Crimp Alone -vs- Crimp + Solder

[Johno1066]

Surface to surface connectivity, there will be more good contact with a soldered lug than a crimped lug and if the soldered lug is crimped it will still have superior surface contact with a greater mechanical strength.

 

[JeepHammer]

Actual silver will pull copper off heavy conductors. The silver is stronger than the copper.

It's difficult to get the point across, but silver soldering is very old, very strong. One example is gun site blades, under barrel lugs, etc. It's not like they fall off regularly.

At no time did I recommend NOT crimping. I always crimp first, then solder.

If a solder only connection overheats, the solder can boil out and let the conductor loose.
Mechanical connection CRIMP, electrical connection, silver solder, it's just not that difficult, costly or hard to learn.

 

[BuffaloTrace]

My uncle loves his lead acid setup and will likely never make the switch to more modern energy storage...that being said, I assume a more corrosive environment is made when wires are around off-gassing lead acid batteries. He ALWAYS crimps and solder seals his joints with a silver solder. Also he's worked professionally in the automotive business for 30 years. I think it's overkill for most installs in non corrosive environments, but for longevity he swears by it and never has to remake his wires again.

 

[JeepHammer]

My uncle loves his lead acid setup and will likely never make the switch to more modern energy storage...that being said, I assume a more corrosive environment is made when wires are around off-gassing lead acid batteries. He ALWAYS crimps and solder seals his joints with a silver solder. Also he's worked professionally in the automotive business for 30 years. I think it's overkill for most installs in non corrosive environments, but for longevity he swears by it and never has to remake his wires again.

I started 30 years ago with lead/acid, corrosion behing a HUGE problem. I finally stumbled on industral batteries, think big fork trucks, underground mining equipment...

The steel case made a collar around cells, vapors being contained, and it was a constant, never ending battle.

Silver bearing solder slowed all that WAY down, I'm still using some of those cables to this day.

Most people discount what just oxygen/water does to copper, and moisture CAN get inside insulation jackets, corrode where you can't see it...
It's slower than acid, but it's a very real factor over the life of the system, and to the efficiency of the system.

Between the increased conductive surface area, corrosion control, and ease of the job, I still so it. You CAN use grease, all kinds of sealer, whatever, but I find a layer of solder to be permanent and trustworthy, good for the life of the terminal/cable most times.

 

[Checkthisout]

You want to crimp first, then solder.

Use low temp solder and a propane or Mapp gas torch to gently heat.

Also, you can just go down a gauge on your wiring. This ensures that a bit of resistance at a crimp won't be an issue.

It's also less of an issue since 48volts seems to be the norm now for anything but mobile.

 

[BuffaloTrace]

I currently have not "tinned" or pre soldered my nicely crimped cables, I do use heat shrink tubing with the glue to "seal" up the crimp which I find works well for my lifepo4 backup system components which are kept indoors and in non corrosive environments. That being said; if the system was used in a more harsh environment ie coastal weather, marine, lead acid, etc., then I would be silver soldering all terminations.

 

[Tomthumb62]

And so do does an extreme pressure crimp joint, where the malleable metal actually flows and fills any voids, keeping out the contaminants.

So do you think a heavy duty Wilton bench vise can create enough pressure to crimp? I have the hex dies but not hydraulic hand tool.

Now I do have a small 10T hydraulic press, but it’sa pain to setup and use. The bench vise would be much easier to use. I only need to do 6 crimps on 2 AWG cable.

 

[Warpspeed]

A ten ton press should do it, but I know what you mean about being a real pain to set up. But if you only have a very few to do, it might still be worth the trouble.

I don't know how much pressure a large compound cable crimper can exert, but the exact same mechanism used in large bolt cutters can sheer through a high tensile padlock in an instant.
It can certainly crush down copper to the point where it flows.
A ten ton press might do it if the whole ten tons is concentrated down onto the crimp.
I also have a home made ten ton press here, so have a pretty fair idea of what that might be capable of.

This is what I have, its not hydraulic, purely mechanical with handles three feet long. Its quite awkward to use, but sure works really well on the big stuff.
This is a picture I found on the internet of something very similar:

 

[Checkthisout]

If on a budget, just get the impact crimper.

It does a good e'nuff job.

