Off grid people ill-prepared

[EastTexCowboy]

You could find yourself holed up with some weapons, but out of ammunition that fits them. Ten is none?
I was thinking a variety of weapons accepting same cartridge would be useful. But doesn't meet all performance needs. Would want to minimize number of different caliber.

I actually follow that thinking to some extent. 5.56 and 7.62 for centerfire rifle - not going to mix those up, .22LR is all by itself. Mostly 9mm for pistol rounds, although I do have some .40. All of my go to pistols are 9mm. Yeah, there's a .38 special around here somewhere that was given to my wife by an old police chief friend of mine years ago, but I don't see ever using it for anything I can think of. She's a .380 gal and I don't see me every changing that.

I like the thinking of the 9mm carbine for this reason but I haven't bought any yet. Effective range of 100 yds is a little better than pistol but part of that depends on how good you are with a pistol - and which pistol. I'm also a fan of sticking with calibers which are prolific, ergo easier and cheaper to acquire ammo for.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

You could find yourself holed up with some weapons, but out of ammunition that fits them. Ten is none?
I was thinking a variety of weapons accepting same cartridge would be usefu

That why you buy the same caliber in each of the weapons.

I have 7.62x54R rifles, 7.62x51 rifles and 7.62x39 rifles.
I have 1 50BMG for obvious reasons.

That’s the only caliber I own in rifle but many different weapons in that caliber.

Pistol is .45 and 10mm.

The most common round in the country is probably 9mm and 556x45.

Lately have seen some accidents involving 300 BLK out and 223/556 at the range.

 

[EastTexCowboy]

That why you buy the same caliber in each of the weapons.

I have 7.62x54R rifles, 7.62x51 rifles and 7.62x39 rifles.
I have 1 50BMG for obvious reasons.

That’s the only caliber I own in rifle but many different weapons in that caliber.

Pistol is .45 and 10mm.

The most common round in the country is probably 9mm and 556x45.

Lately have seen some accidents involving 300 BLK out and 223/556 at the range.

I've read some stuff on that issue with the 300 BLK. Then my next door neighbor calls me one day last fall to tell me about this cool new AR he bought. I went over to look at it and asked him, why did you decide to go with the 300 blk? He said, huh? I thought it was a 5.56. It probably wouldn't have been as disastrous chambering and firing a 5.56 in the 300, but it just goes to show you how little attention some people pay and how quickly they can get in trouble. Firing a .308 round through a .223 barrel is not going to end well.

 

[Hedges]

That why you buy the same caliber in each of the weapons.

I have 7.62x54R rifles, 7.62x51 rifles and 7.62x39 rifles.

So you could reload with same bullet? (I assume they optimally have different weight.)
But you can't mix n match cartridges

An (underpowered) 9mm rifle (or an Uzi?) would let a couple of firearms share same cartridge.
Same for 223 pistol.
AR-15 adapted to .22 could be useful for small game. The corresponding pistol wouldn't be my first choice for self defense.

I think .22, 9mm, 223, 308 would be about the most readily available. Want to be sure the .556 and .762 equivalent also function well in the weapon. And the 9mm is OK for NATO and +P loads.

Of course some people want other caliber handgun and rifle (increased range, flatter, stopping power for large game.) So you could end up with many different. But 10+ weapons, if mostly different calibers, seems more like collector/enthusiast. Well, shotgun has its special uses. That's one where many types of rounds, whether you're duck hunting or stopping an intruder.

Lately have seen some accidents involving 300 BLK out and 223/556 at the range.

Do tell!
Does it manage to get chambered and fired?

As I said, I wouldn't want anything to fit that was unsafe. It an undersize bullet simply rattled down the barrel, not a catastrophy.

 

[littleharbor2]

Firing a .308 round through a .223 barrel is not going to end well.

Ya think?

 

[littleharbor2]

Of course some people want other caliber handgun and rifle (increased range, flatter, stopping power for large game.)

Guy showed up at the rifle range with a .444 pistol. Heard it before I saw it. Thought he had a cannon.

 

[EastTexCowboy]

So you could reload with same bullet? (I assume they optimally have different weight.)
But you can't mix n match cartridges

An (underpowered) 9mm rifle (or an Uzi?) would let a couple of firearms share same cartridge.
Same for 223 pistol.
AR-15 adapted to .22 could be useful for small game. The corresponding pistol wouldn't be my first choice for self defense.

