Enphase going IoT

[svetz]

From this:

For the first time, you will be able to use the Enphase App to schedule appliances to run during times of peak solar energy production, off-peak energy times, or when energy prices are lowest. And with IQ Batteries, you can run appliances on saved solar power to further control your energy usage.​

Basically, it's the Envoy sending the WiFi signals to turn things on/off based on power settings, set schedule, etc. When there's not enough power for everything, it can even prioritize based on your settings (e.g., charge the battery, then when over 80% activate the EV charger).

Looks like they're going through HomeConnect, not sure how DIYable it be. HomeConnect does support IFFFT, so possibly good news?

 

[svetz]

 

[svetz]

Well phooey... looks like HomeConnect is running on remote servers, so it'll only work when you have internet access.

While great for Californians and people with TOUs... Looks like I'm back to DIY (internet access uses the same right of way as power lines here, so when hurricanes blow them over we lose both power and the internet and it's when I'm without the grid I need the most automation).

 

[Shimmy]

With Thread and Matter this should be much easier in the next 6-12 months based on the industry interest level. Of course, you need everything to be compatible. Upshot is it should all be local.

Personally not a big fan of having my appliances controlled via the cloud. Not sure how anybody thinks that is a good idea.

 

[curiouscarbon]

With Thread and Matter this should be much easier in the next 6-12 months based on the industry interest level. Of course, you need everything to be compatible. Upshot is it should all be local.

Personally not a big fan of having my appliances controlled via the cloud. Not sure how anybody thinks that is a good idea.

the S in IoT stands for security ?

 

[Mattb4]

With Thread and Matter this should be much easier in the next 6-12 months based on the industry interest level. Of course, you need everything to be compatible. Upshot is it should all be local.

Personally not a big fan of having my appliances controlled via the cloud. Not sure how anybody thinks that is a good idea.

Just a friendly reminder from your government power authority:

We see that you are in violation of house thermostat set limits of 68F. Please correct immediately or we will be forced to turn it off remotely. We also notice that you are charging your car outside the officially car charging hours of 12am to 5am. We will be discharging your cars battery back to the grid to make up for any excess.

 

[SeaGal]

Not sure how anybody thinks that is a good idea.

I'm sure all the cloud-based service providers think it is a great idea to collect / share / monetise the gullible user's data

 

[Shimmy]

I'm sure all the cloud-based service providers think it is a great idea to collect / share / monetise the gullible user's data

Most of them do it because it makes their life easier rather than a goal of harvesting data. It is easier to support and easier to add functionality... and easier to charge you a subscription fee.

Some do it to give themselves access to your internal network to see if they can find anything interesting. Others are even more nefarious.

 

[curiouscarbon]

Hanlon's razor - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

having a background in computer science, it is true that simply disrespecting privacy is easier than ensuring it is protected.

when a financial incentive is in play, it becomes more difficult for me to presume innocuous intent.

victron is actually pretty great when it comes to 1) having a formal protocol to interact locally with devices sold and 2) documenting and publishing said protocols.

it is simple for me personally. if a company is too simple to implement a local administration interface, or believes me to be too simple to handle it, Next

 

[teal95]

My daugher's school (and every other school in 2 counties) were shut down for 3 days because someone hacked the shared servers. They ran both the heating and door locks so even after they found the keys to the buildings it took them 5 days (hack was Friday night) to figure out how to get the heating systems off the internet.

 

[zephyranthes]

I’m using the Enphase integration available for Home Assistant running on a Raspberry Pi. It pulls in all the inverters, then all the production and consumption data. Then with some tweaking of the UI, I get this screen for use later on a Fire 10 tablet to control and monitor my home.

The data is what the Envoy is sending out on the local wifi and stays local, so if cellular and internet go down, I still have the Pi running and monitoring my solar panels.

 

[SeaGal]

The data is what the Envoy is sending out on the local wifi and stays local...

Are you sure it stays local? Enphase say it gets uploaded once internet connectivity resumes...

https://support.enphase.com/s/question/0D52G00004k6JpUSAU/how-long-can-the-envoy-collect-data-without-a-data-connection-my-system-is-ethernet-based-and-internet-service-has-been-down-coming-up-on-two-days

Personally I don't like companies that "sell" my data ?‍??, whether it is personal profile, system or usage data, which Enphase do, as detailed here

Privacy Policy | Enphase

enphase.com

And, if one is an Enphase customer, that includes the passing on of data to Facebook ?‍, as mention in their privacy policy above.. "Targeted online advertising includes displaying advertisements on social media through programs offered by partners like Facebook Lookalike Audience. Facebook Lookalike Audience enables us to target users of Facebook who “look like” our existing or prospective customers. A lookalike audience uses an existing custom/tailored audience group as a "seed," which may include identifiers that we provide them like your email, or online identifiers automatically collected by them like your usage information or device data. To this end and as permitted by law, we may transfer your contact data to Facebook, so that an audience of similar users is built on that basis by Facebook."

That usage of personal data not acceptable to me, though of course YMMV.

 

[svetz]

I’m using the Enphase integration available for Home Assistant running on a Raspberry Pi.

I use Enphase's local api on a home-brew program to self log data and with daily generated 6 month authentication tokens I'm GTG for normal outages.

But, what I don't currently have access to is the Envoy's knowledge of excess solar power (e.g., when it throttles back power because there's no demand). If that were available home automation wouldn't be hard to DIY. I think you can get relatively close with an independent solar sensor, but the Envoy has the exact data and it doesn't have another point of failure. Possibly it'll be accessible via the local API, we'll find out after the feature is released.

