Victron MPII, 712 Shunt, 4x100 Redodo Smart Mini, Not working!

[CleanLivin]

After weeks of wrestling to get a solution from Victron or my distributor - dealer is now picking up the slack and offered to ship MPII back and they will bench check it. Before I take the system apart to ship it back, any ideas from the folks here?

Setup: Multiplus-II, 12/3000/120/50/12V, 712 Smart Shunt, Victron Lynx, Victron MK3-USB-C, VE Bus Smart Terminal, 4 Redodo LiFePO4, 100Ah Smart Mini batteries.
Batteries in Parrallel. "Voltmeter" in notes below means voltmeter reading across the battery terminals.
MacBook Pro PC using Victron Connect, iPhone using same. Victron Config not supported on Mac's.

Problem: MPII will not fully charge the batteries, plus MPII and Victron report voltage that is not close to accurate.
The MP and 712 show the 4 batteries fully charged at 13..60, but they are not even close. MPII shows 13.6 volts
BUT batteries are actually at 12.97!!

Must define: Is the Multiplus-II, 12/3000/120/50/12V defective right out of the box?

Question:
1.) With the batteries out of the box, I had no way to fully charge all 4 batteries to 13.60 before installing and turning on the MPII,
BUT I did balance all 4 to 13.23v. I assumed the MPII would read the values and then charge to the MPII settings set of 13.6 at 14.6 rate.

WAG: Could it be that when I turned on the MPII for the first time, MPII assumed that the batteries are fully charged and
as such it then self calibrated/sync to the 13.23v thinking they are at 13.6, which is what I want and do have the settings in the
MPII at 12.97!!?

2.) Why is iPhone app always displaying the MPII mode as "Initializing" but Mac PC can be showing Bulk, etc?

3.) Why does the iPhone see both the MPII and the 712 BUT the Mac only sees the MPII?
(Guess: iPhone is BlueTooth and Mac is hard wired to dongle?)

4.) I can find no way to resent the MPII back to factory default. Is there a way?

The below note is after numerou iterations of tests!
For this last test I decided to drain the batteries down to 10% and then throw that charge challenge to the MPII.
--------------
Any guidance or logic shared is greatly appreciated.
Alternative is pull my Airstream Basecamp from Chapel Hill, NC to Nashville
to hand the problem to the dealer, or just ship back the MPII and let the bench test it but
I think it would be best to have dealer test the MPII as in the full system, not just sitting on a bench.

Here are my notes that I have replicated with no deviation over more than a dozen times.
Dealer and Victron say my settings and schematic/install are fine:

 

[sunshine_eggo]

0) you've triple checked that all connections are torqued, all crimps are of high quality and that any other means of connection is proper.

1) wiring them in parallel and letting them sit does essentially nothing.

2) no idea. Different versions of VC should report the same.

3) Your guess sounds right. I'm not a mac guy.

4) factory defaults can be set by VEConfig, but that's PC only, and a pain to get to run on Mac. Updating the firmware will reset the unit to the new firmware defaults.

New batteries almost always are imbalanced and essentially fight the chargers via BMS charge protection.

Your BMV will not be accurate until it senses an actual sync event. Cut-off due to imbalance may trick it into thinking it's fully charged.

If the BMS disconnects at low current, the MP will drop to float. The MP/BMV/voltmeter will report MP float voltage. BMS will report protection voltage.

No idea about the ReDooDoos, but LiTime batteries show an arbitrary ~12.9V after charge protection is encountered. This is mind-bogglingly stupid. Once a light load is applied, the battery reports about 0.5-0.7V higher, which is supposed to be it's real voltage.

The evidence thus far is that your batteries are imbalanced.

Recommend you set:
absorption to 13.8V, fixed 1 hour.
float to 13.6V.

Initiate a charge and open the VC Trends tab on your BMV-712. Select voltage and current. WATCH these (it will log them every two seconds when viewing live. it will continue to log if you close the app, but looking back farther makes the gap between measurements larger). If you see a notable voltage spike followed by a drop to float/0A, this is 100% conclusive evidence that the BMS is engaging charge protection.

 

[CleanLivin]

0) you've triple checked that all connections are torqued, all crimps are of high quality and that any other means of connection is proper.

1) wiring them in parallel and letting them sit does essentially nothing.

2) no idea. Different versions of VC should report the same.

3) Your guess sounds right. I'm not a mac guy.

4) factory defaults can be set by VEConfig, but that's PC only, and a pain to get to run on Mac. Updating the firmware will reset the unit to the new firmware defaults.

New batteries almost always are imbalanced and essentially fight the chargers via BMS charge protection.

Your BMV will not be accurate until it senses an actual sync event. Cut-off due to imbalance may trick it into thinking it's fully charged.

If the BMS disconnects at low current, the MP will drop to float. The MP/BMV/voltmeter will report MP float voltage. BMS will report protection voltage.

