Bluetti AC200MAX let the smoke out

[RodKnock]

No my mistake as far as I can tell.

Went in to move power from a small freezer over to the ac200max and the ac200max started smoking.
No fan came on it just started smoking. A significant amount that it looked like it was going into melt down.
The freezer draws 750w max on startup and 70w after. I have run it off the 200max for 5 days straight without issue.

Needless to say its sitting in the garage right now and I'm airing out the house when its 4F outside.
Bluetti has received and email from me and a phone call that I had to leave a message for them to get back to me... Playing the waiting game now.
Nothing like spending $2100 on an item and it self-destructs 15 days later...

Running 2 of these solar panels in series so I'm well under what the ac200max can accept for solar input.

 

[RodKnock]

Got ahold of Buetti support. Warranty claims are handled in China and that it will take a few days for it to process.
Well isn't that just !#$@^@$%^&@$% special. Let the games begin.

 

[Rocksnsalt]

Got ahold of Buetti support. Warranty claims are handled in China and that it will take a few days for it to process.
Well isn't that just !#$@^@$%^&@$% special. Let the games begin.

Holy crap what a bummer!
I have an AC 200MAX too. Please keep us posted.

 

[RodKnock]

Received return shipping lable and shipped the AC200Max back. Waiting on a full refund now.

Back to the drawing board. Have to do something with the panels I have installed.

 

[Rocksnsalt]

Received return shipping lable and shipped the AC200Max back. Waiting on a full refund now.

Back to the drawing board. Have to do something with the panels I have installed.

Thanks for the update. Please Let us know how the refund goes.

 

[RodKnock]

Received the refund.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

Have to do something with the panels I have installed.

How many?
They are the label posted up above?

You can get way more capacity and have money leftover for the price of a broetthi

 

[RodKnock]

I have 2 of those panels.
Thinking of making a 2 wheel dolly setup like this.

Using this stuff.

Growatt 24V SPF-3000TL-LVM 3,000W 120V Stackable Inverter | 2kW MPPT Charge Controller
or
PIP LV2424 MSD 24V 2.4kW


24V 200AH LiFePower4 Battery by EG4


Thoughts?

 

[12VoltInstalls]

If course I have no idea your uses are but I’d add a second battery? In my way of thinking a 3000W inverter needs more than a 200Ah battery and if you are in a decent sun area those panels will handle two of those batteries fine.

Another way to look at it: is a 3000W inverter actually something you need? It says it will do 2000W of panels. Are you going that much eventually soon? What is the overnight load? If going to 2000W why are you making the batteries on wheels? PV cable is fairly inexpensive

 

[RodKnock]

Honestly, I like liked the Bluettie because of its mobility and was just looking at ways of possibly retaining mobility as an option.
Albeit a not very good option in this case due to size and weight.

Your right, I do not need a 3k inverter. Just not seeing other all in ones that have 2k inverters at this moment.
Located in Mn, we get 4-5 hours of good charging daylight so the AC charging option with these all in ones caught my attention.
I was looking at buying Victron MPPT100/30, 2-12V 100AH Battle born to run in paralell and a 2k sine inverter.

The primary use for the system will be to power freezers and recharge electronics in grid down times.

Using this as a learning experience to possibly expand and make an off grid system someday.
But before dropping crazy money on something like that I'm trying dabble and educate myself on how not to let the smoke out.

0 for 1 so far. Although to my defense, I think the Bluetti was a faulty unit.

 

[RodKnock]

Found that Growatt makes a MIC 2000TLX and MPP makes a 2024LV-MK.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

There’s nothing wrong with the 3000W inverter especially if you plan to ‘grow into it.’ Many of those AIO units are surprisingly inexpensive and sometimes about the same sum of money as components.

But if you are going to use it 24/7/365 with a smaller system I’m wondering if the “idle” aka no-load consumption isn’t a lot percentage-wise for a small system.

Then again, you are probably buying that and a couple of batteries for a total cost enough less than the brewetti that it should let you buy 2 more panels. That will make enough power (sorry it’s not power it’s energy) from your array that the no-load overhead shouldn’t matter much.

