Epever 4215AN charging dystrophy, and cutting out. Trials and possible solutions.

[12VoltInstalls]

Watched a few videos and read some online. This video in particular seems relevant. Other posts on diysolarforum come up now and again with similar issues and some Australian sites have mentioned this for years.
I’m starting to wonder if - other than the real water ingress issue with MC4s- if some of my multiple cable end and cable swap outs were not necessary because in spite of the water inside the connectors the cutout ‘feature’ has the same symptoms.

I have had the two 140Ah Btrpower batteries on my voltage-controlled 10A charger set at 14.5V for 48 hours. At some point between 26hrs and the 48 hours (I wasn’t here) the amps went to zero. Upon observing this when I got home I turned it up to 14.6 volts and it ran <2minutes rolling down from 8A to zero amps. Good I think.
12hrs later (this morning) they were sitting at 13.8V. Turning on the charger at 14.5V it ran for ~3 minutes starting at 7.x amps and diminishing to zero amps. >>>I am not certain 13.8V is good or not fwiw - I need to learn more.

I have a 200A (might be 300A) 12V Drok shunt to install on cable between a 2000W QZRELB aka ‘Reliable’ psw inverter and will connect my 12V loads at the inverter input cables (so as to capture all discharging loads). I plan to run these batteries down to whatever the untouchable factory BMS’s LVD is to measure capacity.
THAT will resolve that question.

Then I will reconnect the 4215AN with the Equalize set at 1 minute at 14.6V and both the boost/bulk and ‘float’ set to 14.55V
THIS should function properly according to the video posted above; then I will observe charging efficacy. Because if SCC output kWh is less than measured load kWh on good sun days and/or if I observe 10W of solar input (or worst case- have dead batteries) then I will know that the Epever has an irreconcilable intrinsic problem inherent to them. If the Epever does fail out (4215AN model) I will try with the 6420AN again to see if it duplicates the cutout.
If both Epevers fail out (I hope they don’t) everything Epever goes up for sale- some still New In Box.

My ‘radical’ interim solution if the Epevers aren’t redeemable is to order several powrMR 60A SCCs (or maybe Ampinvt) and probably save up some cash for future Victron. PowrMR 60A are only ~$90 and some video creators in the sector have positive opinions of the powerMR products (though mentioning their bottom-shelf status).

still hoping for further comments on this​

 

[sunsurfer]

If both Epevers fail out (I hope they don’t) everything Epever goes up for sale- some still New In Box.

​

I got to this point, learning about the problems with them. I considered the fact that tracking was to slow to catch extra light between clouds so I returned the ones that where returnable and gave away the rest of them. I don't have time to fiddle with issues, trying to work around problems. I am off grid and just need something that works.

I ended up buying Victron at a higher pricer and it was worth every penny. They are fast and I have had zero problems. They are a good option if you don't have the money for higher tier gear.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

They are a good option if you don't have the money for higher tier gear

I consider them higher tier gear. Victron I mean. The big-company brand names are also higher tier; more like boutique manufacturers imho. Victron is like a late model Cadillac versus a Bentley or Maserati. Every bit as good, just not boutique.

I’m still trying to figure out best-case settings but it’s generally all over the place what people think

LiFePo4 Charge drop after charging

Hello everyone! Sorry if this has been asked a thousand times before. I've been searching online and the forums and couldn't find my question or missed it. I have 16 brand new 280ah cells. When they arrived they were all 3.29v to 3.3v. I charged two sets of 8 in parallel that I will be making...

diysolarforum.com

And

https://diysolarforum.com/threads/b...5-000-10-000-cycles.34813/page-14#post-589726

which seems to fly in the face of the video I posted above which seems to indicate no harm will come.

 

[Vigilant24]

I consider them higher tier gear. Victron I mean. The big-company brand names are also higher tier; more like boutique manufacturers imho. Victron is like a late model Cadillac versus a Bentley or Maserati. Every bit as good, just not boutique.

I’m still trying to figure out best-case settings but it’s generally all over the place what people think

LiFePo4 Charge drop after charging

Hello everyone! Sorry if this has been asked a thousand times before. I've been searching online and the forums and couldn't find my question or missed it. I have 16 brand new 280ah cells. When they arrived they were all 3.29v to 3.3v. I charged two sets of 8 in parallel that I will be making...

diysolarforum.com

And

https://diysolarforum.com/threads/b...5-000-10-000-cycles.34813/page-14#post-589726

which seems to fly in the face of the video I posted above which seems to indicate no harm will come.

