12V / 3000W All In One Inverter?

[Rocksnsalt]

I cannot seem to find a 12V / 3000W ALL IN ONE inverter anywhere.
Why is that?
24v or 48v sure Growatt and MP but no 12v?
And are those ok for RV use?
This would be for my Sprinter van.
If you know of any please let me know.
Thanks

 

[Ampster]

Why is that?

My guess is that there is little demand. The cost of the components does not scale down from the high volume 48 volt 3000 Watt All In Ones that are entry level specs at reasonable prices.

 

[SparkyJJO]

3000W at 12V is crazy high amperage and not recommended.

 

[BentleyJ]

3000 Watt Pure Sine Inverter Charger 12V

3000 Watt Pure Sine Inverter Charger

www.aimscorp.net

 

[Rocksnsalt]

My guess is that there is little demand. The cost of the components does not scale down from the high volume 48 volt 3000 Watt All In Ones that are entry level specs at reasonable prices.

Appreciate the response.
Well, there are a lot of vans and RV’s being built out with 5kwh, 10kwh and even 20kwh systems.
But I get the point vs stationary off grid systems

 

[Rocksnsalt]

3000 Watt Pure Sine Inverter Charger 12V

3000 Watt Pure Sine Inverter Charger

www.aimscorp.net

Appreciate the response.
Is that really an “all in one”?
It’s an inverter with a charger.
Isn’t there a bit more to an all in one than that?

 

[Rocksnsalt]

So I’m going to have to go 24 or 48V and step it down?
My whole point of wanting an all in one is simplicity.
But hey if it’s not available, too dangerous, or it just doesn’t work it doesn’t work.
I suppose it just is what it is.
Sigh…

 

[Ampster]

Well, there are a lot of vans and RV’s being built out with 5kwh, 10kwh and even 20kwh systems.

KWh is a measure of battery capacity. The question was about a 12 volt 3000Watt inverter and it was answered by several posters about the Amperage of 12 volts at 3000Watts, but my sense is the volume of demand for All In Ones of that kW capacity are typically higher volttage for the reasons already discussed.

 

[Ampster]

So I’m going to have to go 24 or 48V and step it down?

Yes that is a lot simpler and less expensive than the alternative.

 

[BentleyJ]

Is that really an “all in one”?
It’s an inverter with a charger.
Isn’t there a bit more to an all in one than that?

All-In-One would typically have 1 or 2 built in MPPT Charge controllers. However, even if that product existed the solar input ratings may or may not be compatible with your set up. The Aims unit checks off a couple of boxes on your wish list. Purchasing a separate SCC to charge your 12V batteries is not really adding much additional complexity. There are many choices for solar charge controllers having a variety of input/output configurations.

 

[Rednecktek]

Or you do like I'm doing for my camp and go 24v and get a 24v -> 12v step down converter to feed the 12v stuff.

I wish there was a 12v option for a 1500w or so unit,

 

[Rocksnsalt]

Or you do like I'm doing for my camp and go 24v and get a 24v -> 12v step down converter to feed the 12v stuff.

I wish there was a 12v option for a 1500w or so unit,

Yes I am considering 24v or 48v and step down to 12.
Seems like an unnecessary pita. But I understand the high amp concern
With hundreds of thousands of RV’s out there (if not millions), it seems odd a variety of 12v all in one -plug ‘n play- inverter systems are not available.

 

[chrisski]

I really recommend going with a higher votlage than 12 volts for a 3000 watt inverter. In my signature block is a link with more details on the why (batteries and inverters).

-If you’re using 2000 watts I recomend 24 volts
-If you’re using 3000 watts I recommend 48 volts.
-If you’ve got brief excursions to 3000 watts for perhaps a couple minutes at a time, five or six times a day, 24 volts may be OK if built right.
-If you constantly run at 1000 watts, but the 3000 watts is for surge, 24 votls could be ok also.

I have a 3000 watt inverter on a 24 volt system. I can run that at 1700 watts to 2000 watts for hours. The step down converter does not use a lot of enrergy for the 12 volt side. Also, the 24 side has plenty of accessories available: lights and USB chargers and refrigerators; once yo get to 48 volts that becomes hard to find.

Victron is much smarter than me and has a 12 volt inverter / charger at 3000 watts. I think this is a terrible idea, but I am not an EE, I assume that this VIctron device has some accepted certification.

EDIT: I do like the idea if adding SCCs as needed to charge the batteries, so am not a fan of AIOs because of that, but boy do I like the idea that the AIOs I’ve looked at are more affordable than buying components separately.

 

[SparkyJJO]

Yes I am considering 24v or 48v and step down to 12.
Seems like an unnecessary pita. But I understand the high amp concern
With hundreds of thousands of RV’s out there (if not millions), it seems odd a variety of 12v all in one -plug ‘n play- inverter systems are not available.

It is because of the high amp issue. All that thick wire is expensive and very heavy.

 

[Rocksnsalt]

It is because of the high amp issue. All that thick wire is expensive and very heavy.

Like stated earlier, I understand the high amp issue. That said, is wire and weight really going to be such a big deal to be prohibitive in an all in one inverter?
So what if it adds a few lbs and $20 to the cost of production. A few lbs extra weight and $20 or even $40 in extra production cost (doubtful) seems like a non issue.
But I suppose it all comes down to the amperage issue. I say let Darwin do his thing.

