gutters
Fab up one more bracket to hold the electric rack to the detached garage. It's not really needed, but the extra stability and security will be nice.
I need to confirm one way or the other if the data managers actually have to be pulled out of the slave units or if they are ok just not being connected to the LAN.
I assume once I apply DC power to the inverters, even with AC disconnected, I will be able to see the inverters come on so I can set them up????
I accomplished quite a bit this weekend. A lot of wiring on AC side. That is all finished minus torquing a couple large lugs that I need to get a bigger allen for, otherwise AC is done beside the interconnection to the grid itself.
I've applied stickers everywhere and just need to get a few more made up and put the phenolic on.
I ran out of heyco panel/wire clips, so ordered more of them. Finally got in the MC4 tools for tightening the connectors that I terminated. Got those done.
Got the 100A disconnect that will go to the shop wired on the input side.
Ground rods installed and wired.
all conduit that comes out of the ground has the sealant on them now.
What's left:
----------------
Phenolic and a few stickers
A couple KOs to install when they show up
Interconnection with utility company
wire clips and plug in panels to complete the series (test voltage after this is done at multiple location)
Fab up an end plate for one of my gutters
Fab up one more bracket to hold the electric rack to the detached garage. It's not really needed, but the extra stability and security will be nice.
I need to confirm one way or the other if the data managers actually have to be pulled out of the slave units or if they are ok just not being connected to the LAN.
I assume once I apply DC power to the inverters, even with AC disconnected, I will be able to see the inverters come on so I can set them up????
pilotdrh
New Member
Can you smell it? Victory is in the air!
wattmatters
Solar Wizard
No. They are powered by AC.
pilotdrh
New Member
I assume you mean DC from the PV? Are your inverters hybrid? If not then you need AC.
wattmatters
Solar Wizard
Not sure if you're asking me or live4soccer7.
Fronius Primo inverters are not hybrids so it can only be DC from the PV arrays. They require power via their AC connection to turn on. Without an AC power supply the inverters are off. In a grid outage, the inverters are off and the house has no power.
Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
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My GT PV inverters are powered by DC. Most I can talk to and configure with PV connected.
Most won't respond with just AC, but the TriPower do.
However, some earlier model Sunny Boy wouldn't connect to PC and allow configuration until they had connected to AC and started feeding the grid. Which they wouldn't do until it was with UL-1741 spec, and it wasn't because Sunny Island was sourcing a different frequency.
Most won't respond with just AC, but the TriPower do.
However, some earlier model Sunny Boy wouldn't connect to PC and allow configuration until they had connected to AC and started feeding the grid. Which they wouldn't do until it was with UL-1741 spec, and it wasn't because Sunny Island was sourcing a different frequency.
live4soccer7
Solar Enthusiast
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Yes, definitely in the home stretch barring any major inspection issues. I can't wait to get it live and also to free up the time I've been spending on it.
I suppose the proper way to configure them then would be to have the DC disconnected and have the AC hooked up. Configure for the proper zone/configuration and then let the DC flow.
I suppose the proper way to configure them then would be to have the DC disconnected and have the AC hooked up. Configure for the proper zone/configuration and then let the DC flow.
live4soccer7
Solar Enthusiast
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I just had to post this from the fonius docs. I was really worried about not be able to expand (sarcasm)
When installing multiple inverters on the same site, it is possible to daisy chain Fronius inverters with each other. To do this it is necessary to connect a Master-Inverter with up to 99 Slave-Inverters.
Edit: reading the docs, it doesn't seem like I have to actually remove the data manager card if I just put them into slave mode. From there I just have to assign the inverters a "Number" in the settings and connect the master to wifi/lan and I should be good.
When installing multiple inverters on the same site, it is possible to daisy chain Fronius inverters with each other. To do this it is necessary to connect a Master-Inverter with up to 99 Slave-Inverters.
Edit: reading the docs, it doesn't seem like I have to actually remove the data manager card if I just put them into slave mode. From there I just have to assign the inverters a "Number" in the settings and connect the master to wifi/lan and I should be good.
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