What's your opinion on the best BMS?

[liamgibbins]

I am in the UK and and took the plunge into lifepo4 batteries and ordered 8* 200ah cells from AliExpress while the sale is on.

The manufacturer recommends the Daly BMS systems but reading some threads seems like they can be unreliable? But also see some where the user needs enlightening to how to use etc.

What would you recommend been users of BMS systems?

 

[Horsefly]

You are likely to get answers all over the place. For some, this is almost a religious argument.

As a category, I think you need to get a "smart" BMS, as that's the only way for you to see the status of each cell, and potentially adjust some of the BMS settings. Some - including some Daly - are not "smart" so you just have to hook it up and hope everything works. As an example, I put a 25A load on my pack yesterday and noticed one of the cells dropped in voltage more than the others. I tightened the nuts on the studs of that cell and the voltages all balanced out. Not sure how you would find that otherwise.

There are a number of pretty expensive BMS's that I know very little about but I'm sure are better than what most people here use: Orion, Batrium, and REC come to mind. I've seen some good things about Heltec and AntBMS, but again I don't know much about them. Chargery sounds like it started out mainly for electric vehicles, but is now used by quite a few folks here. I've herd it is a little quirky.

My own observation is that many of the Daly's get some negative comments here. You'd need to look and find those if you are considering Daly. They seem to look nice, with that pretty red paint, but maybe that means their emphasis is not in the right place.

Many of us (including me) use BMS's from JBD. I don't think I've read about any that had real problems. I like how it works with the phone app, and I prefer the MOSFET common port that allows the BMS to cut of charging but allow discharging, or vice versa.

 

[John Frum]

How much amperage do you require?
Are you doing a 4s or 8s battery?

 

[liamgibbins]

I am doing 8s, I think a smart BMS is the way to go and regular maintenance schedule like tightening the nuts etc with expansion etc when that are charged etc...

I have read a few threads about Daly bms and some of them seem to be user issues not the vm's itself, I think that have gone for a professional look with the red paint etc to stand out from the crowed and that have newer releases after users complaints.

I have also looked into JBD BMS and there in the same price range as Daly.

Personally I like cheap things and as long as they work that's the main thing lol.

I have looked in mossfet and relay bmses and since I am not looking at going much over 100amps in the near future then MOSFETs look good to me.

I am taking the current lead acid batteries and using them as a back up with a automatic switch (I already have a lead acid BMS system)


I am currently expanding my system with another 4 panels by the end of the year and thinking about wind aswell (been in the UK and all).

I plan to keep the system 24v and expand the system to cover 2 freezers and a fridge freezer at some point probably next year.

 

[Horsefly]

I too have a 24V system, and I have 3 of the JBD's. Two are 8S 100A, and one is 8S 60A. The two 100A go with my main system for our cabin (230Ah), with one being a spare. I have run both of them, calibrated them, and verified all the smart settings.

The 60A one is still in the box, but is to go with my "play" system made up of 8S 25Ah cells.

I mentioned calibration: One of my two JBD's was from Overkill Solar here in the U.S., and the other was directly from JBD. Overkill supposedly does calibration of the BMS before they ship it, but I found that with my somewhat expensive Fluke meter the voltages were still a bit off. The one directly from JBD was a little more off than the one from Overkill. I bought one of the USB dongles for the JBD BMS, which allows you to hook it up to a laptop to do the calibration. The Android app doesn't allow you to do calibration. Not sure about the iPhone app. Truth is both of these 100A 8S BMSs were close enough that it would have been OK without me tweaking the calibration, but I'm still glad I did it. Makes it so my Active Balancer can do an excellent job, as the cells show up as within 1mV at rest.

 

[liamgibbins]

Just found this one..
Its a relay BMS, The QUCC 7s-20s bms
There is to many choices, I hate choice so indecisive.

The attractive thing for me is the balancing current of 260mA, so the cells Ballance faster.