No idea about the ReDooDoos, but LiTime batteries show an arbitrary ~12.9V after charge protection is encountered. This is mind-bogglingly stupid. Once a light load is applied, the battery reports about 0.5-0.7V higher, which is supposed to be it's real voltage.

The evidence thus far is that your batteries are imbalanced.

Recommend you set:
absorption to 13.8V, fixed 1 hour.
float to 13.6V.

Initiate a charge and open the VC Trends tab on your BMV-712. Select voltage and current. WATCH these (it will log them every two seconds when viewing live. it will continue to log if you close the app, but looking back farther makes the gap between measurements larger). If you see a notable voltage spike followed by a drop to float/0A, this is 100% conclusive evidence that the BMS is engaging charge protection.

Great analysis!!! I just checked my post 11-8-23 AM and saw your comments.
Work on your suggestions. I too think the Redodo Mini Smarts are part of the equation. I got a standard alone LiFePO4 charger yesterday and will one by one try to charge each up to 13.6, which Redodo tells me in their ideal resting charge and to charge at 14.6.

I will report back for the log here what I find. I will also try to find a buddy with a PC and reset the MPII to factory defaults with VConfig.

Jack

 

[CleanLivin]

0) you've triple checked that all connections are torqued, all crimps are of high quality and that any other means of connection is proper.

1) wiring them in parallel and letting them sit does essentially nothing.

2) no idea. Different versions of VC should report the same.

3) Your guess sounds right. I'm not a mac guy.

4) factory defaults can be set by VEConfig, but that's PC only, and a pain to get to run on Mac. Updating the firmware will reset the unit to the new firmware defaults.

New batteries almost always are imbalanced and essentially fight the chargers via BMS charge protection.

Your BMV will not be accurate until it senses an actual sync event. Cut-off due to imbalance may trick it into thinking it's fully charged.

If the BMS disconnects at low current, the MP will drop to float. The MP/BMV/voltmeter will report MP float voltage. BMS will report protection voltage.

No idea about the ReDooDoos, but LiTime batteries show an arbitrary ~12.9V after charge protection is encountered. This is mind-bogglingly stupid. Once a light load is applied, the battery reports about 0.5-0.7V higher, which is supposed to be it's real voltage.

The evidence thus far is that your batteries are imbalanced.

Recommend you set:
absorption to 13.8V, fixed 1 hour.
float to 13.6V.

Initiate a charge and open the VC Trends tab on your BMV-712. Select voltage and current. WATCH these (it will log them every two seconds when viewing live. it will continue to log if you close the app, but looking back farther makes the gap between measurements larger). If you see a notable voltage spike followed by a drop to float/0A, this is 100% conclusive evidence that the BMS is engaging charge protection.

Mr. Sunshine,
Absolutely correct guess - Redodo Smart Mini BMS is flawed for my system where accessing batteries is a total pain! I found two of the four in my setup to be "locked out" and would not take a charge and were dragging the whole system down.

After several exchanges with Redodo support, this morning they agreed to accept back the Mini Smarts.
I noticed that the Mini Smart are no longer available on Amazon or on the factory website.

In short, I need the Mini size/configuration so expect I will order the "non-Smart" flavor, take the MPII back to factory default, and reset everything.

Question: "

Updating the firmware will reset the unit to the new firmware defaults."

I have the latest firmware installed, can I just reinstall the same version and it will reset all?

Your comments, are sincerely appreciated.
Jack

 

[sunshine_eggo]

Are you running VE.Config software or VictronConnect.

 

[Tomthumb62]

Mr. Sunshine,
Absolutely correct guess - Redodo Smart Mini BMS is flawed for my system where accessing batteries is a total pain! I found two of the four in my setup to be "locked out" and would not take a charge and were dragging the whole system down.

After several exchanges with Redodo support, this morning they agreed to accept back the Mini Smarts.
I noticed that the Mini Smart are no longer available on Amazon or on the factory website.

In short, I need the Mini size/configuration so expect I will order the "non-Smart" flavor, take the MPII back to factory default, and reset everything.

Question: "

I have the latest firmware installed, can I just reinstall the same version and it will reset all?

Your comments, are sincerely appreciated.
Jack

I recommend a higher quality but still budget battery, such as:

SOK
Powerurus
Aolithium (12v only not the 48v)

LiFePO4 Batteries for Offgrid and Mobile Solar

The lithium batteries below are considered "Drop-in Lead Acid Replacement" because you can use them with standard 12/24/48 volt solar charge controllers/chargers/inverters and more. Simply hook them...

www.mobile-solarpower.com

Will Prowse (owner of this solar forum) has reviewed all the above and gives them the thumbs up. IMO, the Powerurus is the cheapest of the three. I bought one earlier this year and it’s been great. Plus, Powerurus customer support has been excellent as they’ve answered about two dozen of my questions, most of them after I bought the battery.