Military 6x6 Expansible Van project

[barnyardweeds]

Yes, this is overkill but it serves multiple purposes. This M934-A2 6x6 Expansible Van came into my life as a promotional vehicle for a larger project. This truck is traveling cross country from Ogden Utah to Avon CT on a live streamed tour . The three seater configuration is being expanded (https://www.planbsupply.com/6x6-expandable-box-trucks ) into a crew cab and there are plans for significant electrical upgrades with the idea of creating a four season camper with redundant heat and electrical systems for the purpose of demonstrating backup systems in different on-grid, near off-grid and totally off grid environments. Help is needed is creating a solar system with battery backup that can survive the harsher winter environment. The roof of the rear box is 17' long and 8' wide. There are 4' slide outs on both sides that add considerable room for additional solar panels that could be hinged to fold over onto the main box and then deployed over the slide outs to keep room on the roof as an observation deck and tent platform. Does anyone have experience with "ultra capacitors" that can be deployed perhaps in a daisy chain for another type of short term back up? Lots of possibilities with this vehicle, and I anticipate talking expensively on our upcoming YouTube channel. We are looking to showcase both custom and off the shelf solutions. Share your thoughts.
Peter G

 

[BoloMKXXVIII]

The problem with hinging the solar panels (beyond possible breakage) is that they will only produce when you are stopped and have the slide outs deployed. You would do better with something like drawer slides so that the solar panels can produce power in the retracted position and in the deployed position.

 

[JeepHammer]

I AM SO JEALOUS!

Oh my you have so many possibilities!
That's probably a 24 volt system with a BIG honkin' alternator, and big battery box capacity, and more battery boxes are simply a bolt on.
Plenty of room to add an isolated alternator to charge everything when engine runs.

Outside climate control, go with lead/acid batteries.
LiFePo4 doesn't much care for temps approaching freezing, while an insulated battery box lead/acid won't have issues.
Inside the climate control, the LiFePo4 batteries are MUCH safer and no corrosion/acid/explosive gas issues.

Capacitors have an issue with charge density, the amount of power they can store for their size/weight.
They work OK for some quick release 'Boost' power, but for storage they have issues.
The caps that will hold a reasonable charge are stupid expensive.
Not really large scale cost viable, and not something a DIY'er wants to tackle.

With small square footage (roof) the most productive solar panels you can lay hands on for fitting the roof.
Pay attention to size, it's the productive sq.ft. that matters, odd sized, non-panel covered roof produces nothing.

An extra row of solar panels hinged off the side isn't a bad idea, I've done it myself with display trailers.
A full side wall isn't practical, and I can tell you why,
Road damage, weight, vandalism, etc.
Hinged off the roof keeps them up away from road rocks/trash, out of common sight line and idiot 'Punch' range.

Build the frame so the panels sit in the frame (flush) instead of on top the frame (stacked).
Cuts wind resistance and the frames protect the panel edges.

Be sure to diode isolate panel strings so the shaded strings won't drag down panels in sunlight.

Insulation before all else, insulate and seal up all air leaks.

Espar heater on diesel fuel when you want LOTS of heat on low electric consumption.
Works without engine running, a crap load of RVs and big trucks use them.
No need for propane tanks this way.
https://www.eberspaecher-na.com
All over YouTube, and they make hot water heaters also.
Solar electric power is a miserably inefficient way to make heat, but when you have a big diesel tank...
I would also consider a diesel-electric generator, from small air cooled power only to APU units for big trucks that also have air conditioner compressors...

CHARGE EVERYTHING when engine or generator runs!
It's worth the wiring! No sense in wasting power when diesel burns.
When you plug into grid, charge everything, again, it's worth the wiring.

It's commonly called a 'Ship To Shore' switch,
Its a transfer switch, and they come in automatic versions, as soon as 110 vac (or 220 vac) is hooked up, everything is automatically switched over and batteries charge off 110 vac chargers.

 

[April]

talking expensively

Thats for sure!

 

[SCClockDr]

If the slides would support it.
Hinge the panels to the gutter. Attach 2 or more bearing carriers to the slide that run in C channels fixed to the panels. Provide latches to secure the panels for travel. When the slides deploy the panels would splay out to shade the slide and catch more rays. While not ideal the panels would also catch limited light while traveling.