129.5US $ 26% OFF|Qucc Smart Bms Relay Contactor 7s 8s 10s 12s 13s 14s 15s 16s 17s 20s 200a Li Ion Lifepo4 Bms 24v 36v 48v 60v 72v Bluetooth App - Battery Accessories & Charger Accessories - AliExpress

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

a.aliexpress.com

 

[NwCali]

I think you need to get a "smart" BMS

I know of no reason to not get a smart BMS, and I'm not a diy in this aspect (bms's). I always figured all of them did this...little did I know.

 

[Horsefly]

Just found this one..
Its a relay BMS, The QUCC 7s-20s bms
There is to many choices, I hate choice so indecisive.

The attractive thing for me is the balancing current of 260mA, so the cells Ballance faster.

129.5US $ 26% OFF|Qucc Smart Bms Relay Contactor 7s 8s 10s 12s 13s 14s 15s 16s 17s 20s 200a Li Ion Lifepo4 Bms 24v 36v 48v 60v 72v Bluetooth App - Battery Accessories & Charger Accessories - AliExpress

Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com

a.aliexpress.com

I know nothing about that BMS. So I can't really comment.

On balancing: I'm a BIG fan of Active balancing. I have worked with both the QNBBM 8S active balancer (which I think was about $150 from Aliexpress) and the Heltec capacitor 8S balancer, which cost about $40 on Amazon. I ended up going with the Heltec because it was smaller and didn't make the whining noise the QNBBM did. Both work great, and do a much better job of balancing than the passive balancing from most of the BMS's.

 

[Horsefly]

I know of no reason to not get a smart BMS, and I'm not a diy in this aspect (bms's). I always figured all of them did this...little did I know.

Some of the Daly are not smart. Just plug-in and pray.

 

[MurphyGuy]

My own observation is that many of the Daly's get some negative comments here. You'd need to look and find those if you are considering Daly. They seem to look nice, with that pretty red paint, but maybe that means their emphasis is not in the right place.

Its an indication to the shallow meaningless thinking of the average American.. "all show and no go".

I have been reading internet forums and facebook groups dealing with solar, batteries and BMS's for almost 5 years now.. I think I'm a member of all of them.. LOL

I wouldn't put a Chinese BMS and a lithium battery in the same room with each other, let alone actually connect them.

There are only three BMS's I would consider at this point.. REC, Batrium, and Orion.. I use a REC myself, but may use a Batrium on my next battery.. Not because I'm unhappy with REC by any means, but just to expand my own experience.

I've heard good things about Orion as well, but I'm more familiar with Batrium at this point.

 

[Horsefly]

I wouldn't put a Chinese BMS and a lithium battery in the same room with each other, let alone actually connect them.

If I wanted to avoid stuff made in China, I would lead a pretty dull life. I wouldn't have a cell phone, TV, or any of a number of things. Fact is, the Li batteries are pretty much all made in China, so you are stuck with that. I do get your point though. It's a roll of the dice what you may get, but a board like this one can sort out some of the chaff.

 

[MurphyGuy]

If I wanted to avoid stuff made in China, I would lead a pretty dull life. I wouldn't have a cell phone, TV, or any of a number of things. Fact is, the Li batteries are pretty much all made in China, so you are stuck with that. I do get your point though. It's a roll of the dice what you may get, but a board like this one can sort out some of the chaff.

Cell phones are made under strict supervision by the sponsoring non-Chinese corporations.

Televisions, clothing and your car jack, are not going to burn your home down or destroy hundreds or thousands of dollars of your battery investment.

Also, there is a big difference between something "made in China" and something "Chinese".. One is made under contract, the other is an actual Chinese product that has no liability if it burns your house down.

Lets look at this from a different perspective.. After 4 or 5 years, I have NEVER ONCE heard of a REC, Batrium, or Orion BMS damaging someone's battery.. but we here about this stuff with the Chinese BMS's on almost a Daly basis.. (see what I did there?) LOL

I crack myself up..