I think .22, 9mm, 223, 308 would be about the most readily available. Want to be sure the .556 and .762 equivalent also function well in the weapon. And the 9mm is OK for NATO and +P loads.

Of course some people want other caliber handgun and rifle (increased range, flatter, stopping power for large game.) So you could end up with many different. But 10+ weapons, if mostly different calibers, seems more like collector/enthusiast. Well, shotgun has its special uses. That's one where many types of rounds, whether you're duck hunting or stopping an intruder.



Do tell!
Does it manage to get chambered and fired?

As I said, I wouldn't want anything to fit that was unsafe. It an undersize bullet simply rattled down the barrel, not a catastrophy.

Yeah, you would think 10 would be enough. But then you add the backups, because two is one, then you add something for long range like a Ruger Precision 6.5 Creedmoor (sweet rifle), a mouse gun or two, because it's nice sometimes to have something tiny that you can conceal just about anywhere, then there's the inherited guns that you just can't get rid of for sentimental reasons. It adds up. Kinda like any other tools.

There's no single best all-around and everyone has an opinion on what's best. IMO, a .22 rifle is the closest thing to that. Cheap ammo and at least for now easy to come by, lightweight ammo so you can carry a couple hundred rounds and not even notice it, and if you get any of the solid models they are trouble free and last forever with just a little care. My favorite is the Ruger 10/22 but there are a number of good ones. You can take small up to mid-size game with it and in a pinch it's way better than nothing for self defense. Great for training purposes too, and not too loud.

On the 300 Blackout, yeah you can chamber it in a 5.56/.223 rifle. That's why it's such a problem. A .308 projectile with a LOT of powder behind it trying to fit in that .223 exit.
Here's a video where they tested this in a bolt action 5.56. It wasn't catastrophic but only because it was a bolt action and it still did a lot of damage.

And here's one where they fired it through a typical AR-15 5.56. Seriously messed up a perfectly good AR.

At least there's a lot of info out there on it so hopefully most people who would have the 300 ammo are aware of the risk of mixing ammo.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

Do tell!
Does it manage to get chambered and fired?

They put their 300blk in 556 magazine and don’t mark them.

Then they grab mags and come to the range.

The 300blk will chamber and fire in 556 but as you know a 30 caliber round won’t fit through a 22 caliber barrel.

So they end up with squibs.
Most of the 300blk being misused are subsonic so less powder.

First round squibs barrel.

Sometimes breaks the lugs or cracks bolt carrier.
Damage varies.

Not seen it happen just talking with RO and they sent out a email telling everyone to label their mags.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

Ruger Precision

I have that in 308.
Love that rifle.

Best trigger I have ever shot.
Like a glass rod.

I am not engaging anything beyond 300 yards anymore so 308 is enough.

I guess if I really need to I could break out the Barrett.

 

[EastTexCowboy]

I have that in 308.
Love that rifle.

Best trigger I have ever shot.
Like a glass rod.

I am not engaging anything beyond 300 yards anymore so 308 is enough.

I guess if I really need to I could break out the Barrett.

I doubt if I could hit much at even 300 yds anymore but it's still a sweet rifle.

 

[JunglePower]

I was a technician/mechanic all my life. I retired here about ten years ago. We built one house about twenty years ago that was equipped with sixteen poly crystalline PV panels (they don't even sell anymore) and two Outback controllers and an Outback 24v inverter charger. I guess this was state-of-the-art back then. When I first started bring the system back to life, there were eight OLD FLA batteries, bone dry and had melted cells. So this was the house that ended up with the first six BB10012s. They worked fine while I lived there and could monitor them but when i moved out and took on a "caretaker" to live there, I was not vigilant in maintaining the system, trusting the occupants to perform what was necessary, by phone.

This was my very first experience with an off-grid solar power system. I learned a lot. I bought another twenty year old house across the channel on another island. This one also has sixteen Kyocera 100w poly PV panels, a big Xantrex 4800 inverter/charger, a very old Morningstar PWM controller and eight Rolls FLA batteries. All this system was over twenty years old. It was backed-up by a big Kubota powered Toyo diesel generator which I used a lot!

After installing eight new BB10012 batteries and four 400 watt Peimar (Italian) PV panels with a second Morningstar MPPT controller, I have yet to run the generator except for periodic runs to be sure it's OK. Three fridge freezers, clother washer, electric water pump, my welder, grinders etc don't even phase the system.

