Dr Strangetroll : or how I learned to stop arguing and be amused by the intransigence

[noenegdod]

Covid can damage the heart. If the heart already has some sort of weakness that you were born with, you could be adversely affected.

If you have a person that is otherwise healthy but has a structural defect in the heart, yes pumping efficiency is reduced and they have reduced capacity. That is for certain.

If you have a person with heart disease, the heart disease is just one of many issues they have as a result of poor lifestyle choices.

These two heart conditions are completely different. The otherwise healthy person has a healthy, responsive immune system. The person with heart disease has systemic issues that cripples their ability to protect themselves naturally.

Likewise, please resist the urge to strawman this like you seem to like to do.

I have taken this out of order because this is a big deal to me.

"Strawman:
You misrepresented someone's argument to make it easier to attack.
By exaggerating, misrepresenting, or just completely fabricating someone's argument, it's much easier to present your own position as being reasonable, but this kind of dishonesty serves to undermine honest rational debate."

I try really hard to not strawman anyone. Being human I do fail. Please show me where I strawmaned you so I can learn from it and try to prevent it in the future.

Personally, I like outdoor activity too much like biking, hiking and swimming. The chance that I couldn't do those things anymore due to having my lungs or heart affected is not worth the risk of getting covid and having them damaged. Totally worth any miniscule risk of a vaccine.

My friend, I champion your right to to make the choice that is right for you. I also champion the right for anyone that wants to make a different choice from you to do that as well.

I firmly believe that everyone has the right to do what they want to and that those choices have consequences. I have chosen to not be vaccinated yet. If I want to have guests in my house and some or all of them do not want to come based on that choice, I am fine with that. That said, I would not allow a person that I thought was compromised into my home unless they were vaccinated. There are 2 reasons for this: 1. An unhealthy covid infected person will likely spread more virus than a healthy infected person. 2. I do not want to be responsible for an infection that kills someone I think is making a bad choice.

I am not hear to try to tell you you should not be vaccinated or that you should tolerate me being in your space unvaccinated. I am here to say that it is my choice. Public is public and private is private. If anyone wants to tell me how to live my live and how to look after my health they had better be ready and willing to make some changes as well because I have some things I want them to do if they expect me to fall in line.

 

[Batvette]

@Batvette Will you please provide what your definition of "Health" is. Maybe that is why we seem to not find any common ground on this issue.

You seem to want your own definition of what is healthy to be applied, to reject information provided by official government agencies. If that isnt constructing a straw man Im not sure what is.
The governments list of pre existing conditions can be found on the CDC website it is well defined and not at all ambiguous.

 

[noenegdod]

You seem to want your own definition of what is healthy to be applied, to reject information provided by official government agencies. If that isnt constructing a straw man Im not sure what is.
The governments list of pre existing conditions can be found on the CDC website it is well defined and not at all ambiguous.

So provide me with the definition of health you use so I know what your perspective is.

 

[Batvette]

So provide me with the definition of health you use so I know what your perspective is.

Thats absurd. And pointless.

 

[noenegdod]

So you say this:

You seem to want your own definition of what is healthy to be applied

and when I ask you this:

So provide me with the definition of health you use so I know what your perspective is.

You say this:

Thats absurd. And pointless.

You are just here to be a sh*t disturber. You have no interest in actually having a conversation.

You do not want to provide a definition of health because you know that it will collapse your claim that healthy people are dying from covid 19.

Useless waste of time but at least you have definitively revealed yourself.

 

[BuffaloTrace]

Role of vitamin D in preventing of COVID-19 infection, progression and severity

The outbreak of COVID-19 has created a global public health crisis. Little is known about the protective factors of this infection. Therefore, preventive health measures that can reduce the risk of infection, progression and severity are desperately needed. ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Johnson]

Covid is never going to go away, we will see new strains in the future, some more deadly others less so. Some of teople infected and survive will have damage that will make a negative outcome more likely the next time they get it. The prudent approach is to get the free vaccine and the boosters (every 6 months). Insurance companies will have no choice but to icrease premiums and offer discounts to people taking the vaccine and boosters. Some policy makers might try to prevent that though. Hospitals will put up special wings for those infected to keep regular services going. Hospital staff will see a boost in pay due to the staffing shortages in the. Next 5 years. Bankruptcy services will see an increase in the number of clients.

Just for the record I find it he Herman Cain award sick even if he had died from covid. And any one who claims they trust their immune system but refuses the vaccine has no clue how the immune system works.

As for policy makers, the issue is only about how many of their countrymen they willing to let die, or more crudely, how much is a persons life worth. Some will care more than others.

 

[brb58]

Covid is never going to go away, we will see new strains in the future, some more deadly others less so. Some of teople infected and survive will have damage that will make a negative outcome more likely the next time they get it. The prudent approach is to get the free vaccine and the boosters (every 6 months). Insurance companies will have no choice but to icrease premiums and offer discounts to people taking the vaccine and boosters. Some policy makers might try to prevent that though. Hospitals will put up special wings for those infected to keep regular services going. Hospital staff will see a boost in pay due to the staffing shortages in the. Next 5 years. Bankruptcy services will see an increase in the number of clients.

