Adding EG4 To Victron/BB - Will this work!?

[DrZ123]

So I just purchased an off-grid home that is a summer home. It has a really nice current solar powered system, which I plan on upgrading. Want to be able to add a W/D, Air conditioning, and more lights and 120v outlets in the house. Here is the current system and my upgrade plans. Please advise on the changes I propose in green. Thanks!

Current:
Victron Quattro 48 volt | 5000 watt | 70 amp inverter
Victron Isolated DC/DC converter Orion-TR 48 | 12-30 (for 12v DC in home)
Victron SmartSolar charge controller MPPT 250 | 100 - Tr VE.Can
Victron Venus GX communication center
Victron SmartShunt

20 panels x 100 watts/panel) ~2 kW
16x 12v Battleborn lithium batteries x 100Ah) ~ 19.2 kWh 4s4p
The system is built on a 48v configuration and it provides a mix of 120v and 12v

To Add:
Second Victron Quattro 5000w for split phase
Victron autotransformer (is this needed?)
4 EG4 Lifepower4 48v 100ah batteries (already have)
EG4 server rack
Additional solar panels?

 

[Adam De Lay]

The autotransformer shouldn't be needed.

You'll want to connect the EG4 battery bank to the same bus bars that you have your BB batteries connected to so that the smart shunt can properly calculate the amp hours flowing.

You'll want to look at the current voltage/amperage of your existing panels to see if you have room for additional panels or if you need to purchase another solar charge controller as well for the new panels.

 

[DrZ123]

The autotransformer shouldn't be needed.

You'll want to connect the EG4 battery bank to the same bus bars that you have your BB batteries connected to so that the smart shunt can properly calculate the amp hours flowing.

You'll want to look at the current voltage/amperage of your existing panels to see if you have room for additional panels or if you need to purchase another solar charge controller as well for the new panels.

So I can just wire them to the same bars, ok! It was recommended to me at one point to get the Victron Lynx distributors, are those needed or are the current busbars sufficient? Also are the individual fuses at the battery level needed?

 

[Adam De Lay]

So I can just wire them to the same bars, ok! It was recommended to me at one point to get the Victron Lynx distributors, are those needed or are the current busbars sufficient? Also are the individual fuses at the battery level needed?

Is there an amp rating on the current bus bars? Adding another inverter will basically double the amp capacity requirements you currently have.

The Lynx distributors are nice in that they do simplify your wiring. If you don't care about the indicator lights on the distributor, you could do the same things on the Lynx Power In by adding a few bolts, then you could add your own fuses and probably save a few bucks. Either way, you would need 1 for your current battery bank and you would need another one for your new battery bank (each Lynx Distributor/Power In can take up to 4 connections).

Its always smart to have some kind of over current protection on your batteries. Better safe than sorry.

 

[DrZ123]

Is there an amp rating on the current bus bars? Adding another inverter will basically double the amp capacity requirements you currently have.

The Lynx distributors are nice in that they do simplify your wiring. If you don't care about the indicator lights on the distributor, you could do the same things on the Lynx Power In by adding a few bolts, then you could add your own fuses and probably save a few bucks. Either way, you would need 1 for your current battery bank and you would need another one for your new battery bank (each Lynx Distributor/Power In can take up to 4 connections).

Its always smart to have some kind of over current protection on your batteries. Better safe than sorry.

Ok so I will add battery fuses. The EG4 batteries have built in breakers so don't need fuses I am assuming?

If the current busbars are rate, seems logical to just keep what I have there and use it.

Do the cables for the EG4 batteries need to be exactly the same length as the current BB cables?

 

[Adam De Lay]

Ok so I will add battery fuses. The EG4 batteries have built in breakers so don't need fuses I am assuming?

I have seen most people add a single class-t fuse to the positive cable coming off the server rack.

Do the cables for the EG4 batteries need to be exactly the same length as the current BB cables?

Yeah I believe you would want to keep them as close as possible to draw from each bank equally.

 

[DrZ123]

Is the EG4 lifepower communication hub essential?

Also, can the single charge controller and Victron shunt work on both battery banks?

 

[Adam De Lay]

Is the EG4 lifepower communication hub essential?

No it's not required. Typically it's used for allowing your inverters to communicate directly with the batteries. Since you already have other types of batteries, you can run without it.

Also, can the single charge controller and Victron shunt work on both battery banks?

