Ive just has a Lion fire

[Daddy Tanuki]

i think there is a lot of fear going around for no reason. if you buy quality items you will not have any issues. all of us have tons of rechargeable items in a multitude of chemistries. avoid buying stuff like this form alibaba or ebay and concentrate on buying from reputable vendors and manufactures then you will have nothing to worry about.

 

[cs1234]

You have to take the precautions you are comfortable with. Don't give it extra fuel by leaving it in a pile of flammable junk. To be really safe would have to keep them in a detached structure when not in use. Outdoor shed would be ideal. Just like some are building detached powerhouses or power trailers.

Keep them Separately in detached structureS. If you keep them all in the same structure, they will ignite each other.

 

[SparkyJJO]

My Li-ion Makita batteries sit in my basement in the tool bag. Sometimes they have spent a few days in the garage by accident, both in freezing temps or stupid hot. They didn't blow up, and they still work, 10+ years old too.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

My Li-ion Makita batteries sit in my basement in the tool bag. Sometimes they have spent a few days in the garage by accident, both in freezing temps or stupid hot. They didn't blow up, and they still work, 10+ years old too.

quality always speaks for itself.

 

[WorldwideDave]

So many British expressions in this thread. Not British so had to look some up. Like what a Charlie is.

 

[IGBT]

So many British expressions in this thread. Not British so had to look some up. Like what a Charlie is.

They always sound so polite too when they are mad. Calling people a "tosser". I can just imagine them really upset with a cuppa in the other hand.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

So many British expressions in this thread. Not British so had to look some up. Like what a Charlie is.

The slang Charlie in the context of this thread I would think is American, the slang "Charlie" widely used in Britain refers to a certain export from Colombia that Pablo Escobar was widely famous for.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

They always sound so polite too when they are mad. Calling people a "tosser". I can just imagine them really upset with a cuppa in the other hand.

Depends totally on what part of Britain case and point.

 

[SeaGal]

So many British expressions in this thread. Not British so had to look some up.

Well then... Bob's your uncle

 

[ThaiTaffy]

Well then... Bob's your uncle

Lovely jubbly

 

[kolek]

I've been doing a few hours of research on "solutions" and the 2 best ideas I've seen on safe charging and storing:

1. Building a concrete bunker out of cinder blocks:
There's a YT video entitled: "Build a LIPO Battery Bunker for Under $10"
another one, same idea, entitled "Flite Test - Lipo Battery Bunker"
and yet another, entitled: "DIY LiPo Bunker + Tested - NEW VERSION - Super Cheap and Easy - Charging your LiPo battery safely"

2. Another popular option is using metal ammo cases for storing & charging, just remember to remove the rubber gasket / seal on the lids.

Perhaps the best idea that isn't too expensive would be to combine the above 2 ideas.
Also it's good to have smoke detectors on whatever you use for storage/charging, and bags of sand handy to dump on top of any fire that might develop, sand is good for extinguishing these fires.

Either way, you're not getting around the fact that a ton of toxic smoke will be generated if you have a significant fire.

 

[WorldwideDave]

that's what I don't understand...are they safe, or not? Is it just the large DIY batteries that fry, and the cheapest of the cheap chinese ones that burn up a house, or is it also quality ones recommended here? I ask because I see so many - especially on that latest thread - where people just have them in basements next to an all-in-one or similar. Are the fires usually because of batteries, fuses, all-in-ones, SCC, buss bars, or ?

No way we are building a cinder block bunker for batteries for $10. That's clickbait if I've ever heard it. They are cheap, but not THAT cheap.

They have a saying in my area of mexico...cinder block, rebar, and concrete don't burn. They use this when explaining the shoddy home residential electrical wiring that most houses - even the newest of construction - have. Don't get me started on the styrofoam they use for flooring on multi-story buildings.

 

[Crowz]

What we need to start doing is installing boxes like the military has for firearms when you enter a restricted area. All lion screwdrivers and drills go into the fireproof box on the wall when you enter the workshop area when not in use

I phased out all of the lion stuff and I'm all lifepo batteries now for my tools.

90% of my stuff is milwaukee with some black and decker and greenworks.

 

[WorldwideDave]

okay so Lithium Ion = bad; LiFePO4 good - as in sleep on top of it if you want, it is that safe?

