Anyone have this BMS?? QUCC latest model

[ghostwriter66]

Had my hopes up there for a minute on the black one.
Looks like the standard xiaoxiang app, heaps of things should be adjustable hopefully.

I have a feeling that there was a cost issue and a heat issue .... In @Off-Grid-Garage video (see below) when he's taking it apart (see 5:16 mark) ... there is a 10W resistor ... He did not flip the board over so i could not trace where it was used at BUT I am going to say that is used in the BALANCER/BALANCING circuit and draws off the high voltage of the high cell and converts it to energy (heat) ... so putting that "heater" in a sealed black aluminum case -- hmmmm - you could probably cook off it .... just my guess ... but I think thats why they stopped doing the enclosure .. plus probably saved them $1.50 ... just a guess

 

[Sharky722]

I have a feeling that there was a cost issue and a heat issue .... In @Off-Grid-Garage video (see below) when he's taking it apart (see 5:16 mark) ... there is a 10W resistor ... He did not flip the board over so i could not trace where it was used at BUT I am going to say that is used in the BALANCER/BALANCING circuit and draws off the high voltage of the high cell and converts it to energy (heat) ... so putting that "heater" in a sealed black aluminum case -- hmmmm - you could probably cook off it .... just my guess ... but I think thats why they stopped doing the enclosure .. plus probably saved them $1.50 ... just a guess

I don't know either about that resistor. I just liked the compact design/simplicity of it and the fact of no fets.
Good channel isn't it.

 

[Horsefly]

It should work .. if i am doing 24 volts ... 3.2v X 16 .. that means that I would use the 13s-20s and put one on every battery and then the extra leads I would follow their instructions and double up on some of the batteries already with leads ... I like the physical releay and not a bunch of mosfets that i know nothing of their quality ... I will probably give it a try ... my team partners in North Dakota likes it BUT again ... i need for QUCC to tell me that I can adjust via app the temperature disconnect for CHARGING and set it for 2C and not -20C while Charging ....

24V battery is 8 cells, not 16. 8 x 3.2 = 25.8V. I think that means the 13s-20s model won't work, right?

 

[ghostwriter66]

24V battery is 8 cells, not 16. 8 x 3.2 = 25.8V. I think that means the 13s-20s model won't work, right?

Sorry about that -- yep your are right -- I am running both 24 and 48 .. got confused ... thx

 

[Steve_S]

Honestly - they need to put @Steve_S on retainer and have him reword the app .. i am not sure what i am reading... like .. what does DISCHARGE UNDER TEMPERATURE RELEASE DELAY mean ??? well actually the entire app page could use a good English "fixin" ...

As we all suspected and more or less knew, in that 21st Century, Any & All Good Deeds cannot go unpunished. BTDT scarring has healed and ain't doin it again. There is only One Tick left for the Rule of Three to be satisfied.

 

[Frank in Thailand]

As we all suspected and more or less knew, in that 21st Century, Any & All Good Deeds cannot go unpunished. BTDT scarring has healed and ain't doin it again. There is only One Tick left for the Rule of Three to be satisfied.

That took me some time to unravel..
Probably because I'm not native English..

Sadly yes, that in the 21st Century, Any & All Good Deeds cannot go unpunished. :-(
Also Been there, Done That...

All good things come in three.

?

For those who didn't where involved in punishment, your (and others) good deeds are highly appreciated.
Thank you.

Indeed so sad that some individuals can't cope with/ understand and receive a precious gift.

 

[Off-Grid-Garage]

Surpr

I have a feeling that there was a cost issue and a heat issue .... In @Off-Grid-Garage video (see below) when he's taking it apart (see 5:16 mark) ... there is a 10W resistor ... He did not flip the board over so i could not trace where it was used at BUT I am going to say that is used in the BALANCER/BALANCING circuit and draws off the high voltage of the high cell and converts it to energy (heat) ... so putting that "heater" in a sealed black aluminum case -- hmmmm - you could probably cook off it .... just my guess ... but I think thats why they stopped doing the enclosure .. plus probably saved them $1.50 ... just a guess

Surprisingly, the BMS stays very cool (35°C on a hot 36°C day). I had the chance to test it with a 2kW load for around 20min and no heat increase in the BMS (or outside).
I'm not sure about this ceramic resistor either but don't think it's for balancing. The BMS can balance 10 cells at a time and this would not work with only one resistor, would it?