Just for the record I find it he Herman Cain award sick even if he had died from covid. And any one who claims they trust their immune system but refuses the vaccine has no clue how the immune system works.

As for policy makers, the issue is only about how many of their countrymen they willing to let die, or more crudely, how much is a persons life worth. Some will care more than others.

Well said.

 

[BuffaloTrace]

Allergies can be helped or even totally stopped by injecting the antigen that causes them, usually a type of pollen or derivitave thereof. This is sometimes done multiple times and in progressivly higher doses until the immune system becomes desensitized to the antigen.

The spike protien is the antigen currently being used, and the vaccine is afterall a type of immunotherapy. Hopefully this decensitization does not occur, but the probability that it will occur at some point in a continuing regimen of boosters is an outcome to think about and keep in mind.

 

[noenegdod]

And any one who claims they trust their immune system but refuses the vaccine has no clue how the immune system works.

So, how does the immune system work?

 

[BMcL]

Sorry but that is just nuts if you actually believe any of that. Are you a Qanon believer like A.justice is?

You have to have your head in the sand to think the feds have tried to save lives the past 2 years

 

[Hedges]

The prudent approach is to get the free vaccine and the boosters (every 6 months).

Why 6 months?
Booster effectiveness wanes to 35% after 10 weeks.

COVID-19 Vaccines

Vaccines are seen as one of the best ways to stop COVID-19. Learn more about the types of vaccines, including the newly approved Novavax.

www.webmd.com

 

[noenegdod]

Booster effectiveness wanes to 35% after 10 weeks.

But it is looking like an Omicron infection causes pretty kick ass immunity

 

[Batvette]

So you say this:



and when I ask you this:


You say this:


You are just here to be a sh*t disturber. You have no interest in actually having a conversation.

You do not want to provide a definition of health because you know that it will collapse your claim that healthy people are dying from covid 19.

Useless waste of time but at least you have definitively revealed yourself.

Joke post. You want to apply your own definition of "healthy" to discredit official govt health agency findings. Not MY claim, but that of the agencies of a number of countries, as also reported by endless numbers of media outlets.

"You are just here to be a sh*t disturber. You have no interest in actually having a conversation.
Useless waste of time but at least you have definitively revealed yourself."

Pot, meet kettle.

I dont expect reason to take over. Youre a conspiracy theorist on this matter, to believe that thousands of medical professionals, scientists, goverment officials, and journalists, have fabricated these accounts for some reason and would present different information than what really happened, your reality is quite different from the rest of us.

Or maybe youre just one of those mental midgets who cant stand to be proven wrong so youve intentionally taken this obtuse position that our own individual beliefs on what constitutes "healthy" should be debated. That is ABSURD.

And unscientific. For purposes of Covid 19, healthy means the victim had not been diagnosed with any of the following underlying health problems or fall into the specified risk groups.

People with Certain Medical Conditions

What you can do if you are at higher risk of severe illness from COVID-19.

www.cdc.gov

The list is specific and comprehensive but is updated.

Submit any changes you would like to see to the agency, Im sure theyll get right on it.

 

[Batvette]

You have to have your head in the sand to think the feds have tried to save lives the past 2 years

Why wouldnt they? Elected officials get voted out if the botched the response, appointed ones get fired by the elected ones.
Im not saying they did all they could, and thank goodness for that.
But to posit they would just let people die without a care in the world, even if just accountability for their negligence, is silly. Maybe they dont give a **** about the populace, but they have to give an appearance of trying to do their jobs.
Me Id just let everyone die.
Population control, stop climate change, more stuff for me. As long as I dont have to look at their faces or meet their families theyre just a number.

 

[Johnson]

You have to have your head in the sand to think the feds have tried to save lives the past 2 years

Do you really believe that nonsense or are you lying again?

 

[noenegdod]

I dont expect reason to take over. Youre a conspiracy theorist on this matter, to believe that thousands of medical professionals, scientists, goverment officials, and journalists, have fabricated these accounts for some reason and would present different information than what really happened, your reality is quite different from the rest of us.

Or maybe youre just one of those mental midgets who cant stand to be proven wrong so youve intentionally taken this obtuse position that our own individual beliefs on what constitutes "healthy" should be debated. That is ABSURD.

I never asked you to debate what the definition of health is. I asked you what your definition of health is. Which you gave below and shows why you and so many are so far off the mark on claiming that covid 19 kills healthy people.

And unscientific. For purposes of Covid 19, healthy means the victim had not been diagnosed with any of the following underlying health problems or fall into the specified risk groups.

The World Health Organization (W.H.O.) offers a simple definition of health as “a state of complete physical, mental, and social well-being, and not merely the absence of disease or infirmity”. “Social well-being” is an important aspect of this definition that may not always occur to us in thinking about our health.

which is from: https://www.canada.ca/en/public-hea...opulation-health-approach/what-is-health.html

From Oxford:

health
/helTH/
Learn to pronounce
noun
the state of being free from illness or injury.

You want to apply your own definition of "healthy" to discredit official govt health agency findings.

Nope, not my definitions.

