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Victron is Over-priced Eurotrash. Why would anybody buy Victron over an AiO?

1201 said:
Android is Linux and Linux rocks. So much power, and people use it as a phone
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I tried Linux for 6 months. Something as simple as installing a program was so complicated. In Windows you just double click the install file. Why did Linux have to make it so complicated?

Better is relative. Better for computer engineers, not for regular users IMO.
 
For me, proprietary is a bad word.
When a company says that "you can only use our stuff with our stuff".
I don't use their stuff.
Which is why I will never own anything from Apple, Tesla, or any other company with that business plan.
 
Rednecktek said:
I just can't bring myself to spend so much more for the color blue when you have much more capable units made by other manufacturers that work just fine and don't nickel & dime you for every little plastic cover and app and fuse holder in a fairly locked down eco-system
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Not sure what you mean by fairly locked down eco-system? Software wise Victron probably has the most open and transparent software system of any of the manufacturers.
 
timselectric said:
For me, proprietary is a bad word.
When a company says that "you can only use our stuff with our stuff".
I don't use their stuff.
Which is why I will never own anything from Apple, Tesla, or any other company with that business plan.
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I used to be that way. Had Android and it was a PITA to use. Same with Linux. I like the intent behind open access stuff but rarely does it meet the standards of what some private companies offer. Like I said, I’m not a fan of anything Apple except iOS. If I could put iOS on a Samsung S22, I’d be all over that. But it would have to be stable and native like, not a hack job.

And yes I know about flashing ROMs. Been there done that, it sucks. And most of my customers are older and have a iphone. I can troubleshoot if they have a problem with my website because I use and know the iOS system, at least better than they do.

iOS is locked down but it’s secure and works so well that tweaking is not generally necessary. I use my phone not the other way around. LoL. Pitch fork down now ?
 
Tomthumb62 said:
I can’t bring myself to spend $2500 on an Apple laptop when I can get the same or better (sans the OS) for half price or less. I paid $715 for my Thinkpad, put $200 of upgrades (better screen and bigger ssd) and it’s still running great nearly 10 years later.

But I love my iphone. Can’t stand Android and all the fussing required to extract the Google snooping. iOS is just superior in user interface and feel and reliability and security IMO. I just use my phone, I’m not wasting time fiddling with it.
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I swapped from being a devoted Apple user to Android. I would never go back. Apple stuff is overpriced. The batteries don't last. Designed for 2.5 years. The cables always fail. They won't allow you to use after makeover charge cables. Protectionist garbage. The EU will be stopping Apple in their tracks. User replaceable batteries, here we come?
 
TimE said:
I swapped from being a devoted Apple user to Android. I would never go back. Apple stuff is overpriced. The batteries don't last. Designed for 2.5 years. The cables always fail. They won't allow you to use after makeover charge cables. Protectionist garbage. The EU will be stopping Apple in their tracks. User replaceable batteries, here we come?
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Overpriced is an opinion. So is everything else you said.

My iphone is 5 or 6 years old now. Original battery. Battery is down to 5 or 10% by the end of the day now but works fine. I don't care for some of the latest software changes but I can't complain about the hardware. My wife's iphone is older than mine.

I've only ever had 1 cable fail, but I have a couple more of them in a drawer from other devices.

I bought a 2 meter aftermarket charge cable for my ipad. Works with our phones too.
 
Rednecktek said:
I”ll buy Victron equipment AFTER the end of the world happens AND hell freezes over AND I spend money on an Apple computer again.
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Lol. That should wake things up again.

Seriously lots of good choices in today’s market
 
Q-Dog said:
Overpriced is an opinion. So is everything else you said.

My iphone is 5 or 6 years old now. Original battery. Battery is down to 5 or 10% by the end of the day now but works fine. I don't care for some of the latest software changes but I can't complain about the hardware. My wife's iphone is older than mine.

I've only ever had 1 cable fail, but I have a couple more of them in a drawer from other devices.

I bought a 2 meter aftermarket charge cable for my ipad. Works with our phones too.
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Opinion based on experience ?
 