 

[Frank in Thailand]

The 24v (8S) is still available!!

https://m.aliexpress.com/item/4001334902777.html

Just different brand name

 

[alvirtuoso]

I really love that they use contactor instead of mosfet!!

For what reason?

 

[Frank in Thailand]

For what reason?

That's an easy one.

A Mosfet is a switch build to make millions of short connection for long periods of time.

During this connection they produce a voltage drop, what will result in heat.
At a few amps, not a problem.
Talk about 200 watt model doing 100 watt, half a volt is 50 watts of heat...
Going in...
And going out of your battery.
So losing 100 watts on 5000 watt.
Sorage-use cycle.

Besides this, they tend to fail a LOT during "abuse" continuous connection!

Contactor is build to make a contact at 100, 200, 500A with practically NO voltage drop. (Millivolts)
They don't get warm from this, but they do use a little energy.
My 400A uses 11w.

The QUCC first made a mistake..
A car starter contactor based BMS..
Not intended to hold longer periods of time...

Off-grid garage had a nice fused car starter contactor...

A quality 400A contactor use 5-7 volt aviation grade, last a lifetime and costs about $150 for just that contactor.

With higher Amperage you can't use a light switch to turn in and off.
Not DC, Not AC.

All above 100A is conciddered higher Amperage and needs to be treated with respect and potentially dangerous, deadly even.

If you read a bit, you'll see I have had some mishaps, fire and such.
Due to the fact I have contactor it was easy to stop the circuit circle.
BMS like Daly is not easy to stop during a fire

You don't have time to open your app on the phone.

A simple switch to turn on or off a big switch is the only safe way to go.

You see this in EV, no Mosfet, Contactor.
You see this in high electricity grids, contactor, no Mosfet.
Electric forklift, golf cart..
All contactors for decades.

We don't need to re-invent the wheel just because DC now is used for solar

Under 100A, Mosfet is cheap, easy, small and the power loss is easy to handle.
Above 100A..

Role a dice

 

[Horsefly]

That's an easy one.

A Mosfet is a switch build to make millions of short connection for long periods of time.

During this connection they produce a voltage drop, what will result in heat.
At a few amps, not a problem.
Talk about 200 watt model doing 100 watt, half a volt is 50 watts of heat...
Going in...
And going out of your battery.
So losing 100 watts on 5000 watt.
Sorage-use cycle.

Besides this, they tend to fail a LOT during "abuse" continuous connection!

Contactor is build to make a contact at 100, 200, 500A with practically NO voltage drop. (Millivolts)
They don't get warm from this, but they do use a little energy.
My 400A uses 11w.

The QUCC first made a mistake..
A car starter contactor based BMS..
Not intended to hold longer periods of time...

Off-grid garage had a nice fused car starter contactor...

A quality 400A contactor use 5-7 volt aviation grade, last a lifetime and costs about $150 for just that contactor.

With higher Amperage you can't use a light switch to turn in and off.
Not DC, Not AC.

All above 100A is conciddered higher Amperage and needs to be treated with respect and potentially dangerous, deadly even.

If you read a bit, you'll see I have had some mishaps, fire and such.
Due to the fact I have contactor it was easy to stop the circuit circle.
BMS like Daly is not easy to stop during a fire

You don't have time to open your app on the phone.

A simple switch to turn on or off a big switch is the only safe way to go.

You see this in EV, no Mosfet, Contactor.
You see this in high electricity grids, contactor, no Mosfet.
Electric forklift, golf cart..
All contactors for decades.