Plus in my weird way of thinking a 3000W inverter will put out 2000W without breathing heavy. So with more information I retract my statement. If you had four panels that would be 1500W of input so you could potentially offset at least 5kW on a good winter’s sun day or even a hazy shade of winter.

 

[Rocksnsalt]

Honestly, I like liked the Bluettie because of its mobility and was just looking at ways of possibly retaining mobility as an option.
Albeit a not very good option in this case due to size and weight.

Your right, I do not need a 3k inverter. Just not seeing other all in ones that have 2k inverters at this moment.
Located in Mn, we get 4-5 hours of good charging daylight so the AC charging option with these all in ones caught my attention.
I was looking at buying Victron MPPT100/30, 2-12V 100AH Battle born to run in paralell and a 2k sine inverter.

The primary use for the system will be to power freezers and recharge electronics in grid down times.

Using this as a learning experience to possibly expand and make an off grid system someday.
But before dropping crazy money on something like that I'm trying dabble and educate myself on how not to let the smoke out.

0 for 1 so far. Although to my defense, I think the Bluetti was a faulty unit.

I have the ac200max, use it primarily in my Sprinter van.
No issues now other than the optional 12v “charging enhancer” D050S is it’s fuse.
The standard cig lighter plug in charger is working fine, usually 103-120 watts when the Sprinter van is idling, which is what the D050S did for a few weeks before the fuse problem appeared.

I just wish I’d find a youtube hack (or on this forum) of someone successfully using a 12V 200ah to 400ah LifeP04 with the AC200Max in place of a bluetti B230 or B300. Like an EG4 or similar, and SOK 200ah or 2, or a bank of AO 100ah like Will recently reviewed.
I do like the portable aspect, that’s the main reason I went with this type of device. I use it in my house sometimes for free energy (and once during a power outage)…charging off a pair of 100w rich solar panels on my patio.

 

[HarryN]

Out of curiosity, was the BL unit in the garage and subject to low temperatures?

Just in general, for use in temperatures that are less than 40 F routinely, an AGM based setup is a lot better option.

I know that people don't want to hear that but it is reality.

 

[RodKnock]

Nope, utility room at 65F. It was brought into the garage when it started smoking.

 

[Rocksnsalt]

Out of curiosity, was the BL unit in the garage and subject to low temperatures?

Just in general, for use in temperatures that are less than 40 F routinely, an AGM based setup is a lot better option.

I know that people don't want to hear that but it is reality.

Would a simple battery heater negate that “reality”?
Given the actual useable power of LifeP04, ( being able to draw down to 20% without degrading battery longevity vs AGM batteries), as well as the 5-15 yr expected lifespan… the LifeP04 seems like a better situation to me.

Unless you’re in an extreme cold environment and have room for the extra agm’s it will take to provide the power you need.

Just thinking out loud…

 

[HarryN]

Would a simple battery heater negate that “reality”?
Given the actual useable power of LifeP04, ( being able to draw down to 20% without degrading battery longevity vs AGM batteries), as well as the 5-15 yr expected lifespan… the LifeP04 seems like a better situation to me.

Unless you’re in an extreme cold environment and have room for the extra agm’s it will take to provide the power you need.

Just thinking out loud…

It is a trade off that I discuss with my customers routinely, especially the van customers, and you are right - it is definitely a trade off.

In this area, people would like to have battery powered air conditioning in the summer time (which drives the decision heavily toward LiFe) and then want to go skiing at Tahoe in the winter (which leans toward AGM).

There are LiFe batteries on the market with internal electric heaters now (example some battle borns and others). Those distribute the heat around inside vs just heating from one side, but obviously something is better than nothing if the power levels are modest.

Tesla and some others use battery pack based electric heating (and cooling), but they have a pretty large power pack to draw from.

At this point, I am suggesting that if they design their van system around LiFe, then they need to have fuel based heating system that can keep the batteries at a minimum temperature of 40 - 50 F range, 24 x 7, no matter what the weather is doing.