Have you heard of the new apple inverter? Is called Icharge, produced next to the voltronic warehouse in china. Pay 32 gorillion dollars so our corporation continues to make record profits out of regular hardware with an apple on it that people will buy no matter what because is cool and 'it just works'. But works only with our Ipanels produced with extra sunshine technology. Cables are 200 dollars for 3 feet, but we will give you 2 inches more for free. Buy now!
 
Samsonite801 said:
My neighbor just purchased two Victron MPPT charge controllers which support 450v PV input... I own two Victron 250|100 charge controllers which support 250v PV input.

Were you speaking of some particular use of a 100v Victron you saw before or something? Victron makes lots of different charge controllers, supporting all sorts of PV input voltages, depending on what your application requires...
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The guys around here don't stock anything with 450v PV. I found it on their site and located someone online selling it. We are a teensie bit proud of it . . . The 2 string 100A unit is $1300.

My AIO's MPPT's are all "Full", and configured to meet any sunlight time demands. Adding additional panels at this point would be purely for additional battery charge capacity for the batteries I don't have yet :) . . . So a couple of higher voltage MPPT's would fit the bill nicely when I do, and in this case actually simplify the wiring. Building up a robust 24KW plant to meet a peak 150KWH/day demand, is definitely different than getting 5KW for a trailer to watch TV in the evening, and keep a small fridge going.
 
Rednecktek said:
And hardware wise? Everything works great if it's all Victron. :rolleyes:
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There are plenty of examples of Victron playing well with others.

Example - Midnite solar controllers can be setup in leu of a Victron and it works fine. SOK Battery and EG4 (to name a few) work with full BMS communications.

Got another brand controller or inverter/charger with no VE.Bus and still want a Cerbo to work? Just use a smartshunt as an energy meter...

And if you want to get more crazy, the Cerbo-GX is essentially a Raspberry Pi - you can build your own Pi and run Venus OS without spending a dollar on Victron hardware.

ksmithaz1 said:
The guys around here don't stock anything with 450v PV.
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We're 2 days delivery away from you in AZ...and we do have plenty of 450v units in stock.
 
HighTechLab said:
There are plenty of examples of Victron playing well with others.

Example - Midnite solar controllers can be setup in leu of a Victron and it works fine. SOK Battery and EG4 (to name a few) work with full BMS communications.

Got another brand controller or inverter/charger with no VE.Bus and still want a Cerbo to work? Just use a smartshunt as an energy meter...

And if you want to get more crazy, the Cerbo-GX is essentially a Raspberry Pi - you can build your own Pi and run Venus OS without spending a dollar on Victron hardware.
Click to expand...

I think victron has a pretty detailed schematic so others can program their stuff to work via modbus etc.
 
n2aws said:
How long ago did you look?

Schneider has 2 models that are 600v max, been selling them for like 20 years (I have a couple, and they are rock solid)
victron has at least 1 400v model
midnight solar has a hawks bay charge controller that is 600v

Not going to lie, it's kinda nice to bring a large "string inverter" sized array into a charge controller over 10AWG pv wire. Especially in my case where one of my arrays is on a barn almost 300' from the house.
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Midnight: $2550/120A/ ?1? String. Seriously proud of that one, Victron seems to be a better deal. Schneider has bothered me since they bought 1/2 the electrical products on the planet. Their rack cabinets are abysmally engineered, you cannot remove the doors when they are bolted together without opening the next cabinet, the APC UPS's... I digress, the Schneider 100A is $1500, it is in a HUGE cabinet. Not a problem with unlimited wall space, and we are also more proud if it than Victron. Blue sounds like a better deal.

Unfortunately, the more boxes you have the more likely *one* will fail. It's purely statistical. Longer term all this stuff will continually get more reliable, and less expensive, at which the more modular approach will fade.
 
Tomthumb62 said:
I tried Linux for 6 months. Something as simple as installing a program was so complicated. In Windows you just double click the install file. Why did Linux have to make it so complicated?

