50ShadesOfDirt
Solar Enthusiast
- Joined
- Jan 8, 2021
- Messages
- 445
... as in, the only way the system should be purchased is if you have an "authorized installer" with a *service contract* to support it. Even this is tricky, because the burden is upon you to evaluate the installer as well as the product. This might be getting beyond the capabilities of a mere mortal ...
The two cases that IMHO represent this new extreme are:
- Generac "whole-house generators" (installed only by authorized dealers)
- EP Cube "home energy storage system" (also installed only by authorized dealers)
You can tell that these fit the new extreme of *you are guaranteed to have problems with this system* by reading the full set of documentation for the system, and making note of the numerous exclusion clauses and phrases that basically say, "it's your fault, not ours ... we aren't paying for it". By reading thru all the docs & warranty guides, you'll know that the vendor is just not on your side. It's more of a tussle between the vendor and the "authorized installer", and you are only a bystander on the sideline who happened to have paid for everything, but has no control over anything.
In this case, you must ensure that there is some kind of reasonable (and paid) yearly service contract between you and the authorized installer, as the installer is the only party that really stands a chance of getting warranty repair, eating any costs that happen to fall back onto the owner, etc. Only a paid contract will cover the installer's efforts, and only this mechanism will protect you from incredible costs and headaches due to problems that arise later.
You are kidding yourself if you think you can do it ... it's a new class of systems that aren't really designed to be DIY. They are designed around "authorized installers", and nobody else. If you don't get into bed with a reputable authorized installer, and if you don't pay them (thru service contacts) to be on your side, you must have very deep pockets, up to and including ripping things out and starting over, all on your nickel.
Things to look for in the docs & warranties that prove the above? How about:
- authorized installer only
- send pics of installation into our service department for approval
- numerous exclusions to all kinds of conditions
- must remain internet-connected
- failure to register by a certain date ... invalidates warranty
- and many more too numerous to list ...
Note that there are many other systems that fit this problem ... don't need to name any names, just review that vendor and product for forum reviews threads, complaints, etc. Then review all the docs for that product. You'll see that they fit the pattern. Many AIO's are going this route ...
Also note that Generac's (and systems like EP Cube) are fine for any home fitting the exact conditions of service within an authorized dealer network; usually, this is dense neighborhoods in highly populated areas, with good access (and money). In essence, they become an external "service" that you can't ever really install/maintain/fix yourself ... it's another form of plumbing, hvac, or electrical that you can't touch, you can only pay for it. If you are within range of an authorized dealer, and there is a service contract that you believe in, it might fit to go the route of these things. It might even improve your home's value, whereas DIY is sometimes iffy in that regard.
But, it will never be a DIY scenario.
I think where this is heading is that you either stay on the DIY path (individual components of solar gear, carefully researched, matched, installed by yourself, maintained/repaired/replaced) where you have full control, or you jump on the "some authorized dealer does it for you" path, and you have no control other than to kick in money and keep kicking it in. This lack of control includes those cases where vendor/installer get into tussles, and ultimately you are left holding the bill for whatever disaster they can't resolve amongst themselves.
I'd say keep DIY'ing, but the other problem coming at us all is that ... the vendors are taking over the supply chain, and individual components may be falling by the wayside ... only massively integrated components, authorized installers, regulatory bodies are there for you to pick from (and read thru).
I'd also say even this forum has changed, such that there is less info about DIY and individual componentry, and more about AIO, massive installer systems, regulations, grief ... perhaps it's even time to split the forum into *only DIY*, and all the rest of this? www.aiosolarforum, or www.hesssolarforum ?
The two cases that IMHO represent this new extreme are:
- Generac "whole-house generators" (installed only by authorized dealers)
- EP Cube "home energy storage system" (also installed only by authorized dealers)
You can tell that these fit the new extreme of *you are guaranteed to have problems with this system* by reading the full set of documentation for the system, and making note of the numerous exclusion clauses and phrases that basically say, "it's your fault, not ours ... we aren't paying for it". By reading thru all the docs & warranty guides, you'll know that the vendor is just not on your side. It's more of a tussle between the vendor and the "authorized installer", and you are only a bystander on the sideline who happened to have paid for everything, but has no control over anything.
In this case, you must ensure that there is some kind of reasonable (and paid) yearly service contract between you and the authorized installer, as the installer is the only party that really stands a chance of getting warranty repair, eating any costs that happen to fall back onto the owner, etc. Only a paid contract will cover the installer's efforts, and only this mechanism will protect you from incredible costs and headaches due to problems that arise later.
You are kidding yourself if you think you can do it ... it's a new class of systems that aren't really designed to be DIY. They are designed around "authorized installers", and nobody else. If you don't get into bed with a reputable authorized installer, and if you don't pay them (thru service contacts) to be on your side, you must have very deep pockets, up to and including ripping things out and starting over, all on your nickel.
Things to look for in the docs & warranties that prove the above? How about:
- authorized installer only
- send pics of installation into our service department for approval
- numerous exclusions to all kinds of conditions
- must remain internet-connected
- failure to register by a certain date ... invalidates warranty
- and many more too numerous to list ...
Note that there are many other systems that fit this problem ... don't need to name any names, just review that vendor and product for forum reviews threads, complaints, etc. Then review all the docs for that product. You'll see that they fit the pattern. Many AIO's are going this route ...
Also note that Generac's (and systems like EP Cube) are fine for any home fitting the exact conditions of service within an authorized dealer network; usually, this is dense neighborhoods in highly populated areas, with good access (and money). In essence, they become an external "service" that you can't ever really install/maintain/fix yourself ... it's another form of plumbing, hvac, or electrical that you can't touch, you can only pay for it. If you are within range of an authorized dealer, and there is a service contract that you believe in, it might fit to go the route of these things. It might even improve your home's value, whereas DIY is sometimes iffy in that regard.
But, it will never be a DIY scenario.
I think where this is heading is that you either stay on the DIY path (individual components of solar gear, carefully researched, matched, installed by yourself, maintained/repaired/replaced) where you have full control, or you jump on the "some authorized dealer does it for you" path, and you have no control other than to kick in money and keep kicking it in. This lack of control includes those cases where vendor/installer get into tussles, and ultimately you are left holding the bill for whatever disaster they can't resolve amongst themselves.
I'd say keep DIY'ing, but the other problem coming at us all is that ... the vendors are taking over the supply chain, and individual components may be falling by the wayside ... only massively integrated components, authorized installers, regulatory bodies are there for you to pick from (and read thru).
I'd also say even this forum has changed, such that there is less info about DIY and individual componentry, and more about AIO, massive installer systems, regulations, grief ... perhaps it's even time to split the forum into *only DIY*, and all the rest of this? www.aiosolarforum, or www.hesssolarforum ?
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