Connecting 20 wind turbines in series to MPPt ?!

[elvis_asaftei]

I am searching for a way to connect 20 wind turbines to 48V battery bank, we have 10 wind turbines of 48v and 10 of 24V both are 10A wind turbines. Because distance is 100m to battery I wanted to connect output from wind controller in series and go to 350V input of standard MPPT solar inverter.
This seems it is not working because 2 or 3 of them always get locked and do not spin and also speed is not correctly optimized.

I wanted to have this setup to save a huge cost for 10 cables x 100m x 10amps

And use only 2 cables at 350V -400V with working mppt from 120v to 450V .

Anyone has any idea if this setup can work with addition of other diodes ?

My solution remaining to do is that I will have 2 very large wires from 48V battery pack to the wind turbines and use one wind controller for each wind turbine .

Any suggestions how to connect 20 wind turbines ?

 

[Samsonite801]

Disclaimer, I am not an expert in wind turbines per se (done lots of reading and studying about it), I am good with generators and alternators in general, but never yet toyed with my own wind turbine application, so just saying...

In my eyes, I see sometimes, there is called 'the highly or most optimal way', and 'the cheapest way', to get a job done, and a balance of those two ends of the spectrum.

I see you are most likely attempting to balance and find the best way (perhaps without going broke), to get things best that they can be, but at the most reasonable cost.

That said...

In my opinion, I see series wiring to be problematic at best (for the reasons you had mentioned), as in you say 2 or 3 can lock up and kill the whole chain... If I did try to run series (like maybe on the 24v turbines), I would only try maybe in pairs only (only 2 in a string, and physically mounted close to each other), as it would get more problematic, the more turbines which are involved in a string.

In solar, I see series works, because it's easy to get same or similar voltage out of multiple panels in a string, but in wind, it seems with a mechanical aspect involved, it would just be something I would not want to fight with.

I would much rather see a parallel type system (more fault-tolerant as well for redundancy). You had also mentioned about using a solar MPPT controller at first, but later talked about possibly using one 'wind controller' for each turbine. I would rather use wind controller than me trying to adapt an MPPT controller (unless I really knew what I was doing).

I own a MidNite Classic 250 MPPT controller and while I've never used it for wind yet myself, I do know they provide them with wind curves built-in on the settings so they can run optimized on a turbine... I bought mine off an eBay seller who sells refurbed ones at a great price with guarantee. If it were me (with my limited wind knowledge), I would rather wire in parallel, run fatter lower voltage cable on the home run back...

One thing I don't know about with wind, can you wire multiple wind turbines to a single controller (while in parallel)? Could a MidNite Classic 250 be wired to several wind turbines as long as it has the amperage to handle the max input? In my mind it seems like it would work. Assuming with parallel application, the diodes would be used to keep power from backfeeding to an adjacent turbine on the same circuit?

I would have to research all about that stuff, it is interesting though. I am planning to get more into wind, since our co-op ranch has a lot of it, as per why I bought one MidNite Classic 250, so I could start playing with a prototype.

 

[elvis_asaftei]

Disclaimer, I am not an expert in wind turbines per se (done lots of reading and studying about it), I am good with generators and alternators in general, but never yet toyed with my own wind turbine application, so just saying...

In my eyes, I see sometimes, there is called 'the highly or most optimal way', and 'the cheapest way', to get a job done, and a balance of those two ends of the spectrum.

I see you are most likely attempting to balance and find the best way (perhaps without going broke), to get things best that they can be, but at the most reasonable cost.

That said...

In my opinion, I see series wiring to be problematic at best (for the reasons you had mentioned), as in you say 2 or 3 can lock up and kill the whole chain... If I did try to run series (like maybe on the 24v turbines), I would only try maybe in pairs only (only 2 in a string, and physically mounted close to each other), as it would get more problematic, the more turbines which are involved in a string.

In solar, I see series works, because it's easy to get same or similar voltage out of multiple panels in a string, but in wind, it seems with a mechanical aspect involved, it would just be something I would not want to fight with.

I would much rather see a parallel type system (more fault-tolerant as well for redundancy). You had also mentioned about using a solar MPPT controller at first, but later talked about possibly using one 'wind controller' for each turbine. I would rather use wind controller than me trying to adapt an MPPT controller (unless I really knew what I was doing).

I own a MidNite Classic 250 MPPT controller and while I've never used it for wind yet myself, I do know they provide them with wind curves built-in on the settings so they can run optimized on a turbine... I bought mine off an eBay seller who sells refurbed ones at a great price with guarantee. If it were me (with my limited wind knowledge), I would rather wire in parallel, run fatter lower voltage cable on the home run back...