Mofeez Hammer Lug Crimper Tool for 8 AWG - 0000 AWG Battery and Welding Cables https://a.co/d/6bLqcve

 

[Crowz]

I hydraulic crimp anything 10 gauge or smaller now and have always crimped 6 gauge or smaller in the past. I loath trying to crimp the smaller stuff since it requires using the pliers style crimpers and usually solder it since I can't get small non hydraulic crimps to work worth a flip.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

I hydraulic crimp anything 10 gauge or smaller now and have always crimped 6 gauge or smaller in the past. I loath trying to crimp the smaller stuff since it requires using the pliers style crimpers and usually solder it since I can't get small non hydraulic crimps to work worth a flip.

I have a couple pair of different iwiss crimpers that are ok with 10ga through 16ga and the BougeRV the do ok for 8ga-12ga MC4 terminals. All ‘B’ crimps.
I use the bicep-builder pictured above for 1/0 through 6ga. I can ‘progressively’ finagle them on 2/0 but I think I’m ruining them doing that.

just get the impact crimper.
It does a good e'nuff job

I have one and I have used it on 2/0 and 3/0 but you sorta have to do three or four stages to get an acceptable crimp imho; one mighty wack with a 3lbs hammer will do the deed but not nicely swaged as I’d like. The hex crimpers for ~$35 do an acceptable or excellent job 99.44% of the time.

 

[Checkthisout]

I have a couple pair of different iwiss crimpers that are ok with 10ga through 16ga and the BougeRV the do ok for 8ga-12ga MC4 terminals. All ‘B’ crimps.
I use the bicep-builder pictured above for 1/0 through 6ga. I can ‘progressively’ finagle them on 2/0 but I think I’m ruining them doing that.

I have one and I have used it on 2/0 and 3/0 but you sorta have to do three or four stages to get an acceptable crimp imho; one mighty wack with a 3lbs hammer will do the deed but not nicely swaged as I’d like. The hex crimpers for ~$35 do an acceptable or excellent job 99.44% of the time.

Heat shrink hides the ugly.

 

[time2roll]

Solder is for small electronics boards. Power transmission should be crimped only. Otherwise we would be soldering our home wiring.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

Heat shrink hides the ugly.

The esthetics is not my concern. It’s 100% contact that interests me.

 

[Checkthisout]

Solder is for small electronics boards. Power transmission should be crimped only. Otherwise we would be soldering our home wiring.

Mechanical clamping devices hold household wiring, not crimps.

 

[oldmaninsaline]

I'm in the middle of creating a series of posts detailing the design and build of my power station. This paragraph is included in it:

I'm sure someone will point out that crimping is better than soldering which is true but only in an environment where the connections are expected to flex (called flexion stress). This is because the heating of the copper strands during the solder process can make the strands brittle. This can also be mitigated by using 2 shrink tubing layers. I've bought products with and made far too many crimp connections to trust them at all. If I had a dime for every time a product I bought had a crappy crimp connection.

 

[Tomthumb62]

This can also be mitigated by using 2 shrink tubing layers.

That’sa great idea.

By the way, I recently found some 2awg cables I had crimped then soldered. Corroded and oxidized nearly all the way through the 2 feet of cable. My solder skills are poor and I’m pretty sure I overheated the wire. Just a warning to those who haven’t perfected their soldering skills…crimping is easier even if it’s not quite the best.

 

[12VoltInstalls]

Mechanical clamping devices hold household wiring, not crimps.

Well that’s funny to me ?

Traditionally, my argument for wiring incorporates three elements: mechanical connection, electrical 100% contact, and environmental durability. Ptoper crimping and heat shrink sorta does all three simultaneously. A crimp is mechanical clamping.

 

[Checkthisout]

Well that’s funny to me ?

Traditionally, my argument for wiring incorporates three elements: mechanical connection, electrical 100% contact, and environmental durability. Ptoper crimping and heat shrink sorta does all three simultaneously. A crimp is mechanical clamping.

True.

 

[oldmaninsaline]

That’sa great idea.

By the way, I recently found some 2awg cables I had crimped then soldered. Corroded and oxidized nearly all the way through the 2 feet of cable. My solder skills are poor and I’m pretty sure I overheated the wire. Just a warning to those who haven’t perfected their soldering skills…crimping is easier even if it’s not quite the best.

I have found that to be the case on virtually every wire over a few years old for the past 55 years I've been soldering various bits and bobs. I suppose I have enough experience at this point to be considered something of an expert. I've never really researched it but I would think the gas permeability of the insulation plays a role. Not to mention that I've replaced cables on wet cell battery banks fairly often. I have high hopes now that I'm using lifepo4.

One part of the crimp/solder methodology that I use is to tin the wire, clamp the connector and heat the connection as little as possible to achieve the mechanical grip in the connection. It seems to work for me at any rate.