 

[Horsefly]

Cell phones are made under strict supervision by the sponsoring non-Chinese corporations.

My last three phones, and the new one I'm receiving tomorrow are Motorola. Let's see Motorola is owned by..... Lenovo! That would be a Chinese company. Not sure who the non-Chinese part of that is, but they are great phones. MidNite Solar's new DIY line is all Chinese made, and no, little company MidNite does not send a staff over there to "supervise" them. They are purchased under contract. Bob Carver has said straight up that the Chinese are building stuff just as good as anyone else right now. Sol-Ark is made in China, and I don't think they do supervision either.

Moreover, I think your logic is going to continue to be overcome by reality. Anyway, we are way off topic here.

 

[Roqm]

You can have anything built to a high standard in china, the reason for cheap crap is people wanting a higher profit margin and using the cheapest parts that will work.

 

[liamgibbins]

If I wanted to avoid stuff made in China, I would lead a pretty dull life. I wouldn't have a cell phone, TV, or any of a number of things. Fact is, the Li batteries are pretty much all made in China, so you are stuck with that. I do get your point though. It's a roll of the dice what you may get, but a board like this one can sort out some of the chaff.

I agree, most main line motorcycle companies now make bikes in China, KTM, harley davidson make lines in China now

 

[OffGridInTheCity]

For large scale, DIY powerwall, when you want to incrementally keep adding... Batrium has been an excellent choice. I have 84 packs @ 260ah (81kwh) and continue to expand year by year by just adding more packs/longmons while the base infrastructure/controller remains the same

Each blue line is ~ 1s100p pack (some are 88p and some 120p) - but all are 260ah each. The plan is to add 42 more over the next 2 years... (e.g. 3 more 14s100p batteries).

 

[liamgibbins]

I know of no reason to not get a smart BMS, and I'm not a diy in this aspect (bms's). I always figured all of them did this...little did I know.

I like to dabble with electronics and the DIY BMS v4 and up look interesting but you might as well but one for the self build cost.

I made my own solar tracking for two of my panels that move vertically and it work quite well.

I also made a temperature monitor for the inverter, charge controller and battery box that turns on and off fans and heat mats when needed, it was a good learning curve and simple programming with Arduino.

I also made a burglar deterant (that's what I call it) basically it's a series of large capacitors to a metal plate that sits on a mat, step on it and yeah let's say you know about it, when I tested it I couldn't get my breath and the pain oofff...

 

[MurphyGuy]

My last three phones, and the new one I'm receiving tomorrow are Motorola. Let's see Motorola is owned by..... Lenovo! That would be a Chinese company. Not sure who the non-Chinese part of that is, but they are great phones. MidNite Solar's new DIY line is all Chinese made, and no, little company MidNite does not send a staff over there to "supervise" them. They are purchased under contract. Bob Carver has said straight up that the Chinese are building stuff just as good as anyone else right now. Sol-Ark is made in China, and I don't think they do supervision either.

Moreover, I think your logic is going to continue to be overcome by reality. Anyway, we are way off topic here.

I understand your point and somewhat agree, but only partially.

That said, Lenovo is not a good example as their products are garbage.

 

[Horsefly]

I understand your point and somewhat agree, but only partially.

That said, Lenovo is not a good example as their products are garbage.

Motorola - part of Lenovo - is a good example because their phones are great.

Besides, opinions on Lenovo ebb and flow. I'm currently using a Lenovo laptop that I've been very happy with.

 

[NwCali]

I also made a burglar deterant (that's what I call it) basically it's a series of large capacitors to a metal plate that sits on a mat, step on it and yeah let's say you know about it, when I tested it I couldn't get my breath and the pain oofff...

You should realize if you live in the wrong place and someone gets hurt by this you could end up in prison...

One of my daughters friends dad was in prison over his place being stolen from (grow room/house)..... and he thought he'd be smart and make sure they paid a price if they entered again. They did, but so did he.