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using a gun safe for battery

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NwCali

Solar Enthusiast
Joined
Apr 27, 2021
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Just bought 32 305ah batteries.

Looking at buying this to put them in: https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/winchester-gun-safe-26-gun-ts26-45

Pretty sure I could fit 16 more in it with no problems.

I'm looking at it from 2 different angles. Its "fire" rated. While it might not contain (but it also might) it I'm sure given proper notification (fire alarm) you should have plenty of notice to vacate.

I would also find it hard for someone to move a 600# safe (most likely bolted down) easily.

Has anyone else used a safe like this before? I once helped in a river clean up where we hauled one out, so I know they are made of thin metal, drilling access for cables should be easy enough.
 
Being a "gun nut" I can tell you not all "safes" are made equal. What you talk about in your river story sounds like a "cabinet". What you are looking at is a "safe".

If you plan on drilling holes in it for some reason you might have your work set out for you. Some are filled with concrete as well. Some also have a small hole in them for a dehumidifier rod. Many are "fire resistant" but most people in the gun community don't trust a gun that was in one that went through a fire. It might not burn but it will get hot enough to raise question on the metal the gun is made of. And "plastic" guns have been known to melt.

I have a feeling if something went on fire in there it would be fairly contained, but it would get darn hot. If it has a hole for a rod not sure how well it will do with heat from the batteries. I am a noob with the solar stuff so I don't really know if that is a big deal.

It is not a bad idea, personally I like the all mechanical locks, I don't care for batteries in locks.
 
Only downside I see is potential heat buildup.
If your main concern is fire containment, you can build a cabinet and put as many layers of drywall on all sides as you want.
It would be much cheaper.
I built a cabinet for ammo storage that has 1-3/4" drywall sides. Pretty sure that would withstand most fires, until the cavalry arrives.
 
I would think it is unnecessary. Why do you need a fireproof safe? Are you using cobalt based lithium-ion chemistries?

If you are using LiFePO4 or LTO, fire is not an issue. Unless you put the cells into an actual fire, then it will burn like wood. These chemistries do not have a self-propagating thermal runaway effect like the cobalt based chemistries. The temperatures created can't even catch a piece of paper on fire.
 
I'm not sure I would want lifepo4 batteries inside of a safe that could turn it into a huge "pipe bomb" when pressures skyrocket inside if there was battery fire.
 
Will Prowse said:
I would think it is unnecessary. Why do you need a fireproof safe? Are you using cobalt based lithium-ion chemistries?

If you are using LiFePO4 or LTO, fire is not an issue. Unless you put the cells into an actual fire, then it will burn like wood. These chemistries do not have a self-propagating thermal runaway effect like the cobalt based chemistries. The temperatures created can't even catch a piece of paper on fire.
Click to expand...

Its a combination of the two... fire and security...

Where I live if your car is stolen it'll be driven to the next area and driven. Unless you're lucky it won't be returned. I'm not from here but people know if you come onto my property I know and I am armed. Things of "value" are best kept secured though. I just spent a week helping someone recover their beater of a car, and they are native...

It also doesn't help that Home insurance here is difficult to get. Not that my home is high risk of fire, but 5 miles East of me is. Its also old growth redwood thru and thru, built by a former Redwood Mill manager using the best cuts. So even if I could insure it and it burnt rebuilding it would be problematic to say the least.

I figured someone had used one before, $600 (link) for a 45 minute rated (fire) safe seems like good preventive measure imo. For most folks that is a few months of home insurance spent? (been a long while since I had that)
 
NwCali said:
Its a combination of the two... fire and security...

Where I live if your car is stolen it'll be driven to the next area and driven. Unless you're lucky it won't be returned. I'm not from here but people know if you come onto my property I know and I am armed. Things of "value" are best kept secured though. I just spent a week helping someone recover their beater of a car, and they are native...

It also doesn't help that Home insurance here is difficult to get. Not that my home is high risk of fire, but 5 miles East of me is. Its also old growth redwood thru and thru, built by a former Redwood Mill manager using the best cuts. So even if I could insure it and it burnt rebuilding it would be problematic to say the least.

I figured someone had used one before, $600 (link) for a 45 minute rated (fire) safe seems like good preventive measure imo. For most folks that is a few months of home insurance spent? (been a long while since I had that)
Click to expand...
Do you put everything as flammable as wood in a fire safe container? Your house is more flammable than the batteries. I just fail to understand the logic here
 
fpgt72 said:
it does not work that way.
Click to expand...

Please explain why you don't think high pressures (from combustion) in a non-expanding space would not result in bad things. Do you think that Tractor Supply safe is air tight? But whatever.
 
I had a similar safe. 3/16” or so front. Sheet metal sides. Could go through the sides with an axe.

Fire rating comes from sheet rock lining.

Knowing that, a custom gypsum box, maybe with a corrugated outer layer would do as well. And allow you to customize for your battery bank. The fire rating for an 1” thick fire guard sheetrock is pretty good.

Save you a ton of money.
 
NwCali said:
Just bought 32 305ah batteries.

Looking at buying this to put them in
Click to expand...
Those are LFP batteeries, so what risk are you trying to mitigate? LFP has very little risk of fire. The risk is bad connections and short circuits, so spend your money on over current protection. Your batteries may need temperature protection from heat or cold more than being enclose in a metal box with no ventilation.
 
Ampster said:
Because LFP batteries are not likely to combust. The worse that could happen is they get overcharged and swell.
Click to expand...

Will has a few videos that show more than swelling is if something goes wrong internally. And there are plenty of videos of battery fires. Just my opinion that is is a foolish idea. But I also think it's foolish for putting them in a safe for any reason. However, people are free to do whatever they want. Also plenty of videos of saves being blown up from the inside with relatively small amounts of materials. It's all about pressure rise with no means of release.
 
Texas-Mark said:
And there are plenty of videos of battery fires.
Click to expand...
Details are important and chemistry matters. There are also plenty of videos of people trying to set LFP on fire with no luck. Lipo and other Lithium chemistries with Cobalt are volitile and when overheated can provide their own oxygen for combustion. That means a fireproof safe will not smother flames, but that is moot in this situation. I think we are on the same page.
My comments are for the benefit of other readers who don't know the difference in fire potential for various Lithium chemistries. The first step in risk management is understanding the risk.
 
Considering the price of just a box is around $300 w/o a BMS, $600 with: CNEEL ELL
I'll be looking into this myself, maybe just a Gun Locker. I like the enclosed with a door and keyed lock option. Lockers are easier to drill through also and cheaper.

Future plans of 48 cell 280ah build.
 
I have a Winchester gun safe. It may be slightly smaller than the model that this thread is about. Mine did come from Tractor Supply but that's not really relevant. The safe is definitely not air tight. There is at least one opening on the back of the safe to bring power into the safe for a heater/dehumidifier and/or light.

My only concern with putting LiFePO4 cells in a safe like this would be venting of heat. I have eight 280 Ah LiFePO4 cells in a compartment in my RV. I added a couple of computer fans and a thermostat to provide some air flow out of the compartment.
 
I think that this is a waste of time and money.
If your house is on fire. It would probably still heat up the batteries inside the safe. Enough to cause them damage. Unless you also add some sort of cooling. That won't be destroyed by the fire.
 
Although is not necessary for firehazard issues, i think is a good idea to keep you batteries from being stolen. If i was worried about human elements breaking into my house to steal i would probably do something similar
 
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