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24x24 hobby shop should I pull power or go solar

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Mongotx

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Joined
Jul 16, 2023
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Texas
I have a hobby shop that is about 24x24 to have power installed it's going to be around 8k. I have thought about just going off-grid with solar. I have seen 3000-watt kits for about the same price. Not sure if that will be enough power.

Here are the things I would like to run.
1. AC Looking at a mini split 2400btu
2. hand tools and saws
3. welder on occasion

looking for pros and cons.

Thank you for your input.
 
Mongotx said:
Here are the things I would like to run.
1. AC Looking at a mini split 2400btu
2. hand tools and saws
3. welder on occasion
Click to expand...
You really need to do an energy audit to properly size your solar system. There is a link to a tool in my signature. There are many others too.
 
with $8,000 to spend you should be able to set up an off grid solar system that could run your whole house , let alone a little work shop ..... so long as you're electrically savvy and willing to do the work yourself that is
 
Do an energy audit so you know what to buy.
AC running along with the Saw and a microwave oven might be a cutting it close.
 
Mongotx said:
I have a hobby shop that is about 24x24 to have power installed it's going to be around 8k. I have thought about just going off-grid with solar. I have seen 3000-watt kits for about the same price. Not sure if that will be enough power.

Here are the things I would like to run.
1. AC Looking at a mini split 2400btu
2. hand tools and saws
3. welder on occasion

looking for pros and cons.

Thank you for your input.
Click to expand...
A 3000W kit would produce about 12kWh a day on a sunny day in summer, plenty to run everything you want and if your hobby shop is insulated you could easily cool to 20C. You would want a battery that is about the same capacity, 12kWh and an inverter that is able to handle the tools, as many can't deal with the inrush current.

Easy to achieve that with 8k add a generator for cloudy days when you want to top up your batteries and you will even have spare money for fuel.
 
Thank you all for the input. I have been reading a lot and trying to put together a system.

I am trying to reverse-engineer this based on how many panels I can get on my roof. From my calculation, I can put 18 qty 455W panels if I use 6 of them for the EG4 Hybrid solar mini-split 2400 Btu then that leaves me with 12 panels or 5,460 watts.

Any guidance on batteries and inverters? I would like a 120/240 inverter.

Thank you again for all your help!
 
Mongotx said:
Thank you all for the input. I have been reading a lot and trying to put together a system.

I am trying to reverse-engineer this based on how many panels I can get on my roof. From my calculation, I can put 18 qty 455W panels if I use 6 of them for the EG4 Hybrid solar mini-split 2400 Btu then that leaves me with 12 panels or 5,460 watts.

Any guidance on batteries and inverters? I would like a 120/240 inverter.

Thank you again for all your help!
Click to expand...

There are lots of types of battery, but really you there have 4 good options

Lithium: (newer technology)

Prebuilt LiFePo4 (good life span, very very expensive upfront purchase but simple and easy to use/install)

DIY LiFePo4, eve cells etc.. (good life span, still high upfront costs, best long term valve for money, more complicated to build and install)

Lead acids: (older technology)

Sealed lead acid gel/AGM , (much MUCH cheaper upfront cost especially second hand, shorter lifespan than lithiums, sealed maintenance free... AGM batteries are the clear choice if batteries must be exposed to cold weather as unlike lithiums can function well below freezing)

Flooded lead acid , folklift truck packs, camping trailer habitations batteries (good long lifespan if properly cared for, same price point as gel/AGM, requires regular maintenance, checks and monthly equalisation charge, can only safely be discharged to 50% capacity)






My choice at the moment is sealed lead acid AGM/gel. Simply because of the MUCH cheaper upfront costs and 0 maintenance. Lithiums are cool but so expensive to get into and I always worry you're one faulty BMS away from sitting in the dark
 
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I would not dedicate panels for the mini-split... and you might be ok with an 12-18kbtu unit. Over sizing wastes a lot of energy. If you want to use a welder you should be looking at least at 6kW inverters, and the 12kW might be better value. With 8kW of PV, a well optimized system would usually have 20-30kWh of battery. Price for that would be at least $12k, and produce about 40kWh in the summer and 25kWh in the winter depending on location.
 
Look at what time of day that you will be using the shop.

Look at what time of day the sun is shining on it.

Try to put panels on the shop so that it is generating power the entire time that you are working vs just one particular time of day.
 
My question is why is it so expensive to run power to this shop building? If it is wiring up the insides of the shop you will still be spending this even if you use solar. To achieve all that you mention needing powered you are likely looking at a $10-15K solar setup.
 
Mongotx said:
I have a hobby shop that is about 24x24 to have power installed it's going to be around 8k. I have thought about just going off-grid with solar. I have seen 3000-watt kits for about the same price. Not sure if that will be enough power.

Here are the things I would like to run.
1. AC Looking at a mini split 2400btu
2. hand tools and saws
3. welder on occasion

looking for pros and cons.

Thank you for your input.
Click to expand...
If your Hobby shop is on your property, It shouldn’t cost anywhere near 8k if you already have grid power at your house.
 
SamG340 said:
I could do it for £5,000 easy
Click to expand...
5 x 1.3 exchange rate = $6500 You must have inexpensive solar prices in the UK.

When people price out solar they sometimes only look at the components like panels, and inverters and forget all the other things like mounting, wires, connectors, and installation if not DIY. You can spend a bundle on all those little things.
 
