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Is having two Victron MPPTs connected better than having one bigger MPPT?

tonyg

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Apr 5, 2022
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136
Hi,

In a 12 panel system, 6 would be affected by shade and 6 not. Out of the 6 shaded ones, 3 of them are affected a bit more. I can do various combinations like 3s4p, or two systems like 2 x 3s2p.

I wonder if it is better to have two smaller MPPTs of 150/45 than having one bigger one like 250/85? The price of the two MPPTs together would be just a bit more than the price of a one bigger one.

Asking this, thinking that it may be better output of energy for the one MPPT to deal with shade and the other to deal with harvesting straight sunlight.

Thank you!
 
Howdy,

I have a similar shading issue with one of my smaller systems.

I have 10 70 watt panels facing directly South and 2 275 watt panels facing South West.

I use a Victron MPPT SCC on each bank.

And Victron makes a great little device called

Victron Energy Smart Battery Sense​


This $39 box connects directly to your battery and monitors battery voltage and temperature.

It will ALSO link both of your charge controllers (via bluetooth) and takes care of all the magic of getting maximum charge current out of your system.

AND it gives you the ability to have a low temp sensor, so you don't have to worry about charging your batteries on that real cold morning.

Over all a great solution.....

DennisB
 
Hi DennisB,

Thank you for that! Really appreciate your input. I've asked guidance on a different post on the forum with regards to the design I did - and am ready to order once I get some feedback:

You can see I included a smart shunt there, I suppose I can add Battery Sense as a great addition to that, right?... All Victron components will connect between themselves via Bluetooth, I suppose. Thank you again.
 
Hi DennisB,

Thank you for that! Really appreciate your input. I've asked guidance on a different post on the forum with regards to the design I did - and am ready to order once I get some feedback:

You can see I included a smart shunt there, I suppose I can add Battery Sense as a great addition to that, right?... All Victron components will connect between themselves via Bluetooth, I suppose. Thank you again.

The Victron equipment is designed to play well with themselves.

I have not tried pairing with the Smart Shunt, but a quick scan of the documents indicated that it should work.

Actually I did see your other post and had a few thoughts.....

I've used Daly BMS's on small systems, but over the last 2 years their larger BMS's seem to have fallen out of grace with the community.

I'd do a some forum searching. Most of the BMS posters have shifted to JBD and JKBMS (Heltek).

I personally run both of these, but prefer the JKBMS.

Good luck with your system !!

DennisB
 
Two is better, for the reasons you stated.
Also, if one goes down you still have some production. Until a replacement is done.
 
Hi,

In a 12 panel system, 6 would be affected by shade and 6 not. Out of the 6 shaded ones, 3 of them are affected a bit more. I can do various combinations like 3s4p, or two systems like 2 x 3s2p.

I wonder if it is better to have two smaller MPPTs of 150/45 than having one bigger one like 250/85? The price of the two MPPTs together would be just a bit more than the price of a one bigger one.

Asking this, thinking that it may be better output of energy for the one MPPT to deal with shade and the other to deal with harvesting straight sunlight.

Thank you!
Shading will not have any more affect on a single controller than with 2 assuming the shaded vs non-shaded panels are paralleled into the controller.

2 controllers is affectively 2 parallel PV circuits (unless you were to connect them in series, which would be abnormal).

edit: that said, 2 controllers does give you redundancy.
 
If you have shading issues, using 2 separate controllers can be a big improvement. Even having panels in parallel is only a compromise when there is shading. Having separate MPPT controllers will still maximize the non shaded panels and the shaded panels on the other controller.
 
If you have shading issues, using 2 separate controllers can be a big improvement. Even having panels in parallel is only a compromise when there is shading. Having separate MPPT controllers will still maximize the non shaded panels and the shaded panels on the other controller.
So a parallel string facing AM sun and a parallel string facing PM sun will perform better on different controllers as opposed to on the same controller? I was under the impression this was a recommended configuration, esepcially for over-panelling, and that any negative effects were negligible. Partial shading of a series string will affect its performance, but I am also under the impression that with bypass diodes, that's even negliable anymore.

Happy to admit my ignorance. Would love to learn more if you can explain it.
 
So a parallel string facing AM sun and a parallel string facing PM sun will perform better on different controllers as opposed to on the same controller? I was under the impression this was a recommended configuration, esepcially for over-panelling, and that any negative effects were negligible. Partial shading of a series string will affect its performance, but I am also under the impression that with bypass diodes, that's even negliable anymore.

Happy to admit my ignorance. Would love to learn more if you can explain it.
If you are putting parallel panels on a common charge controller, it does work and the loss is not bad, but when the sun is near straight south but still hitting both east and west facing panels, it can't optimize both sets. One string will be over loaded a bit, and the other string will be under loaded a bit. If both strings have their own MPPT controllers, you can harvest a bit more as both strings can be optimally loaded.

With a single MPPT, if one of the strings does have a shadow on one panel, and the other string does not, then you will basically only get the power from the string without the shadow. It is like the other string has one less panel in series, so the ideal MPPT voltage is lower by one panel. With a separate MPPT controller, the bypass diodes will allow the MPPT to find the maximum power point by loading down to the voltage with the one panel being basically zero. But if there is another parallel string without a shadow, that can't happen. The MPPT will find the maximum power point of the string without a shadow. To get power from the shaded string, it would need to pull the voltage down to match the string with the shaded panel. Some "shade tolerant" MPPT system will test for this and pull the extra current to try and find this other maximum power point, but it is still sacrificing power from the non shaded string as it is dragging the voltage so much lower to find more power. So it does work with a single MPPT, it is not as good as two. Without shadows, with all of the panels seeing light, the two parallel strings works pretty well, and you can over panel with different orientations by using that trick, but it is not as good at dealing with shadows. On the good side, you will get most of the power from any parallel strings without shadows, but once a panel is shaded, you are basically losing that string.

So with 12 panels, and charge controllers that can take 3 panels in series, I would think you would do the best with two parallel strings of 3 on each of the 2 charge controllers. And if you have a case where a shadow from a pole or tree could pass across the panels, you could go a step further by having the panels that are likely to be shaded at the same time to be in each series group. So the first three panels to see a shadow on charge controller #1, then the next three on controller #2, then the 3rd group back on controller #1, and the last group back on controller #2. So as the shadow first hits, you lose the first 3 panels, but the second 3 on controller #1 are still well out in good sun. Controller #2 is getting good sun from all 6 of it's panels. But then the shadow advances onto the second group of 3 panels. So controller #2 drops to 3 good panels. Soon after, controller #1 get's the first 3 panels back again. And this continues across the rest of the array. It makes the wiring a little more complex, but I think it could be a big benefit if you can't eliminate shadows. Just the shadow from a power line can be enough to take out a string as it passes by.
 
I could be wrong, but I think if you have the Smart Shunt then you don't need the Smart Battery Sense. I have the BMV-712 (kind of a Smart Shunt with a display and better Bluetooth range) and I get all the benefits of the Smart Battery Sense.
 
I'm not sure that the Smart Shunt would communicate with MPPTs details regarding temperature and voltage, which are essential.
 
I could be wrong, but I think if you have the Smart Shunt then you don't need the Smart Battery Sense. I have the BMV-712 (kind of a Smart Shunt with a display and better Bluetooth range) and I get all the benefits of the Smart Battery Sense.
Just posted a new thread to see what people think...

 
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