All-in-One vs component for essentially same price

[Gilligan]

Would anyone recommend an all-in-one vs the component version if the price was essentially the same?

I'm looking at a 24v 2.4kw 110v system and it comes out to around $700 bucks.

I can buy a 2000 Watt inverter (Giandel) for $290, a EPever solar charger 60 amp for $280 (could even get a 40 or 50 amp for even cheaper), and a Moes ATS for $96.

Yes there are a few other odds and ends and technically it's not quite AS big as the All-in-One but if I want to upgrade I can upgrade a piece at a time as well as if something goes wrong I have to only replace that component. Plus I've read a few of you guys having oddities in programming some of the features and I don't think I'd have as many issues with a component system as the ATS will do EXACTLY how I want it (I don't want to charge off the grid, only to use the grid when the battery is too low).

Am I missing something? I know if I needed a 220v system then the All-in-One would be a no brainer as they are like half the price as the 110v version.

Gilligan

 

[BobG]

For me the AIO is a no brainer because of space constraints. I'm in a small popup trailer and every cubic inch is precious. If it were otherwise, I'd have to look into it.

 

[Craig]

It depends. Really the only reason I don't use an all in one is that I don't like the idea of one part dying and then nothing works. With a component setup you can replace components as necessary. I do like the AIO though for simplicity sake. There are a few drawbacks to some of the AIO as well such as needing a common port BMS in most cases, which in itself isn't an issue but high current needs through a common port could become an issue

 

[Dzl]

There is something to be said for the simplicity of an AIO, especially if all the little decisions and technical details of the DIY route stress you out. But I agree with Craig,

It depends.

Personally, I don't like the idea that with an all-in-one, I would be settling for more than I need in some areas, less than I want in others, and lose a lot of control over the particular features, and lose the ability to incrementally upgrade or modify my system. But that is kinda just my nature, I like to tinker and obsess over little details, and learn, and tweak. And I like the DIY route because you gain a lot of knowledge along the way. But the flipside of that is that sometimes that knowledge is gained through headaches, and screwups, and oh-shit-moments.

So I think in some ways its a personal (subjective) choice, what are you drawn to?

 

[Steve_S]

I general avoid All-In-One solutions for the above noted reasons... Who wants to buy something that is one part fails the whole thing is scrapped. LUCKILY, the MPP ones are "apparently" separate components in one box and the components are modular & replaceable per Will's video's. Generally I prefer separate components because things can & do fail - I've got an Inverter/Charger Boat Anchor ! which is my reminder to think smarter. One important point, you DO get what you pay for.

 

[tim0shel]

It depends. Really the only reason I don't use an all in one is that I don't like the idea of one part dying and then nothing works. With a component setup you can replace components as necessary. I do like the AIO though for simplicity sake. There are a few drawbacks to some of the AIO as well such as needing a common port BMS in most cases, which in itself isn't an issue but high current needs through a common port could become an issue

This is exactly my logic and have considered in many aspects. I rather be able to replace a component verse having something that has the function but stops working.

 

[heirloom hamlet]

It depends. Really the only reason I don't use an all in one is that I don't like the idea of one part dying and then nothing works. With a component setup you can replace components as necessary. I do like the AIO though for simplicity sake. There are a few drawbacks to some of the AIO as well such as needing a common port BMS in most cases, which in itself isn't an issue but high current needs through a common port could become an issue

Forgive me for being ridiculous, but I'm constantly learning new deep details from you guys (or lingo). What is a common port BMS. I'm still trying to understand which would be best for my 24v AIO systems and 280aH EVE (or not, who knows) cells.

 

[Steve_S]

Forgive me for being ridiculous, but I'm constantly learning new deep details from you guys (or lingo). What is a common port BMS. I'm still trying to understand which would be best for my 24v AIO systems and 280aH EVE (or not, who knows) cells.

Simply put: Common Port means that Charging & Discharging is done on the same battery wires. Separate Port means that Discharging is done on one set of wired which Charging is done on a separate set of wires. Common Port BMS' are the most commonly used ones. Separate Port is typically used for EV's or when you have completely separate charging facilities like 120V/240V -> DC Charger -> Battery bank. There is an article in the FAQ section I believe that get's deeper into it.

 

[ICT]

Great discussion. When I first saw Wills video I thought that it made great sense. I get the idea if it breaks then you have nothing. I am also concerned by where they come from now. Hard to beat a Will endorsement though. Anybody have one and would love to know the experience. Based upon what I am looking at by components the All in One in Wills video would be half the price.

