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Are there any batteries do not deteriorate while stored?

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heimlich

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Is there any battery that doesn't deteriorate from sitting in storage? I plan on using them in a camper for a few weeks a year and maybe a few other weekends. So, if you look at a whole year I'll use the batteries just a few times out of the year. Are there any batteries out there that don't lose their charging/discharging capabilities from sitting unused? I read that LIFEPO batteries last 10 years but aren't they like all the rest that if they are unused they deteriorate? I've read both but if I am only going to get 10 years out of them it may not be worth it. I just need a battery to keep the fridge running in between generator charges.
 
Also drain them a little before storage- really just not full. 60% to 75%.
 
heimlich said:
Is there any battery that doesn't deteriorate from sitting in storage? I plan on using them in a camper for a few weeks a year and maybe a few other weekends. So, if you look at a whole year I'll use the batteries just a few times out of the year. Are there any batteries out there that don't lose their charging/discharging capabilities from sitting unused? I read that LIFEPO batteries last 10 years but aren't they like all the rest that if they are unused they deteriorate? I've read both but if I am only going to get 10 years out of them it may not be worth it. I just need a battery to keep the fridge running in between generator charges.
Click to expand...
If you have solar, just leave the fridge on low and the charge controller on, and let the batteries cycle.
 
There are a lot of trade-offs, but several of the flooded chemistries can be purchased as dry/empty cells and activated by adding electrolyte when needed. Some lead-acid battery manufacturers advertise 5 - 10 years of storage with minimal loss of capacity. Nickel iron batteries should store more or less indefinitely in that state. That said, you really need to figure out what you're trying to accomplish since the downsides to those battery technologies may (probably?) outweigh the advantage of long shelf storage life.
 
Symbioquine said:
There are a lot of trade-offs, but several of the flooded chemistries can be purchased as dry/empty cells and activated by adding electrolyte when needed. Some lead-acid battery manufacturers advertise 5 - 10 years of storage with minimal loss of capacity. Nickel iron batteries should store more or less indefinitely in that state. That said, you really need to figure out what you're trying to accomplish since the downsides to those battery technologies may (probably?) outweigh the advantage of long shelf storage life.
Click to expand...

There's no way lead acid will last years without proper maintenance.
 
I have lithium batteries I store inside in a dry environment at 105f for 6 months. I store at 50%.

Perhaps they degrade. I find no good data about how much. I may use the trailer 30 days a year. I still expect these to last a decade doing this.

Certainly less of a risk storing them at 105 then breaking down the 16 cells weighing 200lbs and transporting them every year.
 
A battery off button would be nice. I thought maybe draining the lead acid batteries would work but I saw some posts that said not to do that.
 
justinm001 said:
There's no way lead acid will last years without proper maintenance.
Click to expand...

I think you may have missed the specific case I was talking about. I'm referring to dry never activated flooded lead-acid batteries.

For example the Rolls documentation includes this;

Untitled.png

I can't remember where I saw the 5 to 10 years claim, but I'm pretty sure that's true. Presumably, storing the unused (never used/activated) batteries in a dry inert gas environment would help a lot too - maybe argon or nitrogen.
 
Symbioquine said:
I think you may have missed the specific case I was talking about. I'm referring to dry never activated flooded lead-acid batteries.

For example the Rolls documentation includes this;

View attachment 198084

I can't remember where I saw the 5 to 10 years claim, but I'm pretty sure that's true. Presumably, storing the unused (never used/activated) batteries in a dry inert gas environment would help a lot too - maybe argon or nitrogen.
Click to expand...
OP isn't talking about unused batteries
 
Don’t know what cells you have but these are the use and storage temperatures from the current EVE 304 cells, I would think they would be similar to what other cell manufacturers recommend. Sorry about the pictures the file will not let me save individual pages.

3B11D4EC-2DC7-4F91-B35B-4DC6054369CF.png1D5E4B93-DFC6-4608-86E3-1DB6DFE8AEF9.png
 
S Davis said:
Sorry about the pictures the file will not let me save individual pages.
Click to expand...

You can find the datasheets in 'Resources' on this site:

diysolarforum.com

EVE Cell Datasheets

As a zip due to file count limits LF50 50Ah Prismatic pdf LF75 75Ah Prismatic pdf LF80 80Ah Prismatic pdf LF90 90Ah Prismatic pdf LF90K 90Ah Prismatic pdf LF100L 100Ah Prismatic pdf LF100MA 100Ah Prismatic pdf LF105 105Ah Prismatic pdf...
diysolarforum.com diysolarforum.com
 
Some manufacturers sell dry lead acid batteries. You have to put the HCL in it yourself. Once you put it in I don't think you can remove it to stop the reaction.
 