Yes. As long as you have all your batteries connected to the same bus bar your charge controller will supply the power to all the batteries. As far as the shunt, you just need all your batteries on the "battery" side of the shunt and all your loads on the "load" side of the shunt (I've made the mistake of not doing this in the past..).

 

[DrZ123]

So if I put the + to the + busbar and the - to the shunt, I should be ok. Going to have to figure out how to wire the - as I don't know if I can fit another cable on the lug of the shunt

 

[Adam De Lay]

So if I put the + to the + busbar and the - to the shunt, I should be ok. Going to have to figure out how to wire the - as I don't know if I can fit another cable on the lug of the shunt

Yep.

You're probably gonna want to get another bus bar which holds your battery connections.
Battery bus bar -> 4/0 cable -> shunt -> 4/0 cable -> load bus bar

Depending on the bus bar you might be able to bolt the shunt directly to it and avoid having to have multiple 4/0 cables.

 

[DrZ123]

The copper busbars used in the setup are 10"x4"x0.25" by CPI. Seems pretty solid and doing calculations should be rated for 775 amps I believe?

 

[Adam De Lay]

The couple I looked show just under 2000 amps, but they don't calculate in temperature.

 

[HRTKD]

I noticed that you're adding a battery balancer to the Battleborn bank. Is this because you've observed the 12 volt batteries are out of balance? If so, how much are they out of balance.

 

[Adam De Lay]

I noticed that you're adding a battery balancer to the Battleborn bank. Is this because you've observed the 12 volt batteries are out of balance? If so, how much are they out of balance.

Good catch. I had thought that was just a shrunk version of the EG4 battery image.

 

[DrZ123]

I noticed that you're adding a battery balancer to the Battleborn bank. Is this because you've observed the 12 volt batteries are out of balance? If so, how much are they out of balance.

In one of the other posts folks recommended using battery balancers to keep the BBs balanced. I haven't tested them yet for voltage to see.

I already bought the balancers so hopefully they are necessary!

 

[HRTKD]

In one of the other posts folks recommended using battery balancers to keep the BBs balanced. I haven't tested them yet for voltage to see.

I already bought the balancers so hopefully they are necessary!

12 volt batteries in series can certainly become unbalanced. When the first battery in the series hits 100% state of charge, that cuts off charge to the rest of the batteries in that series.

I think going with a 48 volt battery in your new battery bank is a good way to go. Before installing the balancer, you may find it helpful to check the state of charge of each 12 volt battery in each series. It isn't clear from the pictures if the cables to each series are exactly the same length. If they aren't then you can certainly get the four series out of balance to each other.

 

[DrZ123]

All of the cables are the exact same length. The previous owner went with the 12 volt battleborns in series because he wanted to build the system himself and it's somewhat inaccessible to get bigger batteries up there.

I decided to go with the server rack batteries to upgrade the system because I don't have to worry about balance issues and I figure I only have to bring them up there once, also it's a much better price point.

 

[HRTKD]

Battleborn batteries could likely get a good price on the used market. Maybe sell them and replace them with another set of server rack batteries?

 

[DrZ123]

Battleborn batteries could likely get a good price on the used market. Maybe sell them and replace them with another set of server rack batteries?

Have considered that. For now I'd rather not dismantle a nicely working system. Just want to add to it for more capabilities

 

[JRH]

So I just purchased an off-grid home that is a summer home. It has a really nice current solar powered system, which I plan on upgrading. Want to be able to add a W/D, Air conditioning, and more lights and 120v outlets in the house. Here is the current system and my upgrade plans. Please advise on the changes I propose in green. Thanks!

Current:
Victron Quattro 48 volt | 5000 watt | 70 amp inverter
Victron Isolated DC/DC converter Orion-TR 48 | 12-30 (for 12v DC in home)
Victron SmartSolar charge controller MPPT 250 | 100 - Tr VE.Can
Victron Venus GX communication center
Victron SmartShunt

20 panels x 100 watts/panel) ~2 kW
16x 12v Battleborn lithium batteries x 100Ah) ~ 19.2 kWh 4s4p
The system is built on a 48v configuration and it provides a mix of 120v and 12v

To Add:
Second Victron Quattro 5000w for split phase
Victron autotransformer (is this needed?)
4 EG4 Lifepower4 48v 100ah batteries (already have)
EG4 server rack
Additional solar panels?

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That is one impressive system ya got…Damn….?.. I envy ya…but I would be cautious adding the batts …. The Victron and Battle Born may gang up late one night and eat the EG’s….it’s the way of nature ..the law of the jungle… be careful guy.
J.