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100Ah 12v Sodium Battery (Specifications Sheet Supplied)

OffGridForGood

OffGridForGood

Catch, make or grow everything you can.
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I asked, and they answered:
YES - a Sodium Cell 100Ah 12v (and 24v) are now available.
The specification sheet supplied is attached for review.
First thing that jumps out at me, Operating temps neg 20c to pos 55c (-4F to 131F) WOW even the guys in AZ/TX can get behind those values!
Second thing, the cells are cylinder cells, 33mmdia x 140mm long (1.25" x 5.5")
Third thing - they operate at a far wider range of voltages than we see with LFP/LA -
Next up, prices and a spec sheet for their 24vDC unit.
 

Attachments

  • Sodium 12V100AhBT-4S10P-OC100A-Cell33140.pdf
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111 Wh/kg cell energy density. 0.2C nominal charge/discharge rate. 3000 cycles to 80% remaining capacity at 25 degC.
 
each of these has an upgrade to 150A output (to suit my own needs) at an extra cost, normal units are limited to 100A output, and would be $30 lower price per battery. These are not server racks, just plastic case batteries like all the ones Will has cut apart and tested in the past.
100Ah 24vDC Sodium $350 plus ship
225Ah 24vDC Sodium $660 plus ship
300Ah 24vDC Sodium $960 plus ship

I am considering getting one 100A 12v and one 100A 24v to test them out. The main issue I see is the voltage range, since the sodium cells operate in a wider range of voltage, your inverter may not be capable of going low enough to utililize the full capacity of the battery - ie you will not be able to use the full "100Ah" of the battery perhaps.
I wonder if Will would be interested to get one and cut it up on video for everyone to see? (or has he already tested some Sodium batteries already?)
 
I think it's better to wait until they start making them in prismatic cell format. It looks like these batteries are worse than LFP in every way so far.
 
Up-date - the Sodium batteries are here!
They arrived at about 60% SOC.
I put the 24v 100Ah pack on my 24v mobile system to charge it up. I set the max charge voltage to 30v (pack lists 31.2 as max voltage)
Connected to the MPP 2724 it runs "stuff" exactly the same - as far as I can tell so far - as the LFP did.
First tests: ran a 5" angle grinder for 30 minutes in minus 15C weather - no issues, battery didn't shut down.
Second test: ran the MIG 10 (flux core) welding up some unistrut for the new JA 550 tilting frames going up on the West roof. Ran that fine as well.
I wondered if the MPP 2724 was going to freak out getting 30v supply from the battery but it didn't seem to notice. Maybe it is too "dumb" to know better that a 24v battery normally doesn't run this high a voltage...later this week I will try charging the Sodium battery up to the max listed 31.2volts and see if the 2724 will chew on that okay as well.
The MPP 2724 manual shows max voltage 31v. so should be okay near max voltage.
At the low voltage end, the Sodium can go down to 18v, not sure what the Inverter can manage at the low end.
 
Vigo said:
This is really interesting, please keep up with the updates as you learn more!
Click to expand...
Thanks for your reply - sometimes wonder if I am just chatting to myself, or if people are following along to see what I find out about these packs.
Next test tonight, I will try the 12v 100Ah Sodium battery connected to the MPP 1012 inverter. This small inverter is not able to run high amperage loads, it is limited to 1000 W (about 8A 120v) ie typical small hand-held corded tools but not skillsaws, chop-saws big stuff, more like drills, grinders, jigsaw, dremel kind of tools)
The 12v Sodium battery pack indicates it will operate between 8 and 15.6 volts,
checking the MPP 1012, the manual indicates it can accept voltage down to 7.6 volts and up to 14.2 volts, but the default low cut-off voltage is 10.2v (user can change to any value however). The 12v Sodium battery arrived at about 60% SOC and I put it on a bench supply set to 14.2v to match the inverter manual limit. This voltage will be lower than 100% SOC for the battery and it will mean some reduced capacity. When the charge is complete I will check what the 14.2v equates to in SOC per the battery BMS (which may not be super accurate, not sure)
Each of the Sodium batteries has BT and from the app can see the individual cell voltages, the run time of the pack, cell temperature and voltage delta. The BMS is locked, and not user adjustable.
I will report back after playing with this pack.
 
Last edited:
OffGridForGood said:
I asked, and they answered:
YES - a Sodium Cell 100Ah 12v (and 24v) are now available.
The specification sheet supplied is attached for review.
First thing that jumps out at me, Operating temps neg 20c to pos 55c (-4F to 131F) WOW even the guys in AZ/TX can get behind those values!
Second thing, the cells are cylinder cells, 33mmdia x 140mm long (1.25" x 5.5")
Third thing - they operate at a far wider range of voltages than we see with LFP/LA -
Next up, prices and a spec sheet for their 24vDC unit.
Click to expand...
I take it that discharge is not possible below -20°C or -4°F?