Get a 12v lifepo4 and top it off at 13.0v every so often. Charge before use.

Or, just get a lead acid battery and keep it on a battery maintainer.

For a few times a year, lead acid is cheap.
 
DIYrich said:
Get a 12v lifepo4 and top it off at 13.0v every so often. Charge before use.

Or, just get a lead acid battery and keep it on a battery maintainer.

For a few times a year, lead acid is cheap.
Click to expand...
But lead acid doesn't last that long, no matter how well you take care of them. LFP batteries should last decades
 
Flint_RV said:
Lithium Titanium Oxide. The specs are insane. 6 minutes to charge 80%, Tolerate -30C, Don't mind being stored full. 5C continuous.
$18 for a 20Ah cell. Never cycled.
batteryhookup, if you're up for building a battery.
Click to expand...
While batteryhookup offer looks very tempting I think LFP is still more cost efficient.
LTO 390 usd/kWh
LFP 70 usd/kWh

Reasonable assumption for LFP would be 10-15 years minimum if you don't store the cells at 100% charge in crazy hot temperatures.
If the loads are light the internal impedance rise also has minimal effect, with luck you get lot more than that 15 years but predicting anything that far is difficult at best.

LTO would need to survive for 50-80 years to be more cost effective, by that time we are growing grass...
 
MattiFin said:
While batteryhookup offer looks very tempting I think LFP is still more cost efficient.
LTO 390 usd/kWh
LFP 70 usd/kWh

Reasonable assumption for LFP would be 10-15 years minimum if you don't store the cells at 100% charge in crazy hot temperatures.
If the loads are light the internal impedance rise also has minimal effect, with luck you get lot more than that 15 years but predicting anything that far is difficult at best.

LTO would need to survive for 50-80 years to be more cost effective, by that time we are growing grass...
Click to expand...
LFP is definitely a better value, but for North Texas in outside conditions, the SCiB 20 ah is a great option
 
My litime lfp battery came with instructions to store at 50% charge and around 70f for best results. But they said anything from 0f to 90f would work
 
Yep lithium cells are generally always stored at 40-50%,when buying anything with a lithium cell (phones, toys, laptops, solar batteries) you should notice they are delivered at around 50%charge this is generally considered to be the stable point of lithium chemistry and the least stressful soc.
 
heimlich said:
Some manufacturers sell dry lead acid batteries. You have to put the HCL in it yourself. Once you put it in I don't think you can remove it to stop the reaction.
Click to expand...
Please don’t put HCL into dry lead-acid batteries. Not sure what will happen, but it won’t be what you expect, and will probably involve a hazmat team for the chlorine release.
 
Another vote for LFP and charging before use. Get something with BlueTooth so you can check on cell voltages and battery health.
 
heimlich said:
Is there any battery that doesn't deteriorate from sitting in storage? I plan on using them in a camper for a few weeks a year and maybe a few other weekends. So, if you look at a whole year I'll use the batteries just a few times out of the year. Are there any batteries out there that don't lose their charging/discharging capabilities from sitting unused? I read that LIFEPO batteries last 10 years but aren't they like all the rest that if they are unused they deteriorate? I've read both but if I am only going to get 10 years out of them it may not be worth it. I just need a battery to keep the fridge running in between generator charges.
Click to expand...
DIYrich said:
Or, just get a lead acid battery and keep it on a battery maintainer.

For a few times a year, lead acid is cheap.
Click to expand...
justinm001 said:
But lead acid doesn't last that long, no matter how well you take care of them. LFP batteries should last decades
Click to expand...

AGM lead-acid is simple. Not cheap, costs as much as LiFePO4.
It will run fridge between generator charges.

Before leaving unused for months, fully charge and disconnect from all loads.
AGM self-discharge is very slow, and can take extreme cold when stored at full charge.

Cycle life and float life varies with cost.
I've got SunXtender, which spec 700 cycles to 70% DoD and 10 year float life, for my grid-backup system.

I bought some 104 Ah 12V SunXtender 15 years ago, occasionally charged but didn't try using until they were 11 years old. They tested 40% capacity. I used the for testing inverter/chargers without heavy load.

I think AGM is ideal for use several times a year in a camper.
But not ideal for generator charge, because after bulk they should get an absorption charge of a couple hours. PV panels are better for that (with no load unless enough PV to supply load too.) That full absorption charge should be done before leaving for an extended time.

Is your fridge propane with AC option? Or 12V or 120V compressor fridge? I propane, either power with propane or replace with compressor type.

LiFePO4 is better with generator and no source for slow absorption because it can take 0.5C and doesn't need to reach 100% SoC.
 
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