With nothing to do, I decided to build a small one bedroom cabina BUT design it as an off-grid home. (My play house as my wife calls it.)

At this latitude and for rainwater collection, a one 10 degree sloped roof was facing south by southwest for the best year-round sun for the four Solarland 160w PV panels, another Morningstar MPPT controller and two 12v Lifeline AGM in parallel for a simple 12 volt system, like a boat. No need for extra power, this is for occasional use only. I built a water tank tower adjacent to the roof which collect rainwater to feed two in-wall rainwaterhogs, one for the kitchen and one for the bathroom, all gravity feed. So no need for an electric water pump. The fridge is an Engle 12 volt RV fridge. This system is small but fault-free so far. Funny, I bought all this stuff in anticipation of building a house boat, so it just sat around until I built this little cabina.
I built the cabina the the manner I did after experiencing solar and water in the existing houses. Back then, they built a house and THEN decided how to arrange solar panels, collect and pump rainwater, etc.
I have watched and recorded the positions of the sun and realized, angled south facing panels are not universally acceptable. Know your position and where the sun is, whether in June or December. It makes a big difference. None of my new panels are sloped more than a few degrees and aimed so two are in parallel east and two are in parallel west. Then connected in series. More watts than I ever thought possible.
Creating an off-grid house that has had its positioning and features adapted to depending on the sun and rain is a proper foundation on which to build upon, IMHO.

I invite replies and conversation based on the above. This is an important subject for those who wish this life-style. So many visitors come and stay here and end up draining the power systems and running out of water. Off-grid is a lifestyle in of its own.

Watt is a volt? I need an ampere!?

 

[Nobodybusiness]

I doubt if I could hit much at even 300 yds anymore but it's still a sweet rifle.

Vortex scope help. ?

 

[EastTexCowboy]

Vortex scope help. ?

That's actually what's on it. I just need to get out and shoot some this fall if it ever cools off. But I CAN still hit a coyote at 150 yards at night with a custom AR15 and a Pulsar thermal. When we bought this place there was a coyote problem. Our Dexter calves are small so I couldn't have that going on. Haven't seen a coyote in over a year now. ?

 

[42OhmsPA]

There's no single best all-around and everyone has an opinion on what's best. IMO, a .22 rifle is the closest thing to that. Cheap ammo and at least for now easy to come by, lightweight ammo so you can carry a couple hundred rounds and not even notice it, and if you get any of the solid models they are trouble free and last forever with just a little care. My favorite is the Ruger 10/22 but there are a number of good ones. You can take small up to mid-size game with it and in a pinch it's way better than nothing for self defense. Great for training purposes too, and not too loud.

Agreed. My favorite is my Remington 597. I free floated the barrel, did some trigger mods and added a folding bipod. I don't hesitate to take 100yd shot with it. The damned ground hogs really love it too.
It's also a blast to throw in a 30 rd banana and waste a few bucks every now and then.
I think I'll be picking up a 308 next, something with a Tikka bull barrel...
I also want to get a 9mm carbine since I already have a pile of ammo.
Ahhh more batteries or more guns ?.

 

[Nobodybusiness]

That's actually what's on it. I just need to get out and shoot some this fall if it ever cools off. But I CAN still hit a coyote at 150 yards at night with a custom AR15 and a Pulsar thermal. When we bought this place there was a coyote problem. Our Dexter calves are small so I couldn't have that going on. Haven't seen a coyote in over a year now. ?

Dang those thermals are nice. Expensive though.
I have seen guys hunt feral hogs with those.
Coyotes here are nuisance animals and can be shot on sight.
I’m sure you probably scared them off.

 

[EastTexCowboy]

Dang those thermals are nice. Expensive though.
I have seen guys hunt feral hogs with those.
Coyotes here are nuisance animals and can be shot on sight.
I’m sure you probably scared them off.

Same here. I know I didn't get them all so yeah, probably the rest got the message. I also ran more woven wire on top of the barbed. most of the fencing was already that way but I had part of one side and the back that was only barbed. They can still get through at gates but it cut way down on the coyote traffic and I cut down on the rest.

