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New Tariffs in the States

So before 90 days I need to find a homestead, move to it, and buy all my solar panels for it.
Or... take the panels off my roof and take them with me. Patch the holes before putting the house up for sale. Can't say I haven't thought about doing that. (21x 400W REC panels).

But that's only if we are certain we're moving. And at current interest rates and property prices, it doesn't look all that feasible at times. Given what I paid for this house and our current interest rate, I couldn't afford to buy it today at current prices and rates. Insane.
 
SparkyJJO said:
So before 90 days I need to find a homestead, move to it, and buy all my solar panels for it.
Or... take the panels off my roof and take them with me. Patch the holes before putting the house up for sale. Can't say I haven't thought about doing that. (21x 400W REC panels).

But that's only if we are certain we're moving. And at current interest rates and property prices, it doesn't look all that feasible at times. Given what I paid for this house and our current interest rate, I couldn't afford to buy it today at current prices and rates. Insane.
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So buy the panels now, and if you don’t move in three months, they will be more valuable and you can sell them for a profit.
 
Mattb4 said:
Anything over "D" size?

One thing I thought after hearing that they were going to place huge tariffs on imported electrical cars from China, which they say sell for ~$14 thousand over there, was why? I could afford a car in that price range and I imagine a lot of other folks could more easily afford it also. They said it was necessary to save our Auto industry who only seems to want to sell electric vehicles to rich people. Or at least those that can help pay for it with huge tax subsidies ordinary folks have no access to.

If Detroit can not make cars and trucks that ordinary people can afford they have forgotten Henry Fords legacy.
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Same reason they are threatening Mexico to not build Chinese car production facilities.
They truly do not care about whatever rationale they tell the public.
Only power, control, and money.
 
wpns said:
No-one can because it’s not that easy balancing all the factors (range, power, size, mass, cost), and the US consumer has proven over and over again that ’size matters’, and it’s the Suburban Assault Vehicles that sell, while the $25K EVs are either never produced (looking at you, Tesla) or sit on the lot awaiting a fire sale.
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People buy suburban assault vehicles because that’s what Detroit puts out on purpose to avoid certain fuel economy targets
They don’t try to innovate and problem solve, just skirt the rules
They don’t make small EV because they don’t want to
 
G00SE said:
People buy suburban assault vehicles because that’s what Detroit puts out on purpose to avoid certain fuel economy targets
They don’t try to innovate and problem solve, just skirt the rules
They don’t make small EV because they don’t want to
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Um, people weren't buying enough of the other stuff. The car makers were mostly building what people were buying. Conveniently, because more people wanted them, they had a higher profit margin too.

Not enough people here want small EVs.
 
SparkyJJO said:
Um, people weren't buying enough of the other stuff. The car makers were mostly building what people were buying. Conveniently, because more people wanted them, they had a higher profit margin too.

Not enough people here want small EVs.
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People weren’t buying the other stuff cuz gas was 2 bucks a gallon. The economy and auto market are both completely different than 5 years ago
 
v_green57 said:
That is also true, but I believe things have changed. I think the overriding reason this year is to get elected/stay elected by any means. The rise of authoritarianism requires continuity. Appeal to our lack of taking the time to actually become informed about things and instead react emotionally to misinformation and outright crap being spewed from all corners.

Nobody tries to surreptitiously manipulate us any more, they just flat-out say "Do this, you idiots. And don't bitch about it - you can't change things anyway. We know what's best."

As far as inflation goes - we led a very charmed life there for a long time. The low-hanging fruit of easily extracted/plentiful raw materials and resources is swiftly drawing to a close. Things are catching up to that and we are paying more.

Since we can't as a society pull our heads out and collectively fix the big stuff, you are left to your own devices to do what you can individually. But that's what the forum is all about ;-)

(sorry about going off-track here - I guess this belongs in chit-chat. I will shut up.)
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It took me awhile to put 2 and 2 together. Sourcing parts has been somewhat difficult the last few years, first it was supply chain issues but by now it should have reversed. I heard some time ago that companies had been moving production to India from China. The factories had to be built, equipment installed and training a workforce. This must be finished and now trade restrictions on China will be enacted. All makes sense now.
 
mciholas said:
"The tariff rate on semiconductors will increase from 25% to 50% by 2025."

Think about what this means for a USA based company designing electronic products.

You can build those devices in the USA with imported parts tariffed at 50%.

Or you can build those devices in China (or other Asian locations) where the parts have no tariff and your finished device might not, either.

Guess which one is cheaper.

Guess which one costs more USA jobs.

My company is facing this very question for our future products. We've been mostly USA based production, but the tariff increase is adding considerable motivation to move it overseas due to labor and part costs being so much cheaper.

Mike C.
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Sounds like things are going exactly as planned.
 
Zwy said:
Tariffs increase the costs= inflation

No politician will increase tariffs in an election year unless it fills their pocket and they plan on leaving office.
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Or they're so sure they aren't going to lose the election they don't care what the little people think.
 
Well it at least appears that Battery Cells for the DIY Crowd are SAFE FOR NOW - there is that November thing in the US -
SCC's Inverters, AIO's seems like are going to get a smaller hit for now.

I personally would not "sit back" too long though, things have an un-funny way of changing.

