Replacement inverter for Outback Radian 8048a -

[glandpuck]

I would like to receive suggestions for a replacement inverter for my Outback Radian 8048A. I want a hybrid inverter that can pass AC through to my load subpanel all of the time (grid tied mode). I have a 50 amp 240 volt AC input into the Radian from my main loads panel and a 240 volt 30 amp generator input too. These are selectable and there is automatic backup via battery and generator. The inverter and lithium battery combo should be UL 9540 and UL9540A, and closed loop RS485. Inverter capacity of 10-12k watts. PV capacity of 12k watts or greater. Built in MPPT charge controllers with at least 3 MPPT should be onboard. Time of use on batteries must be supported. Selling to grid must be disabled. Charging batteries from generator should be supported. WIFI or LAN support for remote control. Lastly I would prefer the newer high voltage input inverters and battery banks over the older 48 volt systems.

Any good thoughts and suggestions are very appreciated. Thank you.

 

[400bird]

What's wrong with the Radian?

The inverter you described got more and more expensive with every adjective. I haven't looked into any high battery voltage inverters, but they all require manufacturer specific batteries. Depending on battery capacity, you're looking at lots of dough $$$$$

 

[glandpuck]

Nothing is wrong with the Radian. But I need to replace my FLA battery bank and the Radian can support Lithium, but not in a UL 9540 and 9540A closed loop system. Plus I want an inverter with more extensive remote control and monitoring with phone app which Radian does not have. And I would like a larger capacity inverter.

 

[Solar Guppy]

If you are looking at closed loop UL9540 the options are limited. I'm not fond of pointing people to newly released products as there are always issues that need to be addressed, but specification wise the new Solis S6 seems to meet your list of features and is just now becoming available.

With any UL9540 solutions you will have very limited choices with batteries, for the new S6, the pylontech H1 would be my choice as it is 40% less than the BYD options and as with the S6 looks like there will be 4 to 5 choices of US based retailers to purchase from

 

[glandpuck]

I have studied the new Solis S6 inverter. It lacks several major features that limit its usefulness. First, it has no generator support. AC input is only from the grid. Batteries can only be charged by PV or AC, not generator. Second, when the grid is out, the inverter only supplies power to a critical loads sub panel. It is not a whole home backup solution. There is no automatic transfer switch. The inverter can be connected in parallel, but again, the limit is having to install a subpanel almost as large as your main panel which is very costly.

 

[hwy17]

Schneider + Discover AES have full 9540. It does backfeed whole home backup now with the BCS too.

Schneider Electric Solar and Discover Battery Attain UL 9540

Schneider Electric Solar and Discover Battery announce UL 9540 safety certification for XW Pro hybrid inverter and AES LiFePO4 lithium battery.

blog.discoverbattery.com

They've also got new stuff coming though: https://solarbuildermag.com/energy-...nergy-and-microgrid-product-lines-at-re-2023/

 

[Solar Guppy]

The initial release of the S6 for single or dual inverters ( stacked ) is intended for backup panel. Though with 22 kW with a pair of the 11kW units, that could be whole home for most residences. The cost of a sub panel is a rounding error if you have a whole home solution as the cost of the storage ( batteries ) will be the dominate cost.

First, it has no generator support.

There is a Solis Power Hub, that is a smart ATS that also interfaces with generators and supports whole home backup

From the above:

Q6: What is the Solis Power Hub mentioned in the video and will that launch at the same time
as the new S6 hybrid inverter?

A6: The Solis Power Hub is a microgrid interconnection device (MID) that will be an optional accessory
only required if you are looking to get whole home backup with the S6 inverter. The Power Hub will
have three slots for inverter breakers to be connected in parallel. It will also have a generator
connection and breaker slots for load shedding. An additional video on the Power Hub will be released
in late Q1 2023. That being said, the Power Hub will not launch until early Q3 2023.

Second, when the grid is out, the inverter only supplies power to a critical loads sub panel.

That would be a single or dual inverter configuration without the Solis Power Hub

There is no automatic transfer switch.

Yes there is ( or will be ) and other OEM's like Fortress has them as well as they use a rebranded S6

 

[zanydroid]

I saw the same architecture for Growatt when I looked at their manual last night.

Are the stacked inverters AC coupled to each other with one leader designated? Or are they synchronized via comms cable?

 

[zanydroid]

The cost of a sub panel is a rounding error

My mental model for cost of subpanel:
- $1000 if new panel, licensed electrician
- $2000-3000 if new panel but moving a lot of circuits, possibly replacing in place.

DIY:
- $150 parts (unless you trigger AFCI retrofit)
- couple hours
- drama with your family with circuits down, and your own hands being slower than an electrician/no electrician to blame for it being slow

 

[Quattrohead]

Nothing is wrong with the Radian. But I need to replace my FLA battery bank and the Radian can support Lithium, but not in a UL 9540 and 9540A closed loop system. Plus I want an inverter with more extensive remote control and monitoring with phone app which Radian does not have. And I would like a larger capacity inverter.

Don't fall for the shiny and new crap, if you've got working stuff hang on to it. If you can manually set charge voltages on your radian then it will be able to charge lithium ion phosphate just fine. The BMS in the battery will take care of the finer details that they require.

 

[zanydroid]

9540A is irrelevant to bring up in the requirements, you mean paired UL9540 listing for inverter/battery combination.

I don’t think HVDC platforms are ready if you want maximum DIY control. 48v operation and accessories are very well understood. As an example if you want to add an AC charger to couple in a generator or vehicle while running off grid, you can easily do that with 48v, in any number of ways, with a lot of choice of new and surplus equipment (since 48v is used in data center and telcos).

Good luck doing that with HVDC.

 

[Johneb]

Glandpuck, what did you end up doing?