I bought my thermal about 10 years ago. It was expensive then and hasn't gotten any cheaper. I love it. Hear something at night, go check it out. Looking for a cow in the dark? Makes them easy to find. Neighbor had some weird guy living in their woods. No, I didn't shoot him. But I found him hiding back in the brush. I think it freaked him out because he rabbitted and hasn't been back. They work through rain or fog night or day. Yeah, I'm a fan.

 

[ksmithaz1]

Agreed. My favorite is my Remington 597. I free floated the barrel, did some trigger mods and added a folding bipod. I don't hesitate to take 100yd shot with it. The damned ground hogs really love it too.
It's also a blast to throw in a 30 rd banana and waste a few bucks every now and then.
I think I'll be picking up a 308 next, something with a Tikka bull barrel...
I also want to get a 9mm carbine since I already have a pile of ammo.
Ahhh more batteries or more guns ?.

Depending on where you live... Reality is if you shoot a bad guy they probably won't be over 100yards or so, unless you are sniping. From that perspective iron sights on a nice carbine is hard to beat. I have a really inexpensive High-Point 9mm carbine. A real clunker but quite accurate out to 50+ with the double ring sights. It's a family favorite, used to be cheap to shoot. As someone who toted the ammo box and a barrel for the gunner from time to time, I can tell you 50cal ammo is effing heavy. 9 magazines of 5.56 are not exactly light. Personally I'd rather have 10 times as much 9mm or 5 times as much .45 if I'm on my own in the bushes somewhere. Unlike the movies and video games, you can't pull that trigger an unlimited number of times. I really do like my .45 ASR, and .45 is much easier to reload than 9mm. But have fun and be safe with your mini-cannons ;-)!

 

[42OhmsPA]

Depending on where you live... Reality is if you shoot a bad guy they probably won't be over 100yards or so, unless you are sniping. From that perspective iron sights on a nice carbine is hard to beat. I have a really inexpensive High-Point 9mm carbine. A real clunker but quite accurate out to 50+ with the double ring sights. It's a family favorite, used to be cheap to shoot. As someone who toted the ammo box and a barrel for the gunner from time to time, I can tell you 50cal ammo is effing heavy. 9 magazines of 5.56 are not exactly light. Personally I'd rather have 10 times as much 9mm or 5 times as much .45 if I'm on my own in the bushes somewhere. Unlike the movies and video games, you can't pull that trigger an unlimited number of times. I really do like my .45 ASR, and .45 is much easier to reload than 9mm. But have fun and be safe with your mini-cannons ;-)!

I've had a few friends recommend the High-Point as well. It definitely won't win any beauty contests but I don't give a crap about that as long as it's reliable, accurate and dependable.
You make other great points too, I wouldn't want to live anywhere I'd need the extended range of a 50 cal... Give me a .30/30 lever action Marlin brush buster and I'll be happy, if ammo were readily available.

 

[MurphyGuy]

I've had a few friends recommend the High-Point as well. It definitely won't win any beauty contests but I don't give a crap about that as long as it's reliable, accurate and dependable.
You make other great points too, I wouldn't want to live anywhere I'd need the extended range of a 50 cal... Give me a .30/30 lever action Marlin brush buster and I'll be happy, if ammo were readily available.

High Point? Really?

Get a Glock, a Sig, or even a Beretta...

The average handgun fight takes place at 13 feet (or something ridiculously short like that)

If you want the most reliable weapon on the planet, get a revolver if you can deal with the bulk. Next up is Glock.. and about equal with the Glock is a Sig P226 or P229

As I understand it, High Points can be picky about what ammo you put through them..

Whatever weapon you get, load it with Federal HP rounds..

50 Cal aren't for extended range so much as they are for penetration power. If penetration isn't an issue, a 338 Lapua Magnum would be my choice.. after that, a 300 Winchester Magnum or a 30-06

Strangely enough, the 50 BMG rounds I purchase are cheaper than the 338 Lapua.. by a lot..

 

[42OhmsPA]

High Point? Really?

Get a Glock, a Sig, or even a Beretta...

The average handgun fight takes place at 13 feet (or something ridiculously short like that)

If you want the most reliable weapon on the planet, get a revolver if you can deal with the bulk. Next up is Glock.. and about equal with the Glock is a Sig P226 or P229

As I understand it, High Points can be picky about what ammo you put through them..

Whatever weapon you get, load it with Federal HP rounds..

