Grounding considerations panel and house

[JJJJ]

I just finished another thread regarding a wiring question and am grateful because the feedback and help it provided was excellent!. It raised another question which I felt should be placed in another thread.

The concept of grounding has gotten a lot of attention. One of the challenges I see is when adding panels to an area where houses are on the grid.

I am not talking about grid tie, but the concerns are related. I was reading through the resources on this topic. The concern I see is if one attaches a ground to different points. In other words, I have a house ground which according to code used the water line. If I then add separate grounding rods for the panels, there is the possibility of differential current flow between the two different "grounding rods" which could create problems.

Even if it does not affect me, it could potentially create problems for a neighbor since I live in a house near others.

The concept I am considering is this. Typically recommendations I am seeing and hearing is to use 2 grounding rods placed in the ground and bonded to each other for consistency. If I were to run an additional line from my main to these two points would it be necessary to detach my water line connection, or if it was "connected to this line" would this be considered a common ground?

If this would work, then I would have a place to attach my panels to. I fully understand that this is not a simple topic but am trying to get my head around this before I proceed to the next phase of the project.

 

[Steve_S]

Your AC Wiring should be grounded properly & independently and using a Water Pipe is fairly common method of doing so.
Solar Panel "Frames & attached metal racking" is NOT a part of the AC Ground and shoudl NOT share a ground. The purpose for ground that metal is for Lightning Protection which must include a Lightning (surge) arrestors.

A very good clear article on this.

How to protect your solar power system from lightning

Lightning is a common cause of failures in photovoltaic (PV) and wind-electric systems. A damaging surge can occur from lightning that strikes a long distance

www.solarinsure.com

 

[kanelr]

I just finished another thread regarding a wiring question and am grateful because the feedback and help it provided was excellent!. It raised another question which I felt should be placed in another thread.

The concept of grounding has gotten a lot of attention. One of the challenges I see is when adding panels to an area where houses are on the grid.

I am not talking about grid tie, but the concerns are related. I was reading through the resources on this topic. The concern I see is if one attaches a ground to different points. In other words, I have a house ground which according to code used the water line. If I then add separate grounding rods for the panels, there is the possibility of differential current flow between the two different "grounding rods" which could create problems.

Even if it does not affect me, it could potentially create problems for a neighbor since I live in a house near others.

The concept I am considering is this. Typically recommendations I am seeing and hearing is to use 2 grounding rods placed in the ground and bonded to each other for consistency. If I were to run an additional line from my main to these two points would it be necessary to detach my water line connection, or if it was "connected to this line" would this be considered a common ground?

If this would work, then I would have a place to attach my panels to. I fully understand that this is not a simple topic but am trying to get my head around this before I proceed to the next phase of the project.

Couple comments, keep the pipe tied to your new double ground rods all grounds made one. Make sure that there are no wiring mistakes tying ground to neutrals after the breaker panel(s). Make sure the lead to the ground is better/ heavier (thicker or shorter, or thicker and shorter) than the old. I would say ground is ground, except for (hard to measure) resistance factors. Have heard 2 stories (rare) where a bad sudden short unsoldered the water pipe fittings, and also the movement toward pex and other plastic piping will phase that away. I literally had to convince an inspector 3 years ago that bonding (bridging) the hot and cold fitting is a water tank was useless because everything was pex, even what he was staring at! Point is change is coming with pipe bonding codes or wording. Not a licensed electrician, but I met one once.

 

[JJJJ]

Just a side note. As I sit here letting my second cup of coffee kick in I am reflecting on the side projects around the house that have come up as a result of this project. It reminds me of the book "Never give a mouse a cookie". Not trying to sidetrack this discussion but found this has been the path for me.

 

[JJJJ]

Just got done reading another thread or two or more on this. I read input from some of the top minds on this topic.

My takeaway is this is not an easy topic. At the end of the day it is worth considering an approach which is supported by the local inspector.

 

[WYtreasure]

Your AC Wiring should be grounded properly & independently and using a Water Pipe is fairly common method of doing so.
Solar Panel "Frames & attached metal racking" is NOT a part of the AC Ground and shoudl NOT share a ground. The purpose for ground that metal is for Lightning Protection which must include a Lightning (surge) arrestors.

A very good clear article on this.

How to protect your solar power system from lightning

Lightning is a common cause of failures in photovoltaic (PV) and wind-electric systems. A damaging surge can occur from lightning that strikes a long distance

www.solarinsure.com

For some reason, which I can't remember at the moment, I saved the link in my "Bad Grounding Info" file.

I wonder if the grounding questions will be answered while I'm still kicking. I know I still have some unanswered questions.

 

[Steve_S]

For some reason, which I can't remember at the moment, I saved the link in my "Bad Grounding Info" file.

I wonder if the grounding questions will be answered while I'm still kicking. I know I still have some unanswered questions.

I followed our Electrical Code for Ontario, Canada and the ESA Inspector was quite pleased, he even said that I was above Code for all of my AC stuff and he liked my DC but now with the restructure & everything I may just get him back in. /me got a tad "too into it"... Dang Virgo-isms... hahaha

 

[WYtreasure]

I followed our Electrical Code for Ontario, Canada and the ESA Inspector was quite pleased, he even said that I was above Code for all of my AC stuff and he liked my DC but now with the restructure & everything I may just get him back in. /me got a tad "too into it"... Dang Virgo-isms... hahaha

Cool, ya just have to smile and puff the chest a bit when the inspector says the word "above".

But what's with the "but now..."?

 

[kanelr]

Cool, ya just have to smile and puff the chest a bit when the inspector says the word "above".

But what's with the "but now..."?

But now that certain forces are....

 

[Steve_S]

Cool, ya just have to smile and puff the chest a bit when the inspector says the word "above".

But what's with the "but now..."?

I am completely reconfiguring the PowerHouse, wiring, battery bank placement and such... Just spent another 6 hours of cutting, crimping, shrinkwrapping and reinstalling all the Battery Lines which are 4/0 due to Run Length & Load Potentials. Might say a Hefty Overhaul to final form.

 

[JJJJ]

I was curious. I know Midnight makes the surge protection for indoors and outdoors. If using indoors, does it have to be at the main panel or can it be used at the solar input before the charge controller?