diy solar

diy solar

Hi, first post. Can anyone recommend a budget 3kw inverter/charger to run 2 fridges. Petrol $4.50 per lt. Generator is now to expensive to run for 8hr

Can someone explain?
Based on the hurdles and dissatisfactions that you keep running into trying to force use of an AIO, maybe its time to start specing a standalone inverter and a standalone charge controller. I suspect you'll find your costs more agreeable.
 
Customers need the inverter wattage to run loads. Maybe you want to use a hair dryer for 15 minutes, or a power tool.

PV input needs to recharge the battery. 780W PV x 5.5 effective hours sun per day = 4290 kWh/day
Batteries are the most expensive part. And the bulkiest, and the heaviest. How many kWh in the AIO?

They need to design a package that will sell and is economical. Certainly could have put in 2x as much SCC.
It is a one-size-fits-all product. Beyond that, design your own. Does it give access to the battery? If you have additional panels you could attach an SCC.

Back to battery size - most batteries & BMS we see, max charge current is half as much as max discharge current.
If your AIO has 3000W inverter and 1500W SCC, maybe it has 3000 Wh of batteries. So discharge at 1.0C and charge at 0.5C, max allowed.
 
Thanks Hedges. Will update in 5 weeks upon return. Growatt are now offering: Growatt 3.5KW/5KW Hybrid Off grid Solar Inverter 48V battery MPPT 80A 100A, 5kw for $1400 delivered. 5/10 year warranty.
Will see how the upower3000 m6322 24V $997 2 year warranty goes. Always something better but still trying to run a fridge and chest frezzer at the lowest cost,
so far
2 x fullriver 100A batteries 3 months old $400
4 x 400w Hyundai panels including rail system $1500
Upower 3000 $997
Cables, fuess, circuit breakers, ground stakes, shipping $ 390
Total $3287
 
Just add a decimal place and you've got my system.
(recent purchases, not including what I first installed 18 years ago.)

Normally battery would cost as much as everything else for an off-grid system.
Your battery is a fraction of total cost. Enough PV to recharge in 1.5 hours, but battery wouldn't like that.
Regulating charge current to optimum level, keeping batteries cool, using only 15% or so of capacity most nights, might get 10 years out of them.
Make hay while the sun shines.
 
Hedges, you have been so valuable in my decisions so far.

You posted
Your battery is a fraction of total cost. Enough PV to recharge in 1.5 hours, but battery wouldn't like that.
Regulating charge current to optimum level, keeping batteries cool, using only 15% or so of capacity most nights, might get 10 years out of them.
Make hay while the sun shines.

10 years would be amazing, this is what I am after and why I joined this forum.

This is where I get confused. You mention 1.0C and charge at 0.5C in your previous posts to optimise the battery? Could you please look at the data sheet attached and let me know where you would change their specs so I can get 10 years out of my battery.

The new unit charges at 30A solar and 60A utility. Batteries max charge is 25A.
As you suggested I should change this to preserve my battery life.

Please have a read of the programming manual.

Thanks so much as without you I would have not been able to design my system.?
 

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Many lithium batteries have specs for max continuous discharge and charge of 1.0C (1 hour to discharge) and 0.5C (2 hours to charge), and allow brief surge higher. I've seen tables for charge current that taper down to zero at 0 degrees C and at a hot temperature. I would imagine AIO are sized to not exceed allowed battery charge and discharge capability.

Lead acid has higher internal resistance, but can still deliver high surge currents (e.g. 10C when starting a car) and good steady-state discharge, but needs to be charged more slowly.

FLA may be optimum around 0.12C charge rate. Shouldn't be too low; needs current to stir electrolyte.
My AGM want 0.2C, may be different from most.

Besides charge rate, lead-acid needs correct CC bulk charge, CV absorption for a period of hours, CV float.
Different batteries have different required voltage to get fully charged. If not charged completely, or if left undercharged for an extended time, they degrade. They also don't want to be too hot. But they are fine in the cold, just need voltage vs. temperature adjustment.