50 Cal aren't for extended range so much as they are for penetration power. If penetration isn't an issue, a 338 Lapua Magnum would be my choice.. after that, a 300 Winchester Magnum or a 30-06

Strangely enough, the 50 BMG rounds I purchase are cheaper than the 338 Lapua.. by a lot..

Not a pistol high point, the carbine since I already have plenty of 9mm.
I'm more than satisfied with my Springfield and Ruger pistols. I wasn't a fan of the glocks grip but really like the sigs.
I'll check out the federal hp if I ever run low on my speer gold dot.

 

[ksmithaz1]

High Point? Really?

Get a Glock, a Sig, or even a Beretta...

Didn't know Glock or Sig made a carbine.. TNW makes a 9mm survival rifle that isn't too shabby, but the sighting on it isn't that great because of the removable barrel. I own a Hi-Point compact 9mm as well, A good tote if you just want something to throw in the toolbox just in case. https://www.amazon.com/Pallas-L-Neil-Smith/dp/1604504757 An interesting perspective if you've not read it. Nothing wrong with owning a really nice piece, but a clunky one that works levels the playing field just the same.

If there is something out there I'm up against that I need a .50cal for I'm running the other way.

 

[MurphyGuy]

Not a pistol high point, the carbine since I already have plenty of 9mm.
I'm more than satisfied with my Springfield and Ruger pistols. I wasn't a fan of the glocks grip but really like the sigs.
I'll check out the federal hp if I ever run low on my speer gold dot.

I wouldn't go plinking with Federal anything, its a premium ammo with premium performance at a premium price. Its what I load in my self defense weapons.

When I shoot for recreation, I'll burn anything that's cheap.

But if your life depends on it, then load the Federal.. Even their cheap ammo is better than the higher end of the cheap brands.

And if you want something even better than Federal, then use Hornady. But make sure you're sitting down when you see the price.

I shoot Hornady 12ga 300gn SST slugs out of a rifled barrel when deer hunting. Holy Smokes Batman.. Its like using a high powered rifle. 2000 Feet per Second and "beer can" accurate out to almost 300 yards. (although I don't ever shoot that far when hunting).

 

[MurphyGuy]

Didn't know Glock or Sig made a carbine.. TNW makes a 9mm survival rifle that isn't too shabby, but the sighting on it isn't that great because of the removable barrel. I own a Hi-Point compact 9mm as well, A good tote if you just want something to throw in the toolbox just in case. https://www.amazon.com/Pallas-L-Neil-Smith/dp/1604504757 An interesting perspective if you've not read it. Nothing wrong with owning a really nice piece, but a clunky one that works levels the playing field just the same.

If there is something out there I'm up against that I need a .50cal for I'm running the other way.

Oops.. Didn't know you guys were talking carbines... sorry about that.. I didn't read the whole thread.

 

[42OhmsPA]

I wouldn't go plinking with Federal anything, its a premium ammo with premium performance at a premium price. Its what I load in my self defense weapons.

That's what I assumed you were talking about.... Just like I won't go plinking with the gold dot...

When I shoot for recreation, I'll burn anything that's cheap.

Yup, same here.

Enough phone time, gotta go spray my weedway so I can see the stones again and hopefully liberate a few ground hogs in the process, they love lead this time of year.

 

[EastTexCowboy]

I agree on cheap ammo for plinking. I'm not going to waste high dollar rounds for that, even if there is a little more cleanup on the guns. I have quite a few flavors of Federal and some Hornady and a few other decent brands plus a lot of the low end stuff for plinking, etc. For my EDC and any of the loaded pistols in vehicles or elsewhere they're all loaded with Liberty Civil Defense ammo. In 9mm it's a 50 grain deep hollow point jacketed and serrated copper bullet. 2000+ fps fragmenting bullet that is extremely accurate and devastating to ballistic gel and the stuff you're simulating with ballistic gel. In one test shooting water jugs some of the fragments were peeling off, exiting the water jug and entering the adjacent water jug. I really wouldn't want to be shot with anything again but definitely not one of these. It's not what you want for shooting at a bad guy inside a vehicle but inside my home or anywhere else that's close quarters it's exactly what I want. Works darn well for shooting snakes at a decent distance too. Just shoot an inch or two low. The bullet fragments when it hits the ground and it's almost like a mini shotgun round. I'm a fair pistol shot but I'll take any edge I can get. ?