 

[barnyardweeds]

I AM SO JEALOUS!

Oh my you have so many possibilities!
That's probably a 24 volt system with a BIG honkin' alternator, and big battery box capacity, and more battery boxes are simply a bolt on.
Plenty of room to add an isolated alternator to charge everything when engine runs.

Outside climate control, go with lead/acid batteries.
LiFePo4 doesn't much care for temps approaching freezing, while an insulated battery box lead/acid won't have issues.
Inside the climate control, the LiFePo4 batteries are MUCH safer and no corrosion/acid/explosive gas issues.

Capacitors have an issue with charge density, the amount of power they can store for their size/weight.
They work OK for some quick release 'Boost' power, but for storage they have issues.
The caps that will hold a reasonable charge are stupid expensive.
Not really large scale cost viable, and not something a DIY'er wants to tackle.

With small square footage (roof) the most productive solar panels you can lay hands on for fitting the roof.
Pay attention to size, it's the productive sq.ft. that matters, odd sized, non-panel covered roof produces nothing.

An extra row of solar panels hinged off the side isn't a bad idea, I've done it myself with display trailers.
A full side wall isn't practical, and I can tell you why,
Road damage, weight, vandalism, etc.
Hinged off the roof keeps them up away from road rocks/trash, out of common sight line and idiot 'Punch' range.

Build the frame so the panels sit in the frame (flush) instead of on top the frame (stacked).
Cuts wind resistance and the frames protect the panel edges.

Be sure to diode isolate panel strings so the shaded strings won't drag down panels in sunlight.

Insulation before all else, insulate and seal up all air leaks.

Espar heater on diesel fuel when you want LOTS of heat on low electric consumption.
Works without engine running, a crap load of RVs and big trucks use them.
No need for propane tanks this way.
https://www.eberspaecher-na.com
All over YouTube, and they make hot water heaters also.
Solar electric power is a miserably inefficient way to make heat, but when you have a big diesel tank...
I would also consider a diesel-electric generator, from small air cooled power only to APU units for big trucks that also have air conditioner compressors...

CHARGE EVERYTHING when engine or generator runs!
It's worth the wiring! No sense in wasting power when diesel burns.
When you plug into grid, charge everything, again, it's worth the wiring.

It's commonly called a 'Ship To Shore' switch,
Its a transfer switch, and they come in automatic versions, as soon as 110 vac (or 220 vac) is hooked up, everything is automatically switched over and batteries charge off 110 vac chargers.

Wow, thanks for all the input. I am investing in the Espar heating. Was talking with Plan B Supply (Ogden Utah) and they were suggesting creating a small rack for 2/3 tanks that can be taken off the vehicle when needed. Serves a dual purpose when camping. I am installing 2 x 160 gallon diesel fuel tanks, hence your idea for the diesel electric generator makes lots of sense. Ship to shore sounds like a must have. The Safari rack on the cab roof will be lined with led light bars. I understand that the amp draw is fairly low for LED's? I will post a video soon about the crew cab conversion, probably early January. Stay tuned..

 

[barnyardweeds]

The problem with hinging the solar panels (beyond possible breakage) is that they will only produce when you are stopped and have the slide outs deployed. You would do better with something like drawer slides so that the solar panels can produce power in the retracted position and in the deployed position.

I think I understand your slide out option where the panels are on the roof doing their work as we drive along, and when stopped with the slide outs open they move into position over the slideouts leaving the roof top open as an observation or camping platform.

 

[barnyardweeds]

If the slides would support it.
Hinge the panels to the gutter. Attach 2 or more bearing carriers to the slide that run in C channels fixed to the panels. Provide latches to secure the panels for travel. When the slides deploy the panels would splay out to shade the slide and catch more rays. While not ideal the panels would also catch limited light while traveling.

From the posts I have read, job 1 is to keep the panels producing power as much as all the time as possible. I like the idea of using the panel as a shade producer as well, especially in warmer weather. There will be a diesel generator on board in case of inadequate solar panel production. Keep an eye on my progress this coming January when I will be posting video of the early stages of the makeover.