The tariff rate on lithium-ion EV batteries will increase from 7.5%% to 25% in 2024, while the tariff rate on lithium-ion non-EV batteries will increase from 7.5% to 25% in 2026. The tariff rate on battery parts will increase from 7.5% to 25% in 2024. From the whitehouse site itself.
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I wonder "what" they will consider "Battery Parts". I suspect BMS' will be such.
 
AntronX said:
Brucey said:
Remains to be seen if the traditional prismatic cells are considered "non EV" as they can be assembled into an EV battery.
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If they are meant to be used for storage then it can be argued they are non EV. This means we got until 2026 to stock up on LFP cells before we get hit with ~$13/cell tariff (for 300Ah cell).
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If they're in a welded-jumper assembly, inside a completed storage system, with neither the system being suitable for building into an EV as part of its integrated battery nor the battery assembly being removed and used as a component of one, it would be hard for customs to treat it as anything but non-EV. (Not impossible, of course, and an appeal might take until the non-EV tariff kicked in...)

Of course this means storage systems using dual-use-capable cells will only be assembled abroad, because domestic manufacturers would have to pay tariff on the cells.

Also, for the next couple years EV and non-EV cells will not have a combined economy of scale, a smaller benefit from technology improvement, and their manufacturing won't get increased stability due to merging distinct fluctuating demands (e.g. depression of EV sales leading to more availability of cells for storage systems, letting the cell manufacturer continue running at the same rate at only a small income hit from market signaling rather than ramping down and taking a BIG income hit from lower output and competition fighting for market share.)
 
The Chinese have been getting around existing tariffs by shipping through other south east asian countrys.
They may be able to figure a way to get around the new tariffs.
The only thing certain about laws/rules/regulations in this country is that they always contain loopholes.

Tariffs are applied based on where final assembly for a good takes place.

Finally assembly could be a single screw
 
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Steve_S said:
I wonder "what" they will consider "Battery Parts". I suspect BMS' will be such.
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I'd bet that's a "yes".

If so, I wonder if they'll apply (all or some of) the tariff to storage systems containing Chinese BMSes. If not, it's another strike to US domestic battery manufacturers vs. foreign competition.
 
Steve_S said:
Well it at least appears that Battery Cells for the DIY Crowd are SAFE FOR NOW - there is that November thing in the US -
SCC's Inverters, AIO's seems like are going to get a smaller hit for now.

I personally would not "sit back" too long though, things have an un-funny way of changing.


I wonder "what" they will consider "Battery Parts". I suspect BMS' will be such.
Click to expand...
I ordered twenty two BMS with an extra six for the shelf plus some extra breakers.
 
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Supervstech said:
The INSTANT a tarrif is set, ALL battery/solar will reflect the price change.

If EVERYBODY stopped buying anything after the tarrif takes effect, a message would be sent...
But if government requires solar on new construction, demand will compensate for the increase...
China will likely cease exporting to usa in that case...
Till next election vetos it.
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There have been tarrifs in place prior to last election. China has been getting around them.
 
Caution: Tariffs are paid by the buyer.
If you order something direct from China, your order may be held by customs . You’ll have pay the tariff to get it released.
 
I actually live in Mexico....Cabo San Lucas and not the mainland. The crazy thing is that here everything is overpriced Chinese JUNK. We're talking 200-250 watt panels being sold, no name low amperage charge controllers and inverters, etc. Heading to California next week to bring down some Victron 150/100's, Canadian Solar (yes Chinese) panels and 64 more EVE cells. So Overkill solar BMS (and all brands) are going to be hit as well? I can sell everything at a profit no joke. Need to figure out Alibaba or how everyone is getting solar/cells. I started an MX corporation and finally have tax ID.
 
Starex said:
Caution: Tariffs are paid by the buyer.
If you order something direct from China, your order may be held by customs . You’ll have pay the tariff to get it released.
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Yep if the tariff hits before your stuff gets through customs you will have to pay it to get your stuff.
 
If there is some mistake i have made a lot, it has been not taking action even if i knew it was the right thing to do.
Get your stuff when is still easy and cheap, tariffs are not coming down, and inflation is never stopping.
Putting together a solar system has done great things for my quality of living, get this tariffs spike as a sign that taking action is necessary.
 
Is the tariff going to hit Chinese panels (80% of market) or LiFePO4 cells first? I've contacted James at 18650 and he has 64 cells reserved at $6400. Also contacted a source for Canadian Solar CS6W-540MB (eBay) at $150/each. Not sure I want to spend $20k in one fell swoop.
 
Stiffmeister said:
Is the tariff going to hit Chinese panels (80% of market) or LiFePO4 cells first? I've contacted James at 18650 and he has 64 cells reserved at $6400. Also contacted a source for Canadian Solar CS6W-540MB (eBay) at $150/each. Not sure I want to spend $20k in one fell swoop.
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The Chinese panels are already shipped thru/via other south east Asian countries and then onwards to the US to get around existing tariffs. I don't think anyone is doing the same for LFP cells so they may go up, but keep in mind cell prices continue to drop.
 
Brucey said:
The Chinese panels are already shipped thru/via other south east Asian countries and then onwards to the US to get around existing tariffs. I don't think anyone is doing the same for LFP cells so they may go up, but keep in mind cell prices continue to drop.
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Thanks for the information. Yes the EVE cells have dropped 1/3 since I purchased 64 last year. I'm going to purchase the Canadian Solar panels and haul them to Mexico and wait on batteries.
 
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