 

[Rocksnsalt]

I really recommend going with a higher votlage than 12 volts for a 3000 watt inverter. In my signature block is a link with more details on the why (batteries and inverters).

-If you’re using 2000 watts I recomend 24 volts
-If you’re using 3000 watts I recommend 48 volts.
-If you’ve got brief excursions to 3000 watts for perhaps a couple minutes at a time, five or six times a day, 24 volts may be OK if built right.
-If you constantly run at 1000 watts, but the 3000 watts is for surge, 24 votls could be ok also.

I have a 3000 watt inverter on a 24 volt system. I can run that at 1700 watts to 2000 watts for hours. The step down converter does not use a lot of enrergy for the 12 volt side. Also, the 24 side has plenty of accessories available: lights and USB chargers and refrigerators; once yo get to 48 volts that becomes hard to find.

Victron is much smarter than me and has a 12 volt inverter / charger at 3000 watts. I think this is a terrible idea, but I am not an EE, I assume that this VIctron device has some accepted certification.

EDIT: I do like the idea if adding SCCs as needed to charge the batteries, so am not a fan of AIOs because of that, but boy do I like the idea that the AIOs I’ve looked at are more affordable than buying components separately.

Thanks, this is by far the best response so far. ????

 

[squowse]

Yes I am considering 24v or 48v and step down to 12.
Seems like an unnecessary pita. But I understand the high amp concern
With hundreds of thousands of RV’s out there (if not millions), it seems odd a variety of 12v all in one -plug ‘n play- inverter systems are not available.

I was exactly like you because I am used to having 12V appliances, but a 48V (or 24V) step down ia so cheap and easy. Over 2000W 12V currents get so high everything becomes a PITA.

 

[Rocksnsalt]

I was exactly like you because I am used to having 12V appliances, but a 48V (or 24V) step down ia so cheap and easy. Over 2000W 12V currents get so high everything becomes a PITA.

Though my energy use will not be regular (other than a fridge and fan), there will be times where I want to run AC for hrs, an induction cooktop (600-1600w) for 5 to 20 minutes concurrently as well as various low watt draws such as laptop etc. Since I don’t have a specific ac unit selected yet, I don’t know the specific power requirements.
But I do know I’d rather have a cushion in available energy vs a shortfall. I’ve thought about having 2 separate 2000w inverters, with one dedicated to the ac only, but that’s counter to my primary energy system goals of simplicity and space efficiency.

 

[chrisski]

In my RV the 12 volt side only uses a couple of amps. The two exceptions to that is when the propane heater is running, the blower motor is 10 amps. The other exception is the leveling jacks can pull up to 50 amps, usually less. The blower motor can run up 120 watt all night and the leveling jacks for no more than a minute at a time at 600 watts, perhaps five minutes to set up, and then tear down.


I use this 24 volt to 12 volt 70 amp converter and have no issues running that stuff:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01BF5BQLA/

Without the leveling jacks, don't really need 70 amps. I did not find a good branded converter to go from 48 volts to 12 volts.

The 24 volt system runs the AC at 75 amps on a 24 volt system for up to 6 hours a day. The same on a 12 volt system would be 150 amps. Amperages like 150 amps besides just wires, connections and crimps become a lot more important. I try to limit my constant amp draw to 100 amps or less with the intent of up to 2000 watts for 6 hours constant.

There's quite a few who've got the 3000 watt 12 volt Victron multiplus. I'd like to hear how this has worked for them and if they are using their multiplus for 6 hours at a time for a 2000 watt draw.

 

[DIYVan]

Funny, I've been on the hunt as well. I have a rooftop AC that's 12v, so trying to stick to 12v and not add more components, as I've been struggling to cleanly map out all the specific components, and an AIO seems like a much cleaner solution.



MPP Solar advertises this, I haven't found any place to buy it though. Seems to check all the boxes, except being 2kW instead of 3kW. Transformer based so heavy.

PV30-2KW LVHM Low Frequency Solar Inverter (12/24VDC/2KW) – MPPSolar Hybrid Solar Inverters, Solar Charge Controllers

I found this on AliExpress from OAE. 3000w inverter charger w/ MPPT, but it's 230v and it's transformer (I've been looking for FET based for the weight savings). I think the shipping is misquoted, fwiw, they also sell the same box on Amazon for $598 but w/o the MPPT section (https://smile.amazon.com/AMPINVT-Inverter-Converter-Adjustable-Frequency/dp/B07QYF8THG).

598.5US $ |3000w 12v/24v/48v Solar Inverter 2020 Best Selling Products Low Frequency Pure Sine Wave Inverters - Tool Parts - AliExpress

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

www.aliexpress.com

There's also this one from Jesudom which does 110v, PWM solar input, but is only 2000w, and also transformer.

538.79US $ 17% OFF|2000w Hybrid Inverter Toroidal Solar Inverter 12v 24v 110v/220vac Pure Sine Wave Inverter Pwm 60a Solar Charge Controller - Inverters & Converters - AliExpress

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

www.aliexpress.com

One more from Shinenovo, seems to be FETs (4.8 kg), 2000w and supports 400w MPPT input, but only supports lead acid (13.8v charging).

524.4US $ 5% OFF|12V 24V 48V inverter 2000w High Frequency Pure Sine Wave Inverter Solar Charger Controller Inverter|Solar Inverters| - AliExpress

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

www.aliexpress.com

Let me know if you find any and we can compare notes.