 

[barnyardweeds]

The problem with hinging the solar panels (beyond possible breakage) is that they will only produce when you are stopped and have the slide outs deployed. You would do better with something like drawer slides so that the solar panels can produce power in the retracted position and in the deployed position.

Thanks, the input here has been great. The drawer slide option has come up twice. Do I suppose correctly that most if not all solar panels are fragile? We have a flexible foldable panel set that we hang from our back packs, but the power production is limited to charging cell phones for the most part.

 

[Craig]

Look into Lithium, Titanate batteries they can handle the cold weather and can be charged and discharged at a 10 c rate(nearly as good as supercapacitors well not really but I challenge you to exceed their 10 c rating). Their only problem is they are not as energy dense as LIfePo4 but you have plenty of weight carrying ability.

 

[SCClockDr]

I think I understand your slide out option where the panels are on the roof doing their work as we drive along, and when stopped with the slide outs open they move into position over the slideouts leaving the roof top open as an observation or camping platform.

Here is an image of my initial thought.

 

[barnyardweeds]

Look into Lithium, Titanate batteries they can handle the cold weather and can be charged and discharged at a 10 c rate(nearly as good as supercapacitors well not really but I challenge you to exceed their 10 c rating). Their only problem is they are not as energy dense as LIfePo4 but you have plenty of weight carrying ability.

Thanks, Not familiar with the lithium titanate. Will look into it. This truck certainly has no weight carrying issues.

Here is an image of my initial thought.
View attachment 2726

When the slideouts are retracted, the solar panels would lie completely flat along the side of the box 17'LX8'W. There are windows on the side which would be covered, but wouldn't be necessary when driving. Having an option to retract over the roof for off roading would be necessary to protect from rocks and or trees.

 

[Craig]

Thanks, Not familiar with the lithium titanate. Will look into it. This truck certainly has no weight carrying issues.

When the slideouts are retracted, the solar panels would lie completely flat along the side of the box 17'LX8'W. There are windows on the side which would be covered, but wouldn't be necessary when driving. Having an option to retract over the roof for off roading would be necessary to protect from rocks and or trees.

Seems like you could make a hinge system that could allow panels to either drop on sides or flip over in top for protection. Perhaps the back side could be covered with thin plywood or sheet metal for protection.

 

[offgriddle]

Yes, this is overkill but it serves multiple purposes. This M934-A2 6x6 Expansible Van came into my life as a promotional vehicle for a larger project. This truck is traveling cross country from Ogden Utah to Avon CT on a live streamed tour . The three seater configuration is being expanded (https://www.planbsupply.com/6x6-expandable-box-trucks ) into a crew cab and there are plans for significant electrical upgrades with the idea of creating a four season camper with redundant heat and electrical systems for the purpose of demonstrating backup systems in different on-grid, near off-grid and totally off grid environments. Help is needed is creating a solar system with battery backup that can survive the harsher winter environment. The roof of the rear box is 17' long and 8' wide. There are 4' slide outs on both sides that add considerable room for additional solar panels that could be hinged to fold over onto the main box and then deployed over the slide outs to keep room on the roof as an observation deck and tent platform. Does anyone have experience with "ultra capacitors" that can be deployed perhaps in a daisy chain for another type of short term back up? Lots of possibilities with this vehicle, and I anticipate talking expensively on our upcoming YouTube channel. We are looking to showcase both custom and off the shelf solutions. Share your thoughts.
Peter G


View attachment 2669

no matter what, that deuce and a half is a seriously, totally cool piece of equipment. Best of luck and have fun with it!

 

[Supervstech]

Does the D&H still have the original power train? Runs on anything... gas to road tar...

 

[grizzzman]

How about this. build the deck thicker and install retractable panels. Out of the way wheeling and out when you need them. And still, have a deck. this is one way. Retracting Panels

 

[BoloMKXXVIII]

Thanks, the input here has been great. The drawer slide option has come up twice. Do I suppose correctly that most if not all solar panels are fragile? We have a flexible foldable panel set that we hang from our back packs, but the power production is limited to charging cell phones for the most part.

Solar panels are not that fragile if they are mounted to a rigid structure. They do not like being twisted. Any slide mechanism would have to be well engineered.

 

[freds]

OK what's your experience pulling into Federal and state parks and being the guy next door with that kind of rig? Is it like moths to a flame?