 

[IGBT]

okay so Lithium Ion = bad; LiFePO4 good - as in sleep on top of it if you want, it is that safe?

Hope so. We are sleeping 6 inches above 10.24kwh of LiFePO4 on our sailboat.

 

[Bananaman321]

What we need to start doing is installing boxes like the military has for firearms when you enter a restricted area. All lion screwdrivers and drills go into the fireproof box on the wall when you enter the workshop area when not in use

I phased out all of the lion stuff and I'm all lifepo batteries now for my tools.

90% of my stuff is milwaukee with some black and decker and greenworks.

Yes I agree Lions should be locked in cages you never know when they're going to overreact for no apparent reason

With regular exercise and feeding Lions tend to behave in a positive manner

Perhaps you are guilty of mistreating your Lion Lions have feelings to

If your Lion has been mistreated possibly seek a support group to help reduce the risk of burns from spontaneous Lion combustion.

 

[kolek]

i think there is a lot of fear going around for no reason. if you buy quality items you will not have any issues. all of us have tons of rechargeable items in a multitude of chemistries. avoid buying stuff like this form alibaba or ebay and concentrate on buying from reputable vendors and manufactures then you will have nothing to worry about.

I generally agree with my favorite Tanuki on Mt. Fuji but this time I have to respectfully disagree.
It's not just the batteries you buy to power your devices, it's the crap batteries that come INSIDE the devices you buy that you have no control over.

I'll bet pretty much everyone here has at least 20 items their homes with crappy lipo batteries inside them that they have given no thought to. In our house we have a pile of devices that use these lipo batteries. Laptops, mobile phones, tablets, flashlights, power tools, various sensors and cameras, optical devices, audio devices, mobile radios, the list goes on and on.

Are you tearing open your laptop battery to verify the cells inside are genuine Panasonic? Didn't think so.

If you haven't had a fire yet, it's just because your lucky number hasn't come up yet, not because you're a genius choosing high quality. We're all tempting fate to a degree.

And "quality" in this product category is over-rated. Case in point:

21 injured after Mercedes EV explodes in parking lot

A Mercedes-Benz EV exploded in an underground parking lot at an apartment complex in Incheon, sending 16 people to the hospital with non-life-threatening injuries.

koreajoongangdaily.joins.com

 

[robbob2112]

Yall are all bonkers. OP had a cheap lion device that spontaniously combusted. Fortunately he was present and I assume got it out of the house.

I can't see any genuine tool batteries doing the same. There is a risk buying the cheap no-name batteries, not what the OP did. But he did buy a cheap tool from ebay or questionable parentage and history.

So, I think the takeaway from all of this is buy quality and sleep at night. Buy questionable junk and anything can happen. Sometimes it doesn't pay to be cheap

 

[ShirBlackspots]

okay so Lithium Ion = bad; LiFePO4 good - as in sleep on top of it if you want, it is that safe?

Li-Ion is good too, as long as it isn't some random cheap brand from China. Panasonic, LG, CATL, BYD, EVE, Samsung, BAK are good names.

I built a 13S10P battery out of BAK 21700 5Ah Li-Ion batteries, I've pulled a 30A load on the battery, and it never got the tiniest bit warm. The warmest I've seen the temps on the battery when it was charging at 20A was 35C after about 2 hours of charging.

My DeWalt tools use the Samsung 50S 21700's, these have a maximum 50A draw. I got bored one night and used my drill with an old t-shirt in a sort of helicopter. It overheated the batteries. I disassembled the pack and found that abuse caused about three to go dead, basically open circuit. No smoke whatsoever. The pack was just hot. That was also an expensive mistake, too. The 20V, 10Ah packs from DeWalt are $200.

 

[Supervstech]

This is where you should be using your test equipment go buy another one and figure out why it went up in flames.
I have lots of li-ion devices made in china normally stored poorly in extreme heat and I'm yet to see a fire yet but a product "made in Britain" has spontaneously burst into flames seems like something that should be investigated.

 

[robbob2112]

Li-Ion is good too, as long as it isn't some random cheap brand from China. Panasonic, LG, CATL, BYD, EVE, Samsung, BAK are good names.

I built a 13S10P battery out of BAK 21700 5Ah Li-Ion batteries, I've pulled a 30A load on the battery, and it never got the tiniest bit warm. The warmest I've seen the temps on the battery when it was charging at 20A was 35C after about 2 hours of charging.