 

[zephyranthes]

Are you sure it stays local? Enphase say it gets uploaded once internet connectivity resumes...

https://support.enphase.com/s/question/0D52G00004k6JpUSAU/how-long-can-the-envoy-collect-data-without-a-data-connection-my-system-is-ethernet-based-and-internet-service-has-been-down-coming-up-on-two-days

Personally I don't like companies that "sell" my data ?‍??, whether it is personal profile, system or usage data, which Enphase do, as detailed here

Privacy Policy | Enphase

enphase.com

And, if one is an Enphase customer, that includes the passing on of data to Facebook ?‍, as mention in their privacy policy above.. "Targeted online advertising includes displaying advertisements on social media through programs offered by partners like Facebook Lookalike Audience. Facebook Lookalike Audience enables us to target users of Facebook who “look like” our existing or prospective customers. A lookalike audience uses an existing custom/tailored audience group as a "seed," which may include identifiers that we provide them like your email, or online identifiers automatically collected by them like your usage information or device data. To this end and as permitted by law, we may transfer your contact data to Facebook, so that an audience of similar users is built on that basis by Facebook."

That usage of personal data not acceptable to me, though of course YMMV.

When it does connect and Enphase gets my info, what’s some clown (me) with his own solar panel system in the grand scheme of things? I don’t think my information is so special enough to worry myself about what they do with it.

I’ll take precautions but I’m not going to tin-foil hat my way into a tizzy. If there’s some effort for trying to control my production or something, that’s a usb cable unplugged and ip address block away.

 

[zephyranthes]

I use Enphase's local api on a home-brew program to self log data and with daily generated 6 month authentication tokens I'm GTG for normal outages.

But, what I don't currently have access to is the Envoy's knowledge of excess solar power (e.g., when it throttles back power because there's no demand). If that were available home automation wouldn't be hard to DIY. I think you can get relatively close with an independent solar sensor, but the Envoy has the exact data and it doesn't have another point of failure. Possibly it'll be accessible via the local API, we'll find out after the feature is released.

I’m guessing this is frequency shifting to shut down the microinverters? From what I’ve seen on here, there isn’t any throttling as in any value from 0-100% but either all on or all off, unless you know something I don’t know.

 

[curiouscarbon]

When it does connect and Enphase gets my info, what’s some clown (me) with his own solar panel system in the grand scheme of things? I don’t think my information is so special enough to worry myself about what they do with it.

I’ll take precautions but I’m not going to tin-foil hat my way into a tizzy. If there’s some effort for trying to control my production or something, that’s a usb cable unplugged and ip address block away.

check when power usage patterns suggest domicile vacancy to facilitate robbery is a really simple one.

you are free to be indifferent ?

i am free to reject any product that sells my personal information ??

the mere fact that you are aware of IP blocking means you are ahead of the curve by a longshot ?

no privacy by default leaves people open to abuse potential. what oversight systems prevent a jilted lover working at enphase from stalking the person that left them for their aggressive behavior?

kind regards ?️

 

[Shimmy]

check when power usage patterns suggest domicile vacancy to facilitate robbery is a really simple one.

Yeah, I wouldn't trust a company trying to sell my data with the utility loads. It is amazing just how easy it is to tell what is going on in the house with detailed load information.

 

[svetz]

I’m guessing this is frequency shifting to shut down the microinverters? From what I’ve seen on here, there isn’t any throttling as in any value from 0-100% but either all on or all off, unless you know something I don’t know.

For throttling you need either need the sunlight backup setup or IQ batteries. I have batteries and they throttle for me when off-grid.

I looked at it a couple of years back and I'm pretty sure they were throttling without frequency shifting. Enphase, like all newer UL1741 listed inverters, supports throttling via frequency shifting so the utility can throttle them back. But I suspect frequency shifting is too slow for them with their "sunlight" solution (e.g., no batteries) and throttling is handled via the highspeed powerline communications.

It's a good idea though. I should retest just to be sure, if it was frequency shifting I'd obviously have exactly the data needed to calculate excess power.

 

[svetz]

...check when power usage patterns suggest domicile vacancy ... That's the problem with living in paradise, there's nowhere better to visit. Or in my case, who can afford to go anywhere? Even if they had that data, it's probably a very small percentage of people that have such a well-partitioned life that anyone could accurately predict when the place will be empty. I'm not saying it couldn't happen, I'm saying why crooks smart enough for that wouldn't be interested in small fry like me and probably became politicians. The typical crooks around here do it the old-fashioned way, see if there are vehicles in the carport or ring the doorbell. One of those gizmos (e.g., Ring doorbell) that allows you to talk to who is at your door even when you're away from home is probably far better security.

 

[curiouscarbon]

That's the problem with living in paradise, there's nowhere better to visit. Or in my case, who can afford to go anywhere? Even if they had that data, it's probably a very small percentage of people that have such a well-partitioned life that anyone could accurately predict when the place will be empty. I'm not saying it couldn't happen, I'm saying why crooks smart enough for that wouldn't be interested in small fry like me and probably became politicians. The typical crooks around here do it the old-fashioned way, see if there are vehicles in the carport or ring the doorbell. One of those gizmos (e.g., Ring doorbell) that allows you to talk to who is at your door even when you're away from home is probably far better security.

great points!

using computer to scale up casing of houses is the core problem i have with it.

thankfully, there are plenty of situations in which such digital casing is either less effective, or impractical to act on?

as mentioned, it is the low hanging fruits that get grabbed at. digital surveillance facilitates finding the low hanging fruits.

very glad that you are in a place where risk seems mitigated ?

thank you!