Did you decide on a way ahead (choose a different charge controller)? I have 4x100W panels I'll use for emergency backup of critical loads in my house. 12V system voltage (two 12V FLA in parallel). I was leaning toward the Epever 4215 (would probably wire panels 2P2S), but your troubles are giving me concerns. My system doesn't need super high efficiency on great days (sunny, cold), but it needs to work acceptably all the time, and it needs graceful failure modes. Victron isn't in my scope (price, a little too fancy with the cell phone interface). Right now I'm deciding between:
1) An inexpensive, no frills, but reliable 20-30A MPPT charge controller. I haven't found one yet. I wonder if this one might be okay: Amazon: Bateria 30A MPPT controller. About 80 bucks
2) Two 10A to 15A PWM controllers. Wire two panels in parallel into each one. Yes, I'd lose some efficiency, but if I've got two 100W panels parallel wired into each one, I'm not sure the hit will be a lot. PWM isn't fancy, isn't likely to have software issues, etc.

"Failure tolerance" of the two options is a lot different. If anything happens to the MPPT controller in Option 1 (blown capacitor, etc), I'm totally out of business. With the two PWM controllers, if one fails entirely I've still got 50% charge capacity with the remaining one. And, if I rewire my batteries to >charge< in 24V mode, I can still use that remaining controller at 10A x 24V = 240W into the battery pack. Or, with, money saved by not buying the MPPT controller, buy another cheapie PWM controller to have a spare.

Anyway, if you've found a simple, no-frills, apparently reliable 30A MPPT controller for less than $100 U.S., please let me know.

Thanks for the thread.

Mark

 

[12VoltInstalls]

Did you decide on a way ahead (choose a different charge controller)?

Yes. And no.

I’ve been busy on other people’s stuff, and recoated my camper and office trailer roof the last couple days. I have not connected the new arrangement yet and tested.

The FLA batteries are weakened acid and aren’t in ‘equalize’ so it hasn’t done its Epever cutout ‘thing’ that I’ve noticed.
I grid charged the two batteries at a low rate for several days so I don’t want to online them again until I have the shunt installed- and I will be offlining the 1012LV-MK (which charges the LiFePo’s fine) and going back to the QZRELB 2000W psw or a Giandel psw. I ordered and received a BlueSea 300A A/B/AB/off battery switch to install as well but not for batteries: the other way around. It’s for inverters.

ANSWER:
If the Epever 4215AN freaks out again I am going to retry the 6420AN and if that fails I am ordering two PowrMR 80A SCC’s. They’re a reasonable calculated risk after researching this a lot imho.

Longer term is perhaps two Ampinvt or Victron.
The reason for two Ampinvt or PowrMR is to have backup on hand in case of failure.

I have a perfectly good windyNation p30L pwm and a RichSolar pwm on hand but I’m not going there.

If you have the time to wait for me to do my ‘test’ I’ll have an answer or figure it out.

 

[Vigilant24]

If you have the time to wait for me to do my ‘test’ I’ll have an answer or figure it out.

Well, don't do anything different because of me, but I'll be interested in what you find and which way you go. I was >hoping< that because my planned system was smaller and more primitive than your present equipment that I might not have the same issues you're having (4 x 100W panels, I have just two 100AH 12V FLAs (so no BMS issue) and I was just planning on using the 3210AN). But, after re-reading your similar problems with Epever controllers on lead acid batteries and pollenface's (post 9) Epever voltage spiking/inverter high voltage cutoff problems, it seems like a good chance I could experience similar problems. I have two 10A PWM charge controllers already, so I could charge in a pinch without buying an MPPT controller at all. Still, I'll keep an eye on your progress/decisions and decide if getting an MPPT controller for my small, backup only system seems to make sense. Heck, for $100 spent on a low-end MPPT SCC I could instead buy another 100W panel and a cheap 10A PWM controller for it and probably have more failure redundancy and more watt-hours per day of collection/storage.
Thanks again.

Mark

 

[12VoltInstalls]

I have just two 100AH 12V FLAs

The issue I had with fla was the 4210AN would constantly cut out and reset when equalizing. That is an issue.
With the current LiFePo’s there’s no equalize but once “full” voltage is achieved (which isn’t necessarily fully charged) it drops the amps to nothing and doesn’t work properly again unless I cycle off the panels or it goes overnight.

With fla you set HVD really high and do equalize too low with a lowered bulk setting and function fine is what I concluded. It was apparent bar 600W and troublesome when I went 800W.

I’ll update but it might be a while - it’s going to rain until next Saturday so ain’t no high voltage Solar happening anyways

 

[sunsurfer]

........ it drops the amps to nothing and doesn’t work properly again unless I cycle off the panels or it goes overnight.

This has been documented and lightly discussed. There is a video link in the thread below and in the comments someone mentions using a diode in the output to fix the issue. I have not confirmed this.

14v low light EPEVER software bug or back feed issue?