One thing I don't know about with wind, can you wire multiple wind turbines to a single controller (while in parallel)? Could a MidNite Classic 250 be wired to several wind turbines as long as it has the amperage to handle the max input? In my mind it seems like it would work. Assuming with parallel application, the diodes would be used to keep power from backfeeding to an adjacent turbine on the same circuit?

I would have to research all about that stuff, it is interesting though. I am planning to get more into wind, since our co-op ranch has a lot of it, as per why I bought one MidNite Classic 250, so I could start playing with a prototype.

Hi, thanks for the the answer. Regarding wiring wind turbines in parallel to the same controller it is not possible with AC because wind turbines will slow each other because of different frequency and that it is not a synchronized wave. If you mean to add DC output from rectifier bridge to solar mppt input than both will have to run at same speed (this never happens to wind) and you will most of the time get power only from the one that is spinning faster, so not a good idea.
I have added one 48V $120 controller for each turbine that will optimize and boost voltage for each wind turbine. Picture below.

I have 4 wires of 100m long 40Amps max already installed from wind turbines to 48v battery bank so if nobody has any idea how to use maybe a CC or CV boost voltage with diodes I will have to run them all in parallel and that will work for sure, just cable cost is too high.
An important aspect for the controllers is that they are build to have battery voltage at a output so if they are put in series and one of them has above 60V it initiates the breaking of wind turbine and if voltage is lower it can not run because it shuts down every time wind turbine from it can’t produce voltage above 40V …

Any suggestion is welcomed. Thanks.

 

[elvis_asaftei]

Anyone with a suggestion for best way to do this ?

 

[chrisski]

At fiedlines.com, there are some guys that are very active at answering questions on windmills and are powering there house with it.

 

[Samsonite801]

If you mean to add DC output from rectifier bridge to solar mppt input than both will have to run at same speed (this never happens to wind) and you will most of the time get power only from the one that is spinning faster, so not a good idea.

Yeah I had been assuming the outputs were already rectified DC output...

I have 4 wires of 100m long 40Amps max already installed from wind turbines to 48v battery bank so if nobody has any idea how to use maybe a CC or CV boost voltage with diodes I will have to run them all in parallel and that will work for sure, just cable cost is too high.

How much is this cable cost that you had estimated? What gauge would you need?


I don't even know if this is feasible or the optimal in this situation (there could be some minor efficiency loss perhaps), but I know these types of things like boost converters have been getting more efficient over the years.

I wonder if 4 of these in parallel (one on each of your home run cables), could lower the amperage enough to give a bit more capacity on your existing wire run?

Example:

1800W 40A DC-DC Boost Converter Step Up Power Supply Module Constant US | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 1800W 40A DC-DC Boost Converter Step Up Power Supply Module Constant US at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

(says up to 98.1% efficiency)

Work Features:
-Output power: 1800W
-Input voltage range: 10V-60V
-Output voltage range: 12V-90V
-Input current: 40A
-Output current: 22A
-Dynamic response speed: load current change 5% (300us)
-Conversion efficiency: 48V to 60V 8A (98.1%)
48V to 72V 8A (98.1%)
48V to 84V 8A (97.6%)
-Load regulation: 10% to 50% load ((72V output))
-Temperature coefficient: 50% load
-Ripple & Noise: 20MHz Bandwidth (48V-72V 4A) 100mVp-p
-Switching frequency: VIN=48V VO=72V 4A (110khz)
-No-load current: VIN=48V VO=72V (18mA)
-Output short circuit protection: YES
-Input reverse protection: YES
-Storage humidity: 95%
-Working temperature: -20 65°C
-Storage temperature: -40 125°C
-Temperature rise during work: 48V to 60V 5A (45°C)
-Over temperature protection: (60°C)
-Wiring method: IN input, OUT output (No welding, terminal blocks)
-Cooling method: Strong wind cooling
-Appearance size: 130 (L) * 51 (W) * 80(H) ( with copper pillars) mm
-Package Contents:
1800W 40A DC-DC Boost Converter Step Up Power Supply Module Constant Current"


(Read the rest of the product description on the auction link above) They do even say you can connect the input to solar panels or 'wind power' on the description...

Or a similar boost converter that might have the kind of specs you'd need, if these weren't appropriate. It would require your own testing, so there would be some chance they could become paperweights if you later found they were not useful and you had to go buy thicker cable anyways, but it seems like a solution like this could possibly work.

 

[OzSolar]

I am searching for a way to connect 20 wind turbines to 48V battery bank, we have 10 wind turbines of 48v and 10 of 24V both are 10A wind turbines.

How about you just install one turbine first then see how it does before you install 20. Dang... that would be a site though.