EG4 6000XP & TIGO Dark Start Issues

[JBoffgrid2022]

Hello All,
I am having issues with my system not being able to turn back on if my battery bank depletes and turns the inverter off. Because I have all of my panels connected to TIGO optimizers, they will not allow any power to flow into my inverter because once the inverter shuts off, it initiates a rapid shut down. I have to jerry rig power to the CCA when this happens to allow solar power to run back into the inverter. This is a major pain in the ass, especially if I am away from the camp. I need guidance on how to get my inverter to communicate with the CCA in a way that will allow my system to "wake" back up and allow the solar power to start charging the batteries on its' own. Thank you for your help!

Here is my setup:
EG4 6kW Off-Grid Split Phase Inverter (1)
EG4 LifePower4 Lithium Battery | 48V 100AH (4)
EG4 Enclosed Battery Rack (1)
SunPower 450W Mono Solar Panel (Silver) A-Series Solar Panel (16) 2S8P
TIGO TS4-A-O Optimizers with CCA

 

[Adam De Lay]

I’m not familiar with how it all works together with the 6kXP and the CCA but I just installed some -F modules and the RSS transmitter on my Victron inverters. I had read that “dark start” was a problem when you tie the transmitter to the 120v output of the inverter so I added my own 48 to 12v buck converter to power the RSS transmitter. That way if my inverter shuts down due to low voltage, the battery can still recharge once the sun comes back up.

Again, might be completely different with your install.

I wonder if that’s always gonna be a problem when you have an AIO and the power shuts down due to low voltage?

 

[ozzinok]

I assume you are supplying your CCA via the 6000XP RSD Power output (12v) ... are you sure a RSD is being issued or is it just the result of the supply to the CCA being lost? ... the result will look the same. If it is just loss of supply, you could use an external 12v supply to the CCA as suggested above

 

[DIYrich]

The problem is that the CCA needs power to command the panels to produce power. The CCA takes 10 watts of power at 10-25 volts. If you want a permanent solution:
1) set your inverter to shutdown at 10% SOC. That should leave about 2000 watts in the battery, enough to run the CCA for 10 days.
2) get a Victron Orion-TR 48/24-5 or 48/12-9 to power the CCA.
3) the Orion TR has an on/off 2 wire control. Wire that in parallel with your Stop switch to the inverter.

The Victron will continously power the CCA from the battery. The on/off control will respond to the Stop button to shut off power to the CCA, which will RSD your panels.

Keep an emergency pair of 9v batteries and wiring to power the CCA incase your batteries shutdown.

Option 2:
1) get a ups that has backup and non backup sockets. Make sure it can turn on with battery only.

2) plug the CCA powersupply into a non backed up socket. This keeps the RSD function. Keep the ups off so it doesn't drain its battery.

3) when you need to dark start, plug the CCA powersupply into a backed up socket and turn the ups on.

4) when the battery has some charge, you can move the powersupply back to the non backed up socket.

Note: when you are on the backed up socket, you will not have RSD.

Option 3:
1) 12v battery and battery maintainer.
2) Double Pole, Double Throw switch to switch between Inverter power and battery power.

 

[JBoffgrid2022]

I’m not familiar with how it all works together with the 6kXP and the CCA but I just installed some -F modules and the RSS transmitter on my Victron inverters. I had read that “dark start” was a problem when you tie the transmitter to the 120v output of the inverter so I added my own 48 to 12v buck converter to power the RSS transmitter. That way if my inverter shuts down due to low voltage, the battery can still recharge once the sun comes back up.

Again, might be completely different with your install.

I wonder if that’s always gonna be a problem when you have an AIO and the power shuts down due to low voltage?

My CCA has either direct 24 volt DC power supply input or 110 volt AC power supply that goes into a breaker inside of the CCA that converts the 110 power to 24v. Either way I would have to design a system that would supply constant power to the CCA so it does not initiate the RSD on low power. I would also really like to have a RSD switch that could shut the entire system down in case of an emergency. That being said, I'm pretty sure the TIGO RSD system is designed to shut down only when power is cut to the CCA. I will continue to do more research however and update this thread soon. Thank you all for your replies!

 

[JBoffgrid2022]

I assume you are supplying your CCA via the 6000XP RSD Power output (12v) ... are you sure a RSD is being issued or is it just the result of the supply to the CCA being lost? ... the result will look the same. If it is just loss of supply, you could use an external 12v supply to the CCA as suggested above

I am not 100% sure an RSD is issues when this happens. Would my TIGO app report this kind of information? I have the TIGO software is pretty jangy so far, not a huge fan of it honestly.

 

[JBoffgrid2022]

The problem is that the CCA needs power to command the panels to produce power. The CCA takes 10 watts of power at 10-25 volts. If you want a permanent solution:
1) set your inverter to shutdown at 10% SOC. That should leave about 2000 watts in the battery, enough to run the CCA for 10 days.
2) get a Victron Orion-TR 48/24-5 or 48/12-9 to power the CCA.
3) the Orion TR has an on/off 2 wire control. Wire that in parallel with your Stop switch to the inverter.

The Victron will continously power the CCA from the battery. The on/off control will respond to the Stop button to shut off power to the CCA, which will RSD your panels.

Keep an emergency pair of 9v batteries and wiring to power the CCA incase your batteries shutdown.

Option 2:
1) get a ups that has backup and non backup sockets. Make sure it can turn on with battery only.

2) plug the CCA powersupply into a non backed up socket. This keeps the RSD function. Keep the ups off so it doesn't drain its battery.

3) when you need to dark start, plug the CCA powersupply into a backed up socket and turn the ups on.

4) when the battery has some charge, you can move the powersupply back to the non backed up socket.

Note: when you are on the backed up socket, you will not have RSD.

Option 3:
1) 12v battery and battery maintainer.
2) Double Pole, Double Throw switch to switch between Inverter power and battery power.

I really like option 1 if only i could figure out a way to supply power to the CCA from my battery bank. My battery bank is made up of (4) EG4 LifePower4 100amp batteries in parallel. Would this be putting out too much power to the Victron DC converter?

 

[Adam De Lay]

My CCA has either direct 24 volt DC power supply input or 110 volt AC power supply that goes into a breaker inside of the CCA that converts the 110 power to 24v. Either way I would have to design a system that would supply constant power to the CCA so it does not initiate the RSD on low power. I would also really like to have a RSD switch that could shut the entire system down in case of an emergency. That being said, I'm pretty sure the TIGO RSD system is designed to shut down only when power is cut to the CCA. I will continue to do more research however and update this thread soon. Thank you all for your replies!

Not sure if it will help or give any ideas, but here’s how I set mine up.

 

[AZ Solar Junkie]

My CCA has either direct 24 volt DC power supply input or 110 volt AC power supply that goes into a breaker inside of the CCA that converts the 110 power to 24v. Either way I would have to design a system that would supply constant power to the CCA so it does not initiate the RSD on low power. I would also really like to have a RSD switch that could shut the entire system down in case of an emergency. That being said, I'm pretty sure the TIGO RSD system is designed to shut down only when power is cut to the CCA. I will continue to do more research however and update this thread soon. Thank you all for your replies!

Another thing you can do is to connect your RSD button not only to the 6000xp but also to the AUX terminals on the CCA. That will initiate rapid shutdown on the Tigo CCA even when it is still powered.