I have a son that wants to put a billboard on his farmland and wants it lighted, powered by solar as there isn't utility power there. I didn't ask what the billboard is for........... kids. :)
 
From what I have read, they tested these down to -30C with discharge limited to 0.2C (20% of capacity).
but for charging the cells need to be warmer -10C or more, and again with 0.2C charge rate until the pack is warmer.
If he used these batteries for a sign board, in an area below -10 with solar for charging, he would want the solar linked to a relay that runs a heating pad first, then charging current once the pack is above -10C in an insulated box. That or some other way to keep the battery from being below -10 during charging.
May be easier to just use AGM battery instead, depending on low temperatures in his area.
 
OffGridForGood said:
Thanks for your reply - sometimes wonder if I am just chatting to myself, or if people are following along to see what I find out about these packs.
Next test tonight, I will try the 12v 100Ah Sodium battery connected to the MPP 1012 inverter. This small inverter is not able to run high amperage loads, it is limited to 1000 W (about 8A 120v) ie typical small hand-held corded tools but not skillsaws, chop-saws big stuff, more like drills, grinders, jigsaw, dremel kind of tools)
The 12v Sodium battery pack indicates it will operate between 8 and 15.6 volts,
checking the MPP 1012, the manual indicates it can accept voltage down to 7.6 volts and up to 14.2 volts, but the default low cut-off voltage is 10.2v (user can change to any value however). The 12v Sodium battery arrived at about 60% SOC and I put it on a bench supply set to 14.2v to match the inverter manual limit. This voltage will be lower than 100% SOC for the battery and it will mean some reduced capacity. When the charge is complete I will check what the 14.2v equates to in SOC per the battery BMS (which may not be super accurate, not sure)
Each of the Sodium batteries has BT and from the app can see the individual cell voltages, the run time of the pack, cell temperature and voltage delta. The BMS is locked, and not user adjustable.
I will report back after playing with this pack.
Click to expand...
Very interested in your results. Nice your inverter operates 7.6 - 14.2 Volts
 
8v - 14.2v per the inverter manual. Guess we will SEE!
I wouldn't hesitate to try pushing that 14.2 up a few decimal points, 14.4, see what happens, 14.6 see what happens.
But not until trying out the combo at the prescribed voltage first, and checking just what capacity may be lost from 14.2 to 15.6 - ie no sense pushing my luck with the inverter if the Ahr lost to the very top is not significant.

I want this pack for a field truck to run some small utility tools when no power is near-by during the day, and it will be in the shop at night (where it is warm) to charge up again for the next day. should work well, I hope, we will see.
 
OffGridForGood said:
From what I have read, they tested these down to -30C with discharge limited to 0.2C (20% of capacity).
but for charging the cells need to be warmer -10C or more, and again with 0.2C charge rate until the pack is warmer.
If he used these batteries for a sign board, in an area below -10 with solar for charging, he would want the solar linked to a relay that runs a heating pad first, then charging current once the pack is above -10C in an insulated box. That or some other way to keep the battery from being below -10 during charging.
May be easier to just use AGM battery instead, depending on low temperatures in his area.
Click to expand...
The problem with lead acid in this area is when endless days of clouds come in winter. Would take a good sized lead acid bank to make that work and still lead to reduced lifespan due to absorption charge never completing.

If he will need a heating pad and insulated box, the choice would be LFP instead. Good sized battery with PV running the heating pad. It is possible to go underground to an extent, might help.
 
Underground insulated box would help to limit heat loss, add a heater to hold the temps above zero for LFP or above -10 for Sodium.
for his application the LFP is readily available and we know how it operates already. I feel we will be learning about Sodium for awhile until it has been in general use, tested and pushed to reveil it's limitations. For his sign board, a nearly vertical PV panel to be sure no snow on it all winter may also be a good idea, could be tilted down for summer - or just leave it alone, if it collects enough energy each day.
I built a DIY pack with heating pads with LFP cells, but they make self-heating factory battery packs too.
 
The 12v Sodium battery pack indicates it will operate between 8 and 15.6 volts,
checking the MPP 1012, the manual indicates it can accept voltage down to 7.6 volts and up to 14.2 volts, but the default low cut-off voltage is 10.2v (user can change to any value however).
Click to expand...
Since a lot of inverters wont go to the edges of that voltage range, one of the things id like to know if how much capacity is left 'on the table' if an inverter won't go below 10.0 or won't go above 15, etc.
 
Vigo said:
Since a lot of inverters wont go to the edges of that voltage range, one of the things id like to know if how much capacity is left 'on the table' if an inverter won't go below 10.0 or won't go above 15, etc.
Click to expand...
Will try to check this out for you Vigo, and post what I find out.
 
Vigo said:
Since a lot of inverters wont go to the edges of that voltage range, one of the things id like to know if how much capacity is left 'on the table' if an inverter won't go below 10.0 or won't go above 15, etc.
Click to expand...
On the 12v Soduim battery, charging to the max of my inverter voltage (per the MPP 1012 manual) at 14.2 the battery BMS indicates this is 81% SOC.
I havent pulled it down to the minimum yet, but looks like the inverter default low voltage cut off is 10v but can be set lower to match the battery low voltage cut off.
I will run it down, and see what SOC the batter BMS indicates at 10v.
Then I will recharge it up, but go a bit above the 14.2 to see if the inverter will handle it.
 
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