We don't need to re-invent the wheel just because DC now is used for solar

Under 100A, Mosfet is cheap, easy, small and the power loss is easy to handle.
Above 100A..

Role a dice

MOSFETs fail because of heat, mechanical contactors / relays fail because.... Well, they are mechanical!

A well-designed BMS will have the current well-distributed between lots of MOSFETs, all of which will be operating well below their spec current and temperature range.

I think the mechanical contactor vs. MOSFET based BMS argument will be going on well after I'm dead. There are passionate - and sometimes well reasoned - arguments for either one over the other. Both can fail, but a well-designed version of either can last a very long time.

 

[Frank in Thailand]

MOSFETs fail because of heat, mechanical contactors / relays fail because.... Well, they are mechanical!

A well-designed BMS will have the current well-distributed between lots of MOSFETs, all of which will be operating well below their spec current and temperature range.

I think the mechanical contactor vs. MOSFET based BMS argument will be going on well after I'm dead. There are passionate - and sometimes well reasoned - arguments for either one over the other. Both can fail, but a well-designed version of either can last a very long time.

Lol...
Yes, mechanical.
They might fail to connect.
The electromagnet.
They won't fail to disconnect..
That will always function, as long as you have the right tool for the right job.
Not a car starter contactor on BMS.

It does have a price point.
What is it worth?
That the shutdown always will work?

Like I wrote 400A, $150..
That is without BMS.
Just your safety.
Sure, feel free to replace it with $5 dollars worth of low quality Mosfet..
It's your setup.

Things with high amperage that need to stop on emergency AC ad DC all use magentic contactor, who will not fail when the electrical circuit is stopped (electromagnet no longer keeping the 2 surfaces connected) a spring will do the rest.

It's really interesting to see the internals of a contactor.

When not abused it won't fuse the connection points.
And won't ever fail to disconnect.

 

[Frank in Thailand]

Sad thing is that when you buy Daly BMS (who build excellent lower ampere units, set and forget) you are paying 75-125 bucks?

250A Mosfet setup of high quality MOSFETs is build price over 50 dollar.
For just the MOSFETs.

As you know Daly doesn't have stock, they build per order the high amperage units.

Chinese labour is cheap, not that cheap.

 

[Horsefly]

They won't fail to disconnect..

I guess you've never heard of welded contacts?

Anyway, you prove my point. Everyone has an opinion, and believes anyone else with a different opinion is stupid. Arguments about it are fruitless, except for people who like to troll.

 

[Frank in Thailand]

I guess you've never heard of welded contacts?

Anyway, you prove my point. Everyone has an opinion, and believes anyone else with a different opinion is stupid. Arguments about it are fruitless, except for people who like to troll.

Lol indeed

Yes, I have heard of welded contact, even mentioned it.
That off-grid garage first had low quality car starter contactor.
Those absolutely will fail even just for starting your car ??

Right tool for the right job.
Personally I keep 50% China margin on cheap products, when I need 200A, I'll buy a 400A.

For quality product 15-25%
I know that the high quality 400% has been stress tested with 600,800 and even 1000A.
Then 15% (or perhaps even none) safety.
As it's "build-in" where aviation grade 400A could withstand 1000A, in China that is quick rated as 1000A contactor

Cheap doesn't need to be bad quality.

MOSFET based above 100A, my biggest concern is the energy loss due voltage drop.
My 2 Daly both had about 0.75 a difference..
One (150A smart) won't really start, other one failed after 2.5 months (dumb 250A)

Lower Ampere setups, they work great and ages!

That's my personal experience.
Reading in the forum's, many have 0.5 or more voltage difference between battery and power negative out of the BMS

That does go somewhere, and you aren't using it

 

[Sun in Lithium]

DISCHARGE UNDER TEMPERATURE RELEASE DELAY mean ?

I believe that is, in case you have speratic temperature changes (say if the thermistor is broken) your relay doesn't turn on and off 100 times per second.