Better is relative. Better for computer engineers, not for regular users IMO.
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How long ago was that? I gave up and put my Dad (94yro) on a Kubuntu box, I haven't had a "What happened" call since. He has no idea, but I did set up a VPN to my data center, so I can poke it every 6 months or so. I like to fiddle, this desktop is KDE/Plasma on vanilla Debian, but I'm also running Kubuntu on the GF's box. She downloaded the Zoom deb and double clicked it, put in her password, and it installed. It pre-installed LibreOffice, chrome, etc. When she needed a scanner, I verified it would work with Linux, plugged it in, went to the software center, clik'd on 'SimpleScan' (several to choose from) it installed and she started scanning. The only thing most Linux distro's lack is a replacement for Microsoft Outlook. I find it odd nothing has managed to come around on that front, but O365 web is actually tolerable at this point. If you have an old laptop laying around you might try Lubuntu or Mint. If you need Autodesk Inventor or some other Windows only application/game then you are right. Steam actually runs well on Linux with supported games.
 
ksmithaz1 said:
How long ago was that? I gave up and put my Dad (94yro) on a Kubuntu box, I haven't had a "What happened" call since. He has no idea, but I did set up a VPN to my data center, so I can poke it every 6 months or so. I like to fiddle, this desktop is KDE/Plasma on vanilla Debian, but I'm also running Kubuntu on the GF's box. She downloaded the Zoom deb and double clicked it, put in her password, and it installed. It pre-installed LibreOffice, chrome, etc. When she needed a scanner, I verified it would work with Linux, plugged it in, went to the software center, clik'd on 'SimpleScan' (several to choose from) it installed and she started scanning. The only thing most Linux distro's lack is a replacement for Microsoft Outlook. I find it odd nothing has managed to come around on that front, but O365 web is actually tolerable at this point. If you have an old laptop laying around you might try Lubuntu or Mint. If you need Autodesk Inventor or some other Windows only application/game then you are right. Steam actually runs well on Linux with supported games.
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I tried several distributions. Mint, Ubuntu and a few others I can’t recall the name of. Plus I needed WINE to work and couldn’t get it to work. I tried dual boot for a while but didn’t see the point.
 
Rednecktek said:
And hardware wise? Everything works great if it's all Victron. :rolleyes:
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Gottay say... This doesn't make a lot of sense. People routinely mix and match Victron components with others. Folks use Smartshunts on non-Victron systems.

Victron is designed to work with grid-tied inverters... though they make none themselves. They'll happily integrate a Fronius PV string inverter into the ecosystem... Because users wanted it...

Victron makes batteries with multiple BMS options, yet my DIY NMC battery/Batrium BMS monstrocity interfaces lusciously with my Victron hardware. Orion, REC and other BMS natively interface with Victron. Industrious developers have written drivers for using JBD, JK, etc., BMS with Victron.

AiOs? How does an EG4, Growatt or MPP Solar unit interface with other brands? No better or worse than Victron. I could easily put a different MPPT on my system, and it would work fine. There would just be no communication between the ecosystem and the other MPPT.

I get that the price enrages you. I place great value on reliability and peace of mind. My units are coming up on 4 years old. I can count the number of problems I've had on one hand... All but one were my doing. The only one that might have been Victron related was the unit simply stopped communicating with VRM and eventually required a full power cycle (not just reboot) to reset the ethernet interface. Once it came back, it uploaded the 26 days worth of data it stored on the MicroSD card. Also hard to definitively blame Victron for this... it stopped logging coincident with a massive downpour that included several nearby lightning strikes - likely on the parcel of land itself. Worth noting that the GX continued to control the system perfectly... just no logging on VRM.
 
ksmithaz1 said:
Midnight: $2550/120A/ ?1? String. Seriously proud of that one, ...

Unfortunately, the more boxes you have the more likely *one* will fail. It's purely statistical. Longer term all this stuff will continually get more reliable, and less expensive, at which the more modular approach will fade.
Click to expand...

That would be the newer bigger better model, don't have field results for it yet.

When was the last time you heard of a Midnight Classic failing?
I'm aware of one, a forum member who had one fail. Midnight warranty replaced it. That failed. Midnight warranty replaced it. That failed. Midnight declined to replace after "third time's a charm".
 
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