The bar you have set for "health" is so low that unless you are walking into a cancer clinic you are deemed "healthy". The reason that:

Not MY claim, but that of the agencies of a number of countries, as also reported by endless numbers of media outlets.

Is happening is because people like the minister of health in Alberta:





are suffering from such severe cognitive dissonance that like every definition that is inconvenient and does not support the narrative they want to push, they simply change to suit their purposes.


No, it is not a pot meet kettle, I am here to actually try to have a conversation. Share what I know and learn what I dont. At present you just want to win because your ego demands it. This is why this is a useless waste of time.

 

[A.Justice]

The bar you have set for "health" is so low that unless you are walking into a cancer clinic you are deemed "healthy". The reason that:



Is happening is because people like the minister of health in Alberta:

View attachment 78284

View attachment 78285

Can we talk about the Secretary of health in the US? ?

 

[Hedges]

I think what is promoted is intended to save lives. That is, save more lives than it takes, for a significant net reduction in hospitalizations and deaths. That some people are harmed by the vaccine is unfortunate, but a greater number of lives are saved.

Once something is "policy", many people rally behind it regardless of evidence, and without understanding it themselves.

Other policies too. With people ordered to say home, of course they won't be able to pay rent. Therefore, a moratorium on evictions. The government must help them. As for mom-and-pop landlords? "They can get a loan from the bank."

And then there are the rules for reopening. Many notices must be posted. In Santa Clara County, businesses were fined because they had some but not all the required documents on their doors. A restaurant was fined because they played Latin music - music was permitted, but this music had lyrics, not allowed by the reopening rules.

Can we talk about the Secretary of health in the US? ?

It's a twofer! Secretary of health, also diversity/inclusion/gender dysmorphia

 

[noenegdod]

I think what is promoted is intended to save lives. That is, save more lives than it takes, for a significant net reduction in hospitalizations and deaths. That some people are harmed by the vaccine is unfortunate, but a greater number of lives are saved.

100%. The highway to hell is paved with good intentions.

Once something is "policy", many people rally behind it regardless of evidence, and without understanding it themselves.

Low information people that can parrot the "mainstream" narrative and sound smart with little to no effort. Gotta love 'em

Other policies too. With people ordered to say home, of course they won't be able to pay rent. Therefore, a moratorium on evictions. The government must help them. As for mom-and-pop landlords? "They can get a loan from the bank."

And then there are the rules for reopening. Many notices must be posted. In Santa Clara County, businesses were fined because they had some but not all the required documents on their doors. A restaurant was fined because they played Latin music - music was permitted, but this music had lyrics, not allowed by the reopening rules.

I feel so bad for anyone who put out the effort to try to make a better life just to have some arbitrary BS rules take it all away.

It's a twofer! Secretary of health, also diversity/inclusion/gender dysmorphia

That makes a lot of sense based on the "vibe" I got when I first saw that picture.......

 

[bradbill]

Can we talk about the Secretary of health in the US? ?

Assistant Secretary of HHS but why break your record of inaccurate statements.

And I guess not only are you a Qanon supporter, you are also a bigot?

 

[bradbill]

More thinning the herd:

California Deputy DA Who Fought Vaccine Mandate Dies Abruptly After Falling Ill With COVID at Age 46

via Facebook A deputy district attorney and up-and-coming Republican political star in California’s Orange County has died abruptly after telling friends she contracted COVID-19.Kelly Ernby, a presumed candidate for the state Assembly in 2022, was only 46 years old. According to the Los Angeles...

www.yahoo.com

 

[Batvette]

"does not support the narrative they want to push,"

"Low information people that can parrot the "mainstream" narrative"


Classic language of conspiracy theorists suffering from paranoid delusions. The authorities are all lying with an agenda, and everybody around you believes them because they arent as informed as you are.
Unlike you, the sheeple are all stupid and lack your high morals and intellect.
Everything is a narrative and everyone has an agenda. The professional views of tens of thousands of health care professionals should be discarded and you are one of the few who have it all figured out.



Are you a 9/11 conspiracy theorist too?

So I take it you havent been vaccinated?

 

[noenegdod]

"does not support the narrative they want to push,"

"Low information people that can parrot the "mainstream" narrative"


Classic language of conspiracy theorists suffering from paranoid delusions. The authorities are all lying with an agenda, and everybody around you believes them because they arent as informed as you are.
Unlike you, the sheeple are all stupid and lack your high morals and intellect.
Everything is a narrative and everyone has an agenda. The professional views of tens of thousands of health care professionals should be discarded and you are one of the few who have it all figured out.



Are you a 9/11 conspiracy theorist too?

So I take it you havent been vaccinated?

So instead of addressing the reply to you, in which you got your ass handed to you, you pivot away, ignore it and start building more strawmen so you can attempt to feed your ego some more.

 

[bradbill]

A Covid-19 survivor came out of a coma after 65 days. Now she supports vaccinations

By Christina Zdanowicz, CNN

www.erienewsnow.com

Arriaga Borges had previously been "against" vaccination, she said. When asked what her thinking behind that was, Arriaga Borges said she was healthy with no underlying health issues. She never smoked and had no heart or lung problems.[/]