Mattb4 said:
5 x 1.3 exchange rate = $6500 You must have inexpensive solar prices in the UK.

When people price out solar they sometimes only look at the components like panels, and inverters and forget all the other things like mounting, wires, connectors, and installation if not DIY. You can spend a bundle on all those little things.
Click to expand...

I don't think solar is particularly cheaper on the UK?

That's £5k is with brand new parts (not victron obviously lol), could probably do it cheaper second hand, ex solar farm panels etc.

You could spend £15k on a all singing all dancing system , but you don't have to

if you want to do it on cheap you have to put the leg work in, shop around for the best prices , wait to find the right items cheap on from eBay. You can probably get the lumber to mount the panels cheap/free if you ask around


The experts here out strip my electrical knowledge 10 fold .....but I'm a tight fisted Yorkshireman , if theres one thing I do know it's how to get stuff done on the cheap!
 
You know I'm 99% sure a £15k system will be better, more efficient and last longer than one thrown together for <£5k , no doubt about it


But what I'm trying to say is there's more than one way to skin a cat
 
This is a shop, with typical huge tool/ac/welder power draws ... you'll want a grid connection (already a grid conn at the house?). If there is some reason why you can't easily bring a grid conn in, then just plan on an automatic propane generator to supplement both solar and occasional huge loads.

You can still do solar with a grid conn, in a parallel fashion ... just determine what can be best run by solar, and wire those circuits to a standard solar configuration.

In this fashion, solar/generator will back up the grid (when it goes down), and the grid will be there to cushion the huge loads.

Hope this helps ...
 
SamG340 said:
...

if you want to do it on cheap you have to put the leg work in, shop around for the best prices , wait to find the right items cheap on from eBay. You can probably get the lumber to mount the panels cheap/free if you ask around


The experts here out strip my electrical knowledge 10 fold .....but I'm a tight fisted Yorkshireman , if theres one thing I do know it's how to get stuff done on the cheap!
Click to expand...
I agree that savings can be had when you DIY. They also can be realized if you have a lifetime of DIY and all the tools and experience. However in a earlier incarnation I did contractor work where I had to estimate and bid jobs. That experience taught me that you can go broke by not looking at the entire picture.
 
Nobodybusiness said:
Why can’t you pull it from house?
You shouldn’t need that much amperage?
Click to expand...
Op mentioned running a welder on occassion.
No mention of what said welder consumes but welders don’t typically sip energy.


Consider if your wife is cooking tonight’s dinner in the oven, while the dryer is running, and then turns on the microwave, while your daughter starts up blow dryer, and then your son decides to fire up his bitcoin mining operation.
You might have a bit of a problem pulling from the house. ?

I’d say go off grid if you can, I despise having to have an open checkbook for whatever the utility gets approved for a rate hike each year.
And it can be done in stages if need be.

Btw trenchers can be rented for a few hundred a day, depending on size and your geo area.
Just be sure you know whats under you and where.
In CA we have call 811 for that. Whatever utilities are there (like water power gas phone tv internet) they will send a guy out usually within a couple of days and they mark the area out where their utility runs underground, if at all.

And hopefully you don’t have boulders underground in the trenching area.
 
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Rocksnsalt said:
Op mentioned running a welder on occassion.
No mention of what said welder consumes but welders don’t typically sip energy.


Consider if your wife is cooking tonight’s dinner in the oven, while the dryer is running, and then turns on the microwave, while your daughter starts up blow dryer, and then your son decides to fire up his bitcoin mining operation.
You might have a bit of a problem pulling from the house. ?

I’d say go off grid if you can, I despise having to have an open checkbook for whatever the utility gets approved for a rate hike each year.
And it can be done in stages if need be.

Btw trenchers can be rented for a few hundred a day, depending on size and your geo area.
Just be sure you know whats under you and where.
In CA we have call 811 for that.

And hopefully you don’t have boulders underground in the trenching area.
Click to expand...
He has grid at the house.

He could run a sub out their for less than the $8k the contractor was asking or.
 
I love how some know everybodys business. Like what things cost at other peoples locations, houses, layouts, distance, permitting entities, and utility co requirements.
It’s amazing. ?

And then he can be a slave to the utility company vs freedom from them.
 
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Rocksnsalt said:
I love how some know everybodys business. Like what things cost at other peoples locations, houses, layouts, distance, permitting entities, and utility co requirements.
It’s amazing. ?

And then he can be a slave to the utility company vs freedom from them.
Click to expand...
Be a smart ass if you like but I have been doing this a long time as well as others in the forum who have advised him similarly.

Doesn’t cost 8k to run 4/0 cable to another building a few feet or 800 feet away.

He’s going to be a slave to the utility regardless because he is only talking about adding solar to an outbuilding.
He still has to pay for power at the house.

Would cost a considerable amount more to take entire property off grid.
 
Nobodybusiness said:
Be a smart ass if you like but I have been doing this a long time as well as others in the forum who have advised him similarly.

Doesn’t cost 8k to run 4/0 cable to another building a few feet or 800 feet away.
Click to expand...
In fairness, laying 4/0 USE on the ground is about $10/ft. If you don't own (or are able to borrow for free) a trencher that will add to cost.

But I completely agree that under 800' or so it is impossible to make an off-grid setup cost competitive when you throw in things like welding. You might be able to do a hybrid system with #1 USE and an inverter and battery on the far end to handle surges, but it would still cost more.
 
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