My DeWalt tools use the Samsung 50S 21700's, these have a maximum 50A draw. I got bored one night and used my drill with an old t-shirt in a sort of helicopter. It overheated the batteries. I disassembled the pack and found that abuse caused about three to go dead, basically open circuit. No smoke whatsoever. The pack was just hot. That was also an expensive mistake, too. The 20V, 10Ah packs from DeWalt are $200.

I am actually a little surprised by that. On my old NiCad dewalt packs they would shutdown when overheated and work fine later. The Milwaukee packs all say they have overtemp shutdown on them. Well, except the M4 but it hardly qualifies as a pack. I would have assumed Dewalt was the same.

Used to love Dewalt until the same vendor that does black and decker and all the cheap tools bought them. They may be assembled to a higher quality spec but I never had any issues before the tools I bought after that.

 

[ShirBlackspots]

I am actually a little surprised by that. On my old NiCad dewalt packs they would shutdown when overheated and work fine later. The Milwaukee packs all say they have overtemp shutdown on them. Well, except the M4 but it hardly qualifies as a pack. I would have assumed Dewalt was the same.

Used to love Dewalt until the same vendor that does black and decker and all the cheap tools bought them. They may be assembled to a higher quality spec but I never had any issues before the tools I bought after that.

Yeah, the charger wouldn't charge the pack after it cooled down. I already had a 4 slot battery charger that'll charge AA's to 26500's, so I decided to disassemble the pack. 2 batteries were completely dead, the 4 slot charger didn't even see them. Two other batteries had reduced capacity (3100mAh and 3600mAh, these two are recognized but won't take a charge now a year later). The other 6 batteries are still good and at full capacity.

Now, the DeWalt tools will shut off if overloaded (apparently that shirt wasn't enough of an overload), but I believe the batteries themselves don't have overload or overtemp protection. The also don't fully discharge (0-25% is maybe 16V (these packs are 5S2P, so 21V x 10Ah)

 

[realpinochet]

How many of you are still scared to put lifepo4 batteries in you house still? I know there's a difference in chemistry but I still see time from time the lifepo4 batteries having issues. I'm really wanting to build a shed for the batteries but money is tight and sheds are costly.

Side note..wonder how the sodium ion batteries will perform compared to lithium batteries...they are suppose to be much more stable. I see seplos carrying cells. Maybe they start building solutions soon like their rack batteries.

Sodium ion Battery Supplier - Seplos Technology

Seplos Technology specializes in providing top-notch Sodium ion Battery to our customers. Our team of experts is dedicated to delivering high quality home energy storage . Contact us today for a free quote.

www.seplos.com

 

[SparkyJJO]

How many of you are still scared to put lifepo4 batteries in you house still? I know there's a difference in chemistry but I still see time from time the lifepo4 batteries having issues. I'm really wanting to build a shed for the batteries but money is tight and sheds are costly.

Side note..wonder how the sodium ion batteries will perform compared to lithium batteries...they are suppose to be much more stable. I see seplos carrying cells. Maybe they start building solutions soon like their rack batteries.

Sodium ion Battery Supplier - Seplos Technology

Seplos Technology specializes in providing top-notch Sodium ion Battery to our customers. Our team of experts is dedicated to delivering high quality home energy storage . Contact us today for a free quote.

www.seplos.com

I'm still fully intending to build mine into the basement where I planned to. I readjusted slightly and am sticking them in a metal enclosure instead of a wood ended frame, and to that point my project has stalled yet again due to life, but that's the goal.

Unlike some of these other horror stories I'm using a class T fuse on every pack, plus I have a MCCB on each one rated for another 25kA AIC, so between the class T and that breaker I should have no problem with arcing anywhere.

 

[realpinochet]

I'm still fully intending to build mine into the basement where I planned to. I readjusted slightly and am sticking them in a metal enclosure instead of a wood ended frame, and to that point my project has stalled yet again due to life, but that's the goal.

Unlike some of these other horror stories I'm using a class T fuse on every pack, plus I have a MCCB on each one rated for another 25kA AIC, so between the class T and that breaker I should have no problem with arcing anywhere.

So, you're using the rack style then? I guess you can't put a fuse on each cell (pack) on the large wall mounted batteries that are sealed. I was wondering about cement board. Basement is where you're going to install, would you vent this so if something happened the gasses won't fill up the home?