I have been running 5 strings of panels with 5 EPEVER Tracer BN 40a controllers. I noticed sometimes a string or two will stick at a low voltage and low current even though its in full sun. If I cover the panels, disconnect them and then reconnect it will track back to where it is expected...

diysolarforum.com

 

[Vigilant24]

The issue I had with fla was the 4210AN would constantly cut out and reset when equalizing. That is an issue.
With the current LiFePo’s there’s no equalize but once “full” voltage is achieved (which isn’t necessarily fully charged) it drops the amps to nothing and doesn’t work properly again unless I cycle off the panels or it goes overnight.

With fla you set HVD really high and do equalize too low with a lowered bulk setting and function fine is what I concluded. It was apparent bar 600W and troublesome when I went 800W.

Hmmm. In my project (solar panels, SCC, cables, etc all boxed up for deployment if needed, FLA batteries kept healthy on grid power), the equalization "glitch" of the 4210AN wouldn't be much of a headache. I'll be equalizing the batteries using grid power and a smart charger, if I ever need to equalize them using solar (unlikely), I can use your work-around method.

........ it drops the amps to nothing and doesn’t work properly again unless I cycle off the panels or it goes overnight.

This has been documented and lightly discussed. There is a video link in the thread below and in the comments someone mentions using a diode in the output to fix the issue. I have not confirmed this.

14v low light EPEVER software bug or back feed issue?

I have been running 5 strings of panels with 5 EPEVER Tracer BN 40a controllers. I noticed sometimes a string or two will stick at a low voltage and low current even though its in full sun. If I cover the panels, disconnect them and then reconnect it will track back to where it is expected...

diysolarforum.com

This glitch might be more of a problem. It's crazy that a person might have to keep watch on the thing and disconnect/reconnect the panels to get the controller to re-appraise the situation. I guess I could roll the dice and buy the 4210AN--Only 1 of sunsurfer's 5 controllers misbehaved, I might get a good one. Or, if this is caused by having panels in series and higher voltages, in my case my panels won't be far from the controller, so running all 4 in parallel wouldn't be a "costly cable" problem (so, maybe 21 Voc and 20A from the PV measured at the controller). Or, if (as sunsurfer has hypothesized) this only happens when multiple controllers are run in parallel, then I might not be susceptible to this problem at all if running just one controller.

The Epevers are popular, it would seem if this "gets stuck at low amperage and never recalculates" issue was common that there would be a lot of fuss about it. It's good to know it happens, though, so if I buy a 4210AN (or 3210AN) I'll know what to look for. If I buy a less popular controller (PowMR, etc), it would still be a roll of the dice, and the "glitches" are less likely to be as widely documented.
Thanks again, I'll keep watching and learning from you guys.

Mark

 

[sunsurfer]

The Epevers are popular, it would seem if this "gets stuck at low amperage and never recalculates" issue was common that there would be a lot of fuss about it. It's good to know it happens, though, so if I buy a 4210AN (or 3210AN) I'll know what to look for. If I buy a less popular controller (PowMR, etc), it would still be a roll of the dice, and the "glitches" are less likely to be as widely documented.
Thanks again, I'll keep watching and learning from you guys.

Mark

3 out of 5 I used had the issue. All ran in parallel. I ran one by itself on a 24v setup and it did it every day. Even without this issue, I was disappointed in the performance. A cloud would pass and they would miss the sun light. By the time it tracked, a cloud would be back. Perhaps it did captured the sun but the displayed did not show it? I never checked with a meter directly. I just ditched them and went Victron. I don't have enough free time to play with cheap SCCs. I also am off-grid and need something more solid and reliable power.

 

[Vigilant24]

3 out of 5 I used had the issue. All ran in parallel. I ran one by itself on a 24v setup and it did it every day. Even without this issue, I was disappointed in the performance. A cloud would pass and they would miss the sun light. By the time it tracked, a cloud would be back. Perhaps it did captured the sun but the displayed did not show it? I never checked with a meter directly. I just ditched them and went Victron. I don't have enough free time to play with cheap SCCs. I also am off-grid and need something more solid and reliable power.

Thanks for the additional details. It just seems strange--they sell a lot of these, they get good reviews, yet there are also plenty of reports like this, too. I'd understand anomalies due to "edge" cases (parallel SCCs, very high system or PV voltages, etc), but the problems apparently aren't isolated to these situations.
For my "just in case" system, a Victron SCC just isn't in the cards. I can sure see the rationale if we were talking about my everyday electrical power.
12VoltInstalls, I'm not seeing a lot of love for the low amp PowMR SCCs ("POW-Keeper"grey and orange case, no fan). The rough/incomplete manual is a common source of frustration. OTOH, the user reviews for the older metal-cased 60A units (with fan--{maybe eliminated in current models?), overal similar to the "MakeSkyBlue") seem more positive. The documentation may be a bit better, though it sounds like the display is still a bit "unintuitive". I can see a user might wind up adding a bunch of stickers with the fault codes, etc to the cover.

Rant: It just wouldn't seem very difficult to build a good, simple MPPT SCC. I understand the need to cut hardware costs, but the operations themselves would seem within the scope of an Arduino and some not very complex Python code.

Thanks again.

​

 

[12VoltInstalls]

not seeing a lot of love for the low amp PowMR

60A has a fan
That’s the one I’m referring to. Success rate with YouTube hobbiest pro’s and others on this forum don’t give it high quality scores but say it works ok except maybe not overpaneled; but it has the VOC headroom to not matter.

Be me: need two? Buy three. Need one? Buy two.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

For my "just in case" system, a Victron SCC just isn't in the cards. I can sure see the rationale if we were talking about my everyday electrical power.
12VoltInstalls, I'm not seeing a lot of love for the low amp PowMR SCCs ("POW-Keeper"grey and orange case, no fan)

Well, geeze louise!!!
This just in….

It’s plenty heavy - not ‘very’ heavy but ‘form factor’ is very small for its weight for 60A.

But I see it is unfinished aluminum with a fan:

 

[Jazzmonger]

FWIW, You are living my nightmare. I'm seeing the exact same thing, although I'm using 2 8D flooded cells, not lithium's. My EPEVER tracer 60A will charge @20A or so for 20-30 seconds and then just shut down for no apparent reason, then start back up charging again a couple mins later. And cycle like that continuously. Wiring is good, voltages test fine at the SCC, batteries are brand new, I have 800W of panels and this is a replacement EPEVER unit I just installed.

I'm about ready to list it on eBay and look for another SCC.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

seeing the exact same thing

Try putting HV limit at ~16.1V with:
Float 13.8
Boost/bulk 14.2
disable equalize for now but set for 14.6

Let us know if that helps. Spreading the HV point from boost sorta mitigated some of my issues when I was lead acid. Didn’t fix it

 

[Kiwi2000]

I have two separate lifepo4 battery banks at my place with 4 Epever SCC'. (2 strings on each bank)

I did notice those occasional days when a SCC just couldn't be bothered putting watts into a 80% SOC battery when there was full sun in the sky.

I have independent bluetooth voltage recording and logging devices on both battery banks to help me to problem solve the issue. So things I have learnt...

The voltage that the Epever SCC sees isn't an accurate indication of battery voltage.

Turning a decent load on from the inverter would trigger the SCC to wake up an start dumping all available watts from the panels into the battery bank.

I continued to monitor things and tweak settings in order to get the SCCs to always reliably put available watts from the panels into the batteries until they reached my voltage set point.

What helped the most was bringing float and boost reconnect up much closer to the boost voltage setting.

Like now for example one bank is set on...

Boost Charge: 13.8

Float Charge: 13.7

Boost Reconnect: 13.6

It has been running this way reliably for months now and is always putting available sunlight when it possibly can into a less than full battery.

 

[sunsurfer]

I have two separate lifepo4 battery banks at my place with 4 Epever SCC'. (2 strings on each bank)

I did notice those occasional days when a SCC just couldn't be bothered putting watts into a 80% SOC battery when there was full sun in the sky.

I have independent bluetooth voltage recording and logging devices on both battery banks to help me to problem solve the issue. So things I have learnt...

The voltage that the Epever SCC sees isn't an accurate indication of battery voltage.

Turning a decent load on from the inverter would trigger the SCC to wake up an start dumping all available watts from the panels into the battery bank.

I continued to monitor things and tweak settings in order to get the SCCs to always reliably put available watts from the panels into the batteries until they reached my voltage set point.

What helped the most was bringing float and boost reconnect up much closer to the boost voltage setting.

Like now for example one bank is set on...

Boost Charge: 13.8

Float Charge: 13.7

Boost Reconnect: 13.6

It has been running this way reliably for months now and is always putting available sunlight when it possibly can into a less than full battery.

Shouldn't have to "tweek" a charge controller to get around bugs. I went from epever to epNEVER last year. So glad I made the switch.

 

[Kiwi2000]

3) Because I am going to add in the six 320W panels over a 6420AN - which is way overpaneled- at some point soon I’m thinking about C-rate again.

That strikes me as very over panelled for the 60 amp SCC unit. I would only put 1200 watts of PV into that myself on a 13 volt system.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

That strikes me as very over panelled for the 60 amp SCC unit. I would only put 1200 watts of PV into that myself on a 13 volt system.

Yes. You are correct.
But I’m not trying to harvest the full panel potential (I don’t need it) I’m trying to exceed my daily kWh needs November to March by having way more solar panel wattage than “necessary” so the many 10% solar days might give me “just enough.” Plus, in winter they will be vertical to eliminate cleaning snow off them- that has a wattage consequence, too.

But thank you for being thoughtful to respond.