 

[Gilligan]

There is something to be said for the simplicity of an AIO, especially if all the little decisions and technical details of the DIY route stress you out. But I agree with Craig,

Personally, I don't like the idea that with an all-in-one, I would be settling for more than I need in some areas, less than I want in others, and lose a lot of control over the particular features, and lose the ability to incrementally upgrade or modify my system. But that is kinda just my nature, I like to tinker and obsess over little details, and learn, and tweak. And I like the DIY route because you gain a lot of knowledge along the way. But the flipside of that is that sometimes that knowledge is gained through headaches, and screwups, and oh-shit-moments.

So I think in some ways its a personal (subjective) choice, what are you drawn to?

You seem a lot like me.

I was definitely drawn to the component system so that I could tinker and make it mine.

But in the end, I'm cheap and wanted to save money.

Then as I looked at 24v systems it just kept creeping up and I started thinking I was losing that price advantage.

Dropped it all in Excel and realized I was correct.

Now I need to figure out how I want to size my system and what I want to run off of it.

I rent at my wife's place so grid tie doesn't make sense, thinking about selling my house sooner than later so again grid tie doesn't make sense.

Grid tie at my shop would make the most sense but I'm 3 phase and it's a really old system and they would probably make me upgrade my panel and such... That becomes really cost prohibitive. I might look at building a 3 phase system like this someday to run my AC... It runs constantly through the day m-f.

Probably will start with a smaller system for my wife's place as it's all window units.

Gilligan

 

[namesgolden]

I might look at building a 3 phase system like this someday to run my AC... It runs constantly through the day m-f. ☹

starting with a window unit system will be a great learning testbed. then you can expand.

there are 48v mpp units that do 3phase. install one between the A/C and main panel. no reason to mess with main panel.

since the usage is probably mostly during daytime you can get away with a small battery bank, just using solar input and grid fallover.

be sure to consider the economies of scale, I can't get panels locally so its best for me to buy pallets of panels.

 

[Gilligan]

That's an excellent point.

A 5 ton unit running from 8-6 is a lot of energy and the majority of it is during the day.

Just getting most of that from solar would be a big help and would require pallets of panels so that's perfect.

The shade on my roof would also help with my problem as well as that roof is too hot to touch and underside is almost not even insulated.

Gilligan

 

[Pacer]

I am having this very debate myself! Ugh. I cannot decide which direction to go. I love simplicity, but also don’t want a brick on my wall if one small component goes down.

 

[Gilligan]

I am having this very debate myself! Ugh. I cannot decide which direction to go. I love simplicity, but also don’t want a brick on my wall if one small component goes down.

Plus Will states that the fans run all the time and are pretty loud and the standby current draw is a bit much compared to most components.

 

[Pacer]

Plus Will states that the fans run all the time and are pretty loud and the standby current draw is a bit much compared to most components.

Yes that was another reason as well!

 

[Gilligan]

Now I can't decide if it makes sense to go 24v when I'll likely only run 12v and 120v(ac) loads. :/

 

[Dzl]

Now I can't decide if it makes sense to go 24v when I'll likely only run 12v and 120v(ac) loads. :/

I still go back and forth on this, currently I'm planning 24v (and planning to use as many 24v appliances as possible--there are more 24v options out there than you think), use a 24v to 12v converter for everything I can't find in 24v, and use an inverter only for the things I cant run off DC.

But in terms of simplicity and parts availability 12v is hard to beat. And the efficiency advantage (cost and power) of 24v might be minimal for a small system (remember that every time you convert you lose a little, converting from 24v down to 12v will be at best 97% efficient, possibly closer to 90%).

 

[namesgolden]

main reason to go 24v is cheaper charge controllers and its much easier to invert up. its up to the user to decide if the benefits outweigh the inconvenience. I'm not sure i'd do a 12v system over 600w or so.

I decided to keep it simple for my first build. I would up going with a mpp2424.

I didn't want to modify my motorhome roof yet and I'm parked on land I don't own. I am building a solar trailer - panels, batteries and inverter on a old camper/utility trailer.

I will charge the rig's 12vdc system (currently 4x 75ah lead acid) with the ac-dc converter. I did order a 30a epever in case I want to put a panel on the RV 12v bank.

 

[ICT]

Where are you getting your mpp2424 and when is it supposed to arrive?

 

[namesgolden]

Where are you getting your mpp2424 and when is it supposed to arrive?

santan solar. at $650 it was around the cost of me buying one from somewhere else including shipping. it's being shipped with my panels, they just sent me the estes tracking info so I'd expect a week or so.

 

[ICT]

Excellent. Can't wait to see how it works. I am leaning the same way. Have 945 watts of solar and could add if needed with that unit.

 

[ICT]

Went to there website but could not find anything but solar panels. When you click on other products it says search not available.

 

[namesgolden]

Went to there website but could not find anything but solar panels. When you click on other products it says search not available.

send sales a email. they took a lot of stuff off the website monday but still had it in stock at the time.

the sales manager did say business has been brisk.

 

[ICT]

Thank you!!