The other thing that affects life is number of cycles to a depth of discharge. Shallower DoD gets more cycles. Not significantly more kWh of lifetime cycling, just larger number of cycles so more years. Except, over about 80% DoD for this battery, you get less total kWh. See chart on last page of technical manual. If you spend twice as much for twice the capacity and half the DoD, it lasts twice as long, until it reaches ~ 10 year float life.


So that says it is cheaper to wear the battery out fast and replace, less time-value of money. Although, replacements may or may not go up in price faster than inflation, get banned by the "green" crowd, manufacturer may get bought by a holding company and purged of expensive workers who know the recipe for quality.

You can make it last longer by using it less. Operate loads on surplus PV while charging/floating battery rather than discharging. Disable loads at night. Have it work like a starting battery, brief burst of current to start motors, then load carried by PV.

My SMA Sunny Island has a reputation for maintaining lead-acid batteries well. Default configuration allows 0.55C but if I followed the manual and put in 100 Ah (at 48V to ~ 60V fully charged) of battery per 1kW of PV, charge rate would be no higher than 0.17C. Because I only installed 40% as much battery, when I discovered that default setting I reduced it to 0.2C. That leaves 60% of PV to power loads or be curtailed.


Your manual describes "inverter priority" which uses PV and battery to supply power down to battery low-voltage disconnect, then switches to utility.
"utility priority" draws from utility when available, then switches to PV and battery.
What I would want but don't see is for PV to be used to the extent it is available, drawing any additional power needed from utility. Only draw down battery if utility is unavailable and PV is sufficient.

Cycling battery even when utility is available will shorten its life. Battery probably costs $0.50/kWh of cycle life, more than just buying from utility.
People with lithium battery may want to cycle battery in order to avoid using utility, because it can cycle thousands of times (although commercial batteries may be too expensive for that to be cost effective. DIY batteries may make sense to do that.)

Hmm, maybe "AON - Auxiliary module ON voltage" and "AOF" come close. With "Solar Priority", battery charging by utility kicks on and off at those two voltages. "Micro cycling" of battery rather than deeper cycling, which would only occur when utility unavailable.
Not ideal, but could help.

Looks like "input" and "output" can each be "solar priority" or "utility "priority", so several choices.
What would be ideal is to hold battery at float while utility is up and use all available PV to power loads, but don't think it can do that.

You'll have to study the manual carefully to select best configuration.
And read battery manual to get charging parameters that need to be set in inverter. Different brand & model Lead-acid batteries are similar to each other, but each has specific voltages and temperature compensation coefficient due to chemistry differences.

And try to turn off loads at night. Inverter has an auxiliary switch which could be used to disable loads when battery isn't near full.
 
Could someone please recommend a all in one charger inverter to run a fridge and a chest freezer. Also how may batteries ( have 2 x fullriver dc105-2 100ah each) total solar panel wattage, 1/2 cut cells or Hyundai shingled, 12, 24 or 48v as researching this takes me round in circles. Appreciate all thoughts.

I like the look of these: 24V 3000W EPever Upower All In One Combined 3Kw Inverter 100A MPPT 450VOC - UP3000-HM10022

I would do an energy audit of your loads with as plug adapter energy monitor and then you can scale your PV input and battery bank to the load...

Good luck.
 
Now they mainly donate the used panels for a nominal amount to some charity that sends containers full off to a poor third world country like Kansas.
I'd like to upgrade my array, is it possible for Wyoming to get in on this?
 
I'd like to upgrade my array, is it possible for Wyoming to get in on this?
Try ringing around to installers. They may be doing an upgrade and if you can collect direct it may save them the cost of disposal. 2nd hand panels have no value.The $80 I see paid means a big mark-up for the middle men and a rip off if they are used Australian panels originally donated to a Pacific Nation....a poor one.

Any upgrades to a solar farms in your area?

The going rate for new pv is $0.25US/w exChina. I may be able to get something like this price for slightly marked panels from the Importer/Installer where I pick up the odd used panel. Wyoming may be too far from the coast for actual importers but will give you some ideas....when you are not electrocuting your cat!
 
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