For AGM based systems, I suggest that people try to use a larger solar array than is needed, and ideally mount the panels facing multiple directions so that they are catching sunlight throughout the day, even if that leads to some wasted power. (example 8 am / 2 pm / 6 pm)

There are days when I wonder if we should swap out battery packs for winter / summer use similar to what we do with tires.

As a practical matter, many users can get by with a 4 battery / 48 volt / 2 kW class setup so that is my typical installation.

 

[Rocksnsalt]

It is a trade off that I discuss with my customers routinely, especially the van customers, and you are right - it is definitely a trade off.

In this area, people would like to have battery powered air conditioning in the summer time (which drives the decision heavily toward LiFe) and then want to go skiing at Tahoe in the winter (which leans toward AGM).

There are LiFe batteries on the market with internal electric heaters now (example some battle borns and others). Those distribute the heat around inside vs just heating from one side, but obviously something is better than nothing if the power levels are modest.

Tesla and some others use battery pack based electric heating (and cooling), but they have a pretty large power pack to draw from.

At this point, I am suggesting that if they design their van system around LiFe, then they need to have fuel based heating system that can keep the batteries at a minimum temperature of 40 - 50 F range, 24 x 7, no matter what the weather is doing.

For AGM based systems, I suggest that people try to use a larger solar array than is needed, and ideally mount the panels facing multiple directions so that they are catching sunlight throughout the day, even if that leads to some wasted power. (example 8 am / 2 pm / 6 pm)

There are days when I wonder if we should swap out battery packs for winter / summer use similar to what we do with tires.

As a practical matter, many users can get by with a 4 battery / 48 volt / 2 kW class setup so that is my typical installation.

All good points. Re Battleborn having the inside heat elements… it would be great if battery companies would start incorporating internal heat, hi and low temp protection…. And a legitimate 200amp discharge rate out of a 100ah lifeP04 battery like the AO Battery Will reviewed a week or 2 ago.
27+ min @ 200amps out of a 100ah(!).

Seems nobody has it all in an off the shelf battery… yet.

 

[HarryN]

All good points. Re Battleborn having the inside heat elements… it would be great if battery companies would start incorporating internal heat, hi and low temp protection…. And a legitimate 200amp discharge rate out of a 100ah lifeP04 battery like the AO Battery Will reviewed a week or 2 ago.
27+ min @ 200amps out of a 100ah(!).

Seems nobody has it all in an off the shelf battery… yet.

You have to be really careful with battery charge / discharge specs and simplistic testing methods.

A lot of BMS setups get pretty warm when the amps start to get close to the official mfg ratings. I was looking at one model that was great at C/2 but when the discharge was approaching 1 C, the BMS was dissipating so much heat that the usable capacity looked a lot like an AGM.

There is an intrinsic assumption by these companies that there will be sufficient time for the BMS to cool down after a single discharge cycle.

When you go back to the suppliers and stay "I want to use this battery in continuous cycling of charging and discharging / no breaks", "what can it do", those rate numbers go way down. That is why I am more conservative on electrical systems and run them at max (rated number / 2).

 

[Rocksnsalt]

You have to be really careful with battery charge / discharge specs and simplistic testing methods.

A lot of BMS setups get pretty warm when the amps start to get close to the official mfg ratings. I was looking at one model that was great at C/2 but when the discharge was approaching 1 C, the BMS was dissipating so much heat that the usable capacity looked a lot like an AGM.

There is an intrinsic assumption by these companies that there will be sufficient time for the BMS to cool down after a single discharge cycle.

When you go back to the suppliers and stay "I want to use this battery in continuous cycling of charging and discharging / no breaks", "what can it do", those rate numbers go way down. That is why I am more conservative on electrical systems and run them at max (rated number / 2).

Makes sense being conservative / overbuilding a system.
Will did check temps after the 27 min 200amp draw.
Certainly doing that kind of draw repeatedly may shorten battery life, but nice to know you can on occasion.
I’d really like to see this same company (or others) market a 200, 300, and 400amp batteries with similar build quality